Cue Prices

[Brain71]

Hi, I'm relatively new here (on this forum anyway), and I just wanted to say that prices are getting rediculous. I just seen a "sugartree" sneaky pete on the wanted/for sale forum for $800. Rediculous!! A plain jane sneaky pete! I'm not talking bad about whomever is selling the cue or the cue maker. I'm sure both are extremely reputable people. I just think prices are going way overboard nowadays. It's getting to the point that you're just buying the name and not the cue. $1500 for a plain jane bluegrass cue? I know they're supposed to be hard to get and that there is a waiting list for his cues but my god! Be paitent, they go on ebay all the time. Even if I could afford to collect cues I think I would still complain about these crazy prices. Like I said I'm in no way bashing anyone who sells cues or makes them. I'm guilty of paying a little more than I should have on a couple of cues myself. After seeing that sneaky pete for $800, I just felt like I had to say something.

 

[ridewiththewind]

Hi, I'm relatively new here (on this forum anyway), and I just wanted to say that prices are getting rediculous. I just seen a "sugartree" sneaky pete on the wanted/for sale forum for $800. Rediculous!! A plain jane sneaky pete! I'm not talking bad about whomever is selling the cue or the cue maker. I'm sure both are extremely reputable people. I just think prices are going way overboard nowadays. It's getting to the point that you're just buying the name and not the cue. $1500 for a plain jane bluegrass cue? I know they're supposed to be hard to get and that there is a waiting list for his cues but my god! Be paitent, they go on ebay all the time. Even if I could afford to collect cues I think I would still complain about these crazy prices. Like I said I'm in no way bashing anyone who sells cues or makes them. I'm guilty of paying a little more than I should have on a couple of cues myself. After seeing that sneaky pete for $800, I just felt like I had to say something.

Brain (is it really Brain?)....often times cue prices are driven here by what I have fondly coined the "Cue du Jour Syndrome". In other words, that cuemaker which is currently enjoying a great deal of hype, thereby driving up demand, while supplies are low. It changes cuemakers from year to year, but that is the gist of it. Several years ago, Zylr cues was enjoying a similar condition....now those cues are back down to within a reasonable level. The BlueGrass cues go up and down, as RH opens and closes his orders list. I suspect the same will be true as Eric gets more of his orders completed, and those who got into the 'game' early enough flip them over for the quick, big buck.

This is not to say that these makers have not earned their reputation...far be it from me to say one way or another, as I have owned none-of-the-above.....precisely because the entire make money off of a cuemakers' work really tends to turn me off. I prefer to deal with makers directly, as when I order a cue, it is not to resell....or for it's potential resell value, but to actually PLAY with.

There are many fine cuemakers out there who have not been subjected to all the hype, who craft a cue that is very likely every bit as good a player as the makers who are being dealt like they are on the commodities market.

My best advice as to how to deal with this....trust me, I think some of the pricing is a bit whacked myself....is to stay true to yourself, and to get what YOU like, from a cuemaker that YOU would be comfortable with. YOU are the only person you have to please in the long haul.

In the end, the entire flipping market will all come crashing down like a house of cards, and only those makers who have earned their reputation for crafting a fine playing quality cue, with excellent customer service, will be the ones left remained standing.

Lisa

 

[Koop]

In the end, the entire flipping market will all come crashing down like a house of cards, and only those makers who have earned their reputation for crafting a fine playing quality cue, with excellent customer service, will be the ones left remained standing.

Lisa

Snipped for these words of wisdom. Well put Lisa and couldn't agree more.

Koop

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

Brain (is it really Brain?)....often times cue prices are driven here by what I have fondly coined the "Cue du Jour Syndrome". In other words, that cuemaker which is currently enjoying a great deal of hype, thereby driving up demand, while supplies are low. It changes cuemakers from year to year, but that is the gist of it. Several years ago, Zylr cues was enjoying a similar condition....now those cues are back down to within a reasonable level. The BlueGrass cues go up and down, as RH opens and closes his orders list. I suspect the same will be true as Eric gets more of his orders completed, and those who got into the 'game' early enough flip them over for the quick, big buck.

This is not to say that these makers have not earned their reputation...far be it from me to say one way or another, as I have owned none-of-the-above.....precisely because the entire make money off of a cuemakers' work really tends to turn me off. I prefer to deal with makers directly, as when I order a cue, it is not to resell....or for it's potential resell value, but to actually PLAY with.

There are many fine cuemakers out there who have not been subjected to all the hype, who craft a cue that is very likely every bit as good a player as the makers who are being dealt like they are on the commodities market.

