Commentating...........one Sided

$TAKE HOR$E

$TAKE HOR$E

champagne - campaign
Silver Member
I just got done watching the Shane and Alex race to 100 and imo that Ken that was doing the commentating was completly one sided against Shane. I mean it really doesnt matter i guess but it was almost like he really wanted Alex to win. I remember one time when he said " the 7 & 9 is dead in the side because we wouldnt want him to have anything tough", and "naturally the balls stop the cue ball from scratching". Also almost everytime Shane had a runout it was always " just connect the dots" and whenever Alex was up it was all real tough. He aslo did this in the Kirkwood and Schmidt match. I know everyone always has a player they want to win but c'mon you gotta be a neutral commentator. Great job by TAR by the way on all their matches so far, keep it up.
 
I'll tell you something funny about that match. I had several bets on Shane to win, and about halfway thru the second day, TAR asked me to sit in the booth. This is exactly when Alex started his great comeback to cut a 22 game deficit to seven I believe, at the end of the day.

I got so caught up in the match that I forgot all about my bet. It was the first time I ever saw Shane get noticeably weak, and Alex started playing super pool. I was actually a little excited to see Alex mount this amazing comeback when he looked totally buried. I guess I'm still just a pool fanatic. :smile:
 
I agree with you. Ken I guess is a straight pool man and his fawning over John Schmidt or Schmitty is just a little over board for me. THough Ken does add some good pool observations but when he gets in the booth with Bill Marsopolis it sounds like the movie "Little Darlings" when they gush over a Rob Lowe. And Schumann yelling out "NICE SHOT, JOHN!" just reaffirms that.
Ken seemed to not have done his research on Kirkwood. He needs to do more of that. But all in all I respect the mans knowledge of the game. And I respect TARs work.
 
i had a pile bet on SVB in one of his matches with one of the guys in the booth, you would never know he was losing thousands or even had a bet by listining to his commentary. He is a pro like Jay nuetral no matter what.


I had almost 5 bags bet on K-Wood the other night and Ken didnt know his mi was hot and I heard him stand up and clap for JS, and at least 2 other times poke his head of the booth to show support for JS, he said into the mic once "I'm give JS a clap" or some acknolegment I dont know the exact words. When ever K-wood was playing down the home steach Ken said very little about K-wood, when it was JS's shot he got all chatty. I asked him via PM to make a bet giving him JS when it was clear JS was gonna win, he replyed "No, Fatboy i'm just trying to make it fun for the people at home" Fair enough I had just lost so much $$$ I wanted to give more away.

Am I mad at Ken, No absolulently not, can I spell no cant do that either. I think its poor form for anyone who is commentating other than family to ne on one side or the other. Commentators job is to make it "Make it fun for the people at home" Ken is 100% correct. I admire his passion for what he is doing-I just dont like the fact that he picks a side.

gotta go to be continurd
 
I agree that a professional commentator should remain neutral; however, I don't believe that TAR is paying people to commentate, but depending on volunteers who want to do the job, which is absolutely fine.

When judging the performance of a volunteer commentator, probably with no experience, I don't think you can fault them for a lack of professionalism because they are not professionals.

I know that nobody used those exact words; however, that is what is really being alluded to.
 
JDB said:
I agree that a professional commentator should remain neutral; however, I don't believe that TAR is paying people to commentate, but depending on volunteers who want to do the job, which is absolutely fine.

When judging the performance of a volunteer commentator, probably with no experience, I don't think you can fault them for a lack of professionalism because they are not professionals.

I know that nobody used those exact words; however, that is what is really being alluded to.
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Hey man, I got a T-Shirt. :wink:
 
jay helfert said:
Hey man, I got a T-Shirt. :wink:
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I think using volunteers is very smart on TAR's part and great. Nothing wrong with that.

I just don't think that you can critique a volunteer and compare them to professional commentators. It isn't fair to the volunteers. JMO.
 
JDB said:
I think using volunteers is very smart on TAR's part and great. Nothing wrong with that.

I just don't think that you can critique a volunteer and compare them to professional commentators. It isn't fair to the volunteers. JMO.
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Youre right about volunteers but people are PAYING for it. So wether they get money or not that has nothing to do with the PAYER. So I ask you is it "fair" to the fan who is paying for it?
I admire Ken for doing it gratis and on his own dime. But take the "Sleeve" for example. Although he was partial to a player he still kept his emotions in check and could laugh about himself.
THis is all part of constructive criticism. Otherwise the show was perfect.
 
I agree that a commentator should remain neutral when fans are paying to see an event. I don't think anybody here is bashing Ken. I think we would all agree he does a great job breaking down situations for the viewer.

