No worries on that - the comments so far should give you an edge on knowing what the end
results should be and what to check for. Table setup isn't rocket science.
Checking the Setup
- Thread starter CompuPool
- Start date
No worries on that - the comments so far should give you an edge on knowing what the end
results should be and what to check for. Table setup isn't rocket science.
Disrespect isn't part of my schtick, Donny. If given the chance to watch a known "Master Mechanic" work I'd take it in a New York minute. People that are good at what they do are a pleasure to watch and are usually fine with it as long as the watcher is not in the way. In this particular case I don't know what level of skill my mechanic has and I'd like to know how I can judge their level of expertise while they're doing the job.
I have no intention of "getting in the way" or being "annoying". I'm hoping to pick up a few tips here that will give me confidence in these guys. As it is they could put the table together upside down and I may be none the wiser.
If a player said to you "I'm a great player and I'm going to run the table 10 times but you can't watch me." what are you going to think? You come back and the table is empty. Perhaps this isn't quite the analogy that I want but you get the idea.
There's no disrespect here. I admire the guys that are good at what they do but if the good ones and the bad ones all look the same, who do you hire?
Thanks
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Well, you could probably move back and open shop. Even the neighbor islands are without competition. Kauai... Maui... The Big Island... There's probably no tables on Niihau so you'll just have to go diving there.
When were you over here? I didn't see ya. lol
I first came here when there was no H1 and no International airport so that probably dates me. Just a snot nosed Air Force kid.
I'm committed to the dealer here for the setup and the table. As I said, they're the only game in town unless you count the old guy that sells the $1000 imports out of his "showroom" with the chickens on the partially assembled tables. The guy looks like David Carradine from Kungfu. He told me to "Not think too much." Just tell him how much I wanted to spend and he'd sell me a table for that price. Clever business guy.
Thanks for your kind responses, Craig.
I lived there 90 -1997 Played darts down At moose mcgilicuttys, The Shack Hawaii kai, Bullseye's I didnt start playing pool until 1995 I was a true rookie then but a master dart player. I goodgo on&on.
Make sure they use...
1. level frame
2. square up slates to frame
3. machinist level is used
4. bondo for the seams
5. no bubbles or puckers in cloth rails and bed.
6. rails are straight and square use a string from cross corner to cross corner should be same measurement if square if not re square them up
7. all for corner pockets should be the same size if square not an 1/8 or 1/4" difference but damm close to the same unless rails are cut wrong from factory and it happens.
forgot roll a ball on the slates with out cloth but when level several times with just enough speed to almost get to the other side look for rolls and sounds of it speeding up or slowing down. try it 20-30 times in every direction so if it looks real good then it will be perfect when the cloth goes on some tiny rolls are from cloth and out of round balls.
other then that read some of Realkingcobra post and stickies on top
Best of Luck to ya,
Craig
Make sure they use...
1. level frame
2. square up slates to frame
3. machinist level is used
4. bondo for the seams
5. no bubbles or puckers in cloth rails and bed.
6. rails are straight and square use a string from cross corner to cross corner should be same measurement if square if not re square them up
7. all for corner pockets should be the same size if square not an 1/8 or 1/4" difference but damm close to the same unless rails are cut wrong from factory and it happens.
forgot roll a ball on the slates with out cloth but when level several times with just enough speed to almost get to the other side look for rolls and sounds of it speeding up or slowing down. try it 20-30 times in every direction so if it looks real good then it will be perfect when the cloth goes on some tiny rolls are from cloth and out of round balls.
other then that read some of Realkingcobra post and stickies on top
Best of Luck to ya,
Craig
Thanks for the tips, Craig. I greatly appreciate it. Sounds like a pretty good bunch of stuff to be watchin'. I'll have to think about how to ingratiate myself with the guys when they come to do the job so I can ask questions and not seem too intrusive. I'm getting the Brunswick Centennial Package from them as well so I'll have balls aplenty anyway. :wink:
Nuts Is Us is on Kapiolani down by the BMW dealership.
And, yep, Waipahu Racket is still there. They just need you to come over and it will be like old times.
A lot has changed here since you were prowling. Needless to say it's more expensive and more crowded. Jeremy Harris did a lot as mayor to make the Waikiki area look good. There are still the controversies about how big and how far from the beaches the hotels can be. The Ko Olino area to the west of Kapolei is being developed as West Waikiki. Disney is going in there with a resort but not a park. Lots of golfing all over the place.
Sandy Beach hasn't changed much and North Shore is still the surf mecca that it always was. Lots of one car accidents with guys watchin' the bikini clad bottoms and smashing into things. Ya gotta love it.
Same Ole Same Ole...