My best advice as to how to deal with this....trust me, I think some of the pricing is a bit whacked myself....is to stay true to yourself, and to get what YOU like, from a cuemaker that YOU would be comfortable with. YOU are the only person you have to please in the long haul.

In the end, the entire flipping market will all come crashing down like a house of cards, and only those makers who have earned their reputation for crafting a fine playing quality cue, with excellent customer service, will be the ones left remained standing.

Lisa

Lisa, and may I add right now I feel the cue Market is SOFT, and there are a lot of GREAT BUYS out there now with the ecomoney in the

 

[Brain71]

It's really Brian. I've been called Brain (or worse) for years. I agree with everything you have said. My point really is (and again I'm not bashing the cue maker or anyone), if you look at the cue I mentioned it looks like he took a bar cue, put it on his lathe. Cut it down, made a new shaft, put a joint pin in and joint collars and signed his name or put his mark on it and decided to sell it for $800 or whatever. Which to me is crazy. How many "sneaky pete's" has anyone seen out there that are the exact same? Other than the woods? I personally have seen well over a hundred. Which goes back to what I said before, you're buying the name and not the cue. I know the game. Buy a blank, in this case a full splice sneaky blank. Core it, put a joint pin in it, joint collars. Put you name and/or mark on it and sell it. That to me is not cue making, rather cue assembling. And I know who they are. Sorry for the rant, once again I'm not bashing anyone making, buying, or selling cues. I just want to see everyone getting what they paid for. I really and truly believe that cue making is the highest form of art.

 

[Murray Tucker]

if you look at the cue I mentioned it looks like he took a bar cue, put it on his lathe. Cut it down, made a new shaft, put a joint pin in and joint collars and signed his name or put his mark on it and decided to sell it for $800 or whatever.

You can't blame the cuemaker for the secondary market pricing.

However I do believe that cue prices in general are too cheap. I have $4200.00 (in 1998 money not including my air line tickets, rental car, hotel, etc) invested in the stock on my shotgun. I would be willing to bet that my stock maker has less time and materials invested than a comparable $4200 cue.

 

[ridewiththewind]

You can't blame the cuemaker for the secondary market pricing.

However I do believe that cue prices in general are too cheap. I have $4200.00 (in 1998 money not including my air line tickets, rental car, hotel, etc) invested in the stock on my shotgun. I would be willing to bet that my stock maker has less time and materials invested than a comparable $4200 cue.

I agree Murray....which was my point...the cuemaker does not have a whole bunch of control over what happens on the secondary market. I have never held a cuemaker at fault for some of the craziness that follows, with regards to pricing. Do I feel that some asking prices are a little whacko?...sure, but then there are others where in my opinion, the pricing just isn't high enough for the amount of work and/or quality of the cue being offered. It's just a big ol' can o' worms!

Lisa

 

[JoeyInCali]

You can't blame the cuemaker for the secondary market pricing.

However I do believe that cue prices in general are too cheap. I have $4200.00 (in 1998 money not including my air line tickets, rental car, hotel, etc) invested in the stock on my shotgun. I would be willing to bet that my stock maker has less time and materials invested than a comparable $4200 cue.

Yeah but we have better groupies.

 

[ridewiththewind]

Yeah but we have better groupies.

LoL! I bet you guys do!!

Lisa

 

[Murray Tucker]

Yeah but we have better groupies.

Maybe in Cali. Where I live there is only 80yr. old blue hairs.

 

[gmcole]

Actually I think that quality cues are underpriced. I have 2-3 sets of golf clubs that were all in excess of $1000. Theses were all top , hyped up clubs. Nobody would take trade ins when I bought new ones every couple yrs. I would be hard pressed to get $300 for any of the sets. On top of all that, I spend about $4-6000 a year to belong to the country club. Do you want to even talk about boating,camping etc.? Come on guys, we have one of the cheapest hobbies/sports out there. If you buy cues smart, it's hard to get hurt to bad. all IMHO of coarse.
-jeff

 

[TripXQ]

cue pricing

Cue pricing is a very touchy subject. Custom work is more than just assembling. Many reasonable forearm blanks (from the top builders) can run $150 or more with multiple tight veneers and perfect points. That's why the best builders build their own. Figure in the rest of the materials, ivory, precious metals, gemstones, pearl or shell inlay pieces and etc. Runs you up and over $300-$400 easily. Now how much will you pay for the design hours for that great looking artwork you have in mind? How many bad ideas don't make it to the cue but end up in trash? Some drawings look good on paper or the monitor but translate poorly to the truncated cue cone shape.