However, it is quite obvious which competitor Ken is pulling for in every match he's worked. Close to half, if not more, of your viewing audience will take offense to this. I still think Ken does the job pretty well. The hope here is that he will see this criticism and use it to his benefit. He will be an even better commentator if he takes the advice given here.
 
yobagua said:
Youre right about volunteers but people are PAYING for it. So wether they get money or not that has nothing to do with the PAYER. So I ask you is it "fair" to the fan who is paying for it?
I admire Ken for doing it gratis and on his own dime. But take the "Sleeve" for example. Although he was partial to a player he still kept his emotions in check and could laugh about himself.
THis is all part of constructive criticism. Otherwise the show was perfect.
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I understand what you are saying about paying for it; however, think about the price you are paying... not much. Now think if they hired people to do the commentating and how much more you would pay.

Some of the people who commentate are going to be better than others and be able to keep their bias in check, others will not do as good of a job...
 
Another thing with all commentators not just Ken is, you always know they will be criticizing the players shots. I mean its always great to her them say "oh thats no good" or "they hit that to hard or to soft". Most of the time the player ends up perfect or just barely out of line which imo makes them sound pretty ridiculous. I guess thats why they are in the booth's and not on the table.
 
$TAKE HOR$E said:
Another thing with all commentators not just Ken is, you always know they will be criticizing the players shots. I mean its always great to her them say "oh thats no good" or "they hit that to hard or to soft". Most of the time the player ends up perfect or just barely out of line which imo makes them sound pretty ridiculous. I guess thats why they are in the booth's and not on the table.
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I was just watching the Harriman and Schmidt One Pocket Dvd, and I got to agree with you. Ken clapped every game JS won!!! I understand that he is volunteering and all, but man, that is a bit out of line, especially when you know the match is being recorded and DVDs are going to be produced. Now don't get me wrong, I am all for TAR, but I do think this is an issue that will need to be addressed at some point in their future. Also, I'm not sure how knowledgeable the commentators were on One Hole, because they called a lot of the wrong shots and made some weird predictions. Again, just constructive criticism. Keep up the good work TAR!!!!!:thumbup:
 
Thanks for all of the feedback. We will use it to make a better product.

I will say one thing about commentating though: It is far from easy. Scott Frost said "This is harder than playing" and he was only half kidding. We have been very fortunate to have some great people like Ken, Fred Agnir, Jay Helfert, Bill Maropolis, Don Coats, Jeanette Lee, Bobby Hunter, and many more volunteer to do commentary. I feel that each of them brings something to the table and it may not be for everyone but they are doing it for the right reasons IMO and that is because they believe that what we are doing is good for the game.

We would love to be able to pay our commentators what they are worth and that is a goal we hope to achieve sooner rather than later. Our first match with Corey and Shane had two of the best in business with Grady and Billy and they add a great deal to the final product. They were there because Mark Griffin put up $2000 to cover the travel and give them a little something for their time. After their expenses they worked for next to nothing if you figure it on an hourly rate and we will always be greatful to them for that.

We have been at this for right at a year and learn every time we do an event. Something that really struck me as I look back at that year is how many events we have done all over the country.

Louisville x 2
Reno
Vegas
LA
KC X 5
Sioux Falls

If we had to pay $2000 per event for commentators that is a smooth $22K.

One of the big positives to using volunteers in the booth (besides being priced right :D) is that they bring a variety to the commentary. Some of them even have become hits like The Sleeve. We will probably end up doing more of the commentary ourselves in the future for better or worse just because we can't expect people to keep giving up their time for no compensation. The players are always very helpful but is difficult for them to do much at a tournament because they are in it themselves and sometimes the only players at a challenge match are on the table. We will do our best to improve.

We appreciate everyone for sticking with us even when there is someone in the box you may not like. We will take your input on board try to provide a better product in the future.
 
You make some really good points Justin and I dont think anyone dislikes anyone in the box, but are trying to add some input on things. You guys have done a great job and I think you have brought a part of pool to lots of people that they did not know existed.
 
$TAKE HOR$E said:
Another thing with all commentators not just Ken is, you always know they will be criticizing the players shots. I mean its always great to her them say "oh thats no good" or "they hit that to hard or to soft". Most of the time the player ends up perfect or just barely out of line which imo makes them sound pretty ridiculous. I guess thats why they are in the booth's and not on the table.
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I never missed a ball in the booth! :grin:
 
Anytime I watch people match up in person, comments are usually one sided. I like the volunteers commentary. Its more realistic than some of the pool on tv. In my opinion, it feels more like you are there. The only problem is from my couch, I can only yell at the TV! People annoy me all the time in the pool room with silly comments! You just gotta blow it off..
 
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