Jerry
when its all done I forgot close your eyes and lightly run your finger print over the point of the cusion where the ball touches down to the other point you should not feel any dimples or wavyness inward or outword inward to tight bubblesand puckers mean its to loose.
basic install slap and run under 2 hours top notch picky customer or an installer thats like perfection my take upto 4-6 hours if a used tables new should go kinda quick.
Feel free to call if you think your getting shafted and I ll have a old friend Call Brian and tell come dis my wife's cousin cant your guys do better. sometimes it works only a phone call.
Craig 916-825-2036
basic install slap and run under 2 hours top notch picky customer or an installer thats like perfection my take upto 4-6 hours if a used tables new should go kinda quick.
Feel free to call if you think your getting shafted and I ll have a old friend Call Brian and tell come dis my wife's cousin cant your guys do better. sometimes it works only a phone call.
Craig 916-825-2036
Thanks again, Craig.
The guy from the pro shop at Brian's said that it would take about "6" hours to complete so either it will be a professional job or they'll be on Hawaii Crack Seed time.
The idea about the phone call is good. I like that one and have had 'cause to use it myself a few times. It's surprising that "who you know" makes so much difference in what you get over here. I've been in Hawaii so long that I don't know if it's any other way anywhere in the world.
Jerry
Another question for you, Craig, if you don't mind.
It's been suggested to me here on this forum and elsewhere that I go with the Simonis 860 felt on this 9 footer. I'm assuming that the mechanics can make this change to my order at any time prior to setup.
In your opinion is it that much better and a good investment relative to the Olhausen felt? After all my Googling I'm thinking that it probably is.
What's your opinion considering that this isn't a classic Brunswick table (your favorites) and those of us that will be playing on it are amateurs "with aspirations" to becoming reasonably good players?
You should be fine with either one if you where playing alot of tournaments nightly and gambling on 860 then switch other then that you are fine with the original cloth. If you pl;ay once in a while all cloths will last along time plus if you have alot of newbie get the training out and the screw ups then change to 860 thats when its worth the extra money.
Craig
Craig
The Newbie thing makes a lot of sense to me. That could be a bit rough on the cloth. Maybe somewhere down the road, when they're off to college...
Thank Craig.
Jerry
If i were you i'd ask them there techniques before hand because once they are there its to late.
I think the most important things to ask would be
1 - do they use machinists level
2 - do they superglue seams
3 - what do they use to seal seams
If they answer correctly to those three questions the rest should be fine. If they don't request them ahead of time so they are prepared on arrival.
I think the most important things to ask would be
1 - do they use machinists level
2 - do they superglue seams
3 - what do they use to seal seams
If they answer correctly to those three questions the rest should be fine. If they don't request them ahead of time so they are prepared on arrival.
Is that OK to do, Jim? I mean the cost of the setup is included in the cost of the table. Sure, it'd be great if they did it right the first time but the flip side is that they're obligated by the relationship with Olhausen to do it right or risk their distributorship. If the setup fails in levelness evenness and tightness of cloth, pucker and ripple free, etc they're obligated to keep coming back until it's right anyway. Sure. That's a more time consuming way to get the desired end result but they have to get there.
Do you think it's better for me to call 'em and say "Are you going to use a machinist's level...etc..." so they have a heads up? It's a thought for sure and may save everyone some trouble if they know up front that I know what a good setup is (even though I don't but I'm learning thanks to all of you).
Thanks
Jerry
I would just try to feel them out ...and it's hard to be tactful but you need to just probe them a bit .....i.e. get them talking about how they do the setup and what all is involved ...say you are just very interested in how it is done and the details should come as you talk to them .....I wouldn't say "DO YOU USE A MACHINIST LEVEL" as the start of my conversation ....I would probe them and if they offer something up ...like say they say we start by leveling the frame then the slates ....say; "what kind of tools do you use to do that" then they say "a level" and you say is it a special pool table level ...and they say " it's a machinist level" .....then when they say then they set the seams ..you say ..."oh what do you use to do that?" and they say: "bondo" ....
so there are tactful ways of getting info ...because if they know you are pain in the ass from the beginning they will either do the best job they have ever done or they will try to be a bigger pain in your ass .....
i also would question the importance of superglue on the seams ....i know it's a step ...but I think the things I outlined would be most important .....
btw....bondo is great but it smells nasty and will destroy your hands for a few days if you don't wear gloves .....just sayin ...i know it's the right way to do it....but the stuff is nasty..
and the 3m-10 ....very nasty ...I hope RKC and 3m get a less toxic formula in the works ...
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Guessing there's 1 Olhausen dealer there so to keep the warranty valid the dealer has to do the setup. There's no requirement to use bondo, super glue or a machinist level altho these are the preferred tools and materials to use. Which leaves the question - who are you going to get for the install if this dealership doesn't have all the magic answers? Would you cancel the sale if the dealer doesn't or refuses to use bondo. Like I said previously, if they have been doing this for 30 years I would think they can set a table up to play correctly. If not, your recourse is to complain to the dealer and/or Olhausen.
The only problem with that is, in general, they either know how to do a good job, or they don't. Giving them a heads up ahead of time that you know what a good job is doesn't guarantee you will get one. If they don't use a machinist level/bondo/super glue, they certainly not going to go out and get the stuff to do the job the way you want it done.
Knowing your quality of work, if you got that call, would your first reaction be "Wow, this guy knows his stuff, I better do a good job this time" or "Wow, this guy is going to be a pain in the ass"
You're still going to do the job you do either way, but you're going into the situation with bad expectations already. I agree that there are more tactful ways to get the info you want. Maybe if there were competition in the area your approach would be better. Get down to the point before you get the guy in your house so you know what you're paying for. But in this situation that installer is coming to do the job either way, so you're better off to let him do his job the way he does it. If you're not happy with the results, Olhausen is a great company for backing their product and doing what it takes to make their customers happy.
Well Matteroner, Dartman and Josh...
Thanks for the ideas and thoughts.
Yeah. I'm not sure what kind of job these guys are known for but I'm not going into this expecting the worst or that I'll have to ride herd on them. I'm sure that it's going to be a great learning experience for me no matter how it goes. I'd prefer seeing a Master Mechanic and I may very well get that opportunity.
Tact goes a long way and I have a great deal of that and the ability to smooze my way around people.
I do have a question about protocol with tipping that I'd like some input on.
The situation here in Hawaii is that the table has to be shipped in from Tennessee. That means by truck across the mainland and then by boat. The cost of that is around $1000 just to get it here. I'm paying about $5600 for the table including the additional cost of shipping. This is the Olhausen Portland Hampton and the way Olhausen does it, the dealers tell you the price. (Yeah, cherry wood and more decorative rails so the cost goes up a few hundred) I really don't know what the table sells for elsewhere without the shipping cost. I suspect this is all ballpark with the extra expenses factored in. Then I have the Bruswick Centennial package for an additional $740 and the tax on top of it all. You get the idea.
So, back to tipping. I like to tip for a job well done and a congenial person doing the work. I have no problem with providing some beverage and snacks to the crew either. What is considered a fair tip for a good job? Basing it on a percentage would see a bit much considering the shipping etc.
I appreciate you guys.
Thanks
Jerry
Thanks for the ideas and thoughts.
Yeah. I'm not sure what kind of job these guys are known for but I'm not going into this expecting the worst or that I'll have to ride herd on them. I'm sure that it's going to be a great learning experience for me no matter how it goes. I'd prefer seeing a Master Mechanic and I may very well get that opportunity.
Tact goes a long way and I have a great deal of that and the ability to smooze my way around people.
I do have a question about protocol with tipping that I'd like some input on.
The situation here in Hawaii is that the table has to be shipped in from Tennessee. That means by truck across the mainland and then by boat. The cost of that is around $1000 just to get it here. I'm paying about $5600 for the table including the additional cost of shipping. This is the Olhausen Portland Hampton and the way Olhausen does it, the dealers tell you the price. (Yeah, cherry wood and more decorative rails so the cost goes up a few hundred) I really don't know what the table sells for elsewhere without the shipping cost. I suspect this is all ballpark with the extra expenses factored in. Then I have the Bruswick Centennial package for an additional $740 and the tax on top of it all. You get the idea.
So, back to tipping. I like to tip for a job well done and a congenial person doing the work. I have no problem with providing some beverage and snacks to the crew either. What is considered a fair tip for a good job? Basing it on a percentage would see a bit much considering the shipping etc.
I appreciate you guys.
Thanks
Jerry
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Well Carl, I guess it came down to several things as I understood them.
One is that my wife, who is the better player between us (many years in Australia living around the pros), wanted a piece of furniture that suited her tastes and a decent table as well.
For a purist that would be a sacrilege but I don't mind her being happy with the choice. :smile: The truth is that the Tiffany lights probably are less than what a pro would want as well.Another is that to my knowledge there are no Diamond distributors here. Having someone local standing behind the product is a plus. Hawaii Brians is the only game in town for tables with a manufacturer's blessing.
Another is that in the home/gameroom market Olhausen has a good reputation. Maybe they're not for the pros but I don't think they're trying to be. From everything I've read they're of quality woodmanship (ie. beautiful furniture) and a good table as well.
It's a trade off.
Jerry