OK, you have a design you think will work, and all the pieces in hand. Now put it together so that it balances properly, is structurally sound for a 'lifetime', and plays the way the customer wants. Not so simple. Those are some of the reasons custom work can and does cost, IMO. Oh yes, I almost forgot the cost of keeping up equipment in the best condition. Builders are businesses and there are many costs that are transparent to the buyer (utilities, phones, internet, rents, insurance and etc. to name several).

The best builders keep quality "consistently" high and can command high prices. It all takes time and as you know, time is money. You are welcome to visit my website and see some of my work. Maybe something there will spark some interest.

http://www.triplecrosscues.com

I look forward to discussing this further. We all want to build better cues and there needs to be better communication IMO.
Tom Gedris, Triple Cross Cues

 

[RoyL]

Hi, I'm relatively new here (on this forum anyway), and I just wanted to say that prices are getting rediculous. I just seen a "sugartree" sneaky pete on the wanted/for sale forum for $800. Rediculous!!

If you think that's expensive, then you'd really cringe if you saw the prices for a Gus Szamboti jump cue or a Balabushka sneaky pete. But I guess if serious collectors are willing to pay the prices for these rare cues then that's capitalism at work.

From reading Eric's posts on EPT, I get the feeling that he's never going to compromise his principles and crank out more cues to meet the demand; so using the supply/demand argument, $800 for a sneaky might be a bargain in a few years for the die hard collectors.

 

[Cuaba]

I Agree

Lisa, and may I add right now I feel the cue Market is SOFT, and there are a lot of GREAT BUYS out there now with the ecomoney in the

Now is the time to buy. Many nice cues are selling cheaper than they should right now. Just look at Wanted/For Sale here on AZ. The weak economy is being overblown in an election year.

The growing popularity of pool overseas, and the weak dollar will create an export market that will start sucking up the good cues. I've already seen it in other collector items.

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

Now is the time to buy. Many nice cues are selling cheaper than they should right now. Just look at Wanted/For Sale here on AZ. The weak economy is being overblown in an election year.

The growing popularity of pool overseas, and the weak dollar will create an export market that will start sucking up the good cues. I've already seen it in other collector items.

Above.

I wonder if Brain71 has ever visited a Cuemakers and seen the equipment, and supplies in their shop. Most Cuemakes shops i have ben to have what I would consider a small fortune invested in equiptment. This all ads to the cost of doing business, and cue building.

Plus if Brain71 understood the toxic substance most cuemakers work with that takes more than a 25 CENT Dust Mast to protect themselves from. More safety equiptment to by as breathing stuff like Cocobolo dust does wonderful thing to one health.

Brain71 let me make a suggestion, try and visit a cuemakers shop, and see what is involved in the cue building process. Se what thay have in equiptment, and supplies.

 

[ridewiththewind]

Guys, guys.....I believe he has already tried to clarify that he is not referring to primary purchase pricing direct from the cuemaker. I thought he made that clear from his OP...but perhaps not. That was MY perception of it, anyway.

He is commenting on the secondary market pricing of cues...why some are more and some are just what would be perceived as down-right ridiculous, given what he feels you are getting for the money. He was referencing to a cue that is pretty much a 'sneaky pete' style, that in all likelihood, was crafted from a pre-made blank, commanding the price it is commanding.

I am not sure that he was even referencing the secondary pricing of 'collectible' cues...as that is a totally different animal altogether.

Lisa

 

[tpdtom]

IMHO, the thing is, you can get a gorgeous Olney 6 point cue that is absolutely PERFECT for well under $1000, or a superb Hill or Dayton sneaky with a few extras for well under $500. Currently, a Sugartree will cost you more, but you have other choices. It's up to you to decide. I like to get the biggest bang for my buck, but my cues resale definitely cannot compete with the really hot cues like a Bluegrass or a ST. I like to find the cuemakers that are underappreciated, until they get discovered, if they do. Again, you have to decide, and there are hundreds of choices, including many bargain basement prices on some quality cues. Then there are the few that are at the top of the scale pricewise...Tom

 

[starburst]

Some of the cues might be overpriced but as long as I have fun doing the thing I like..that's no money can buy...

 

[paulybatz]

Also...

Some of the cues might be overpriced but as long as I have fun doing the thing I like..that's no money can buy...

In addition, I was talking with one of the most sought after cuemakers about this topic a few weeks ago, if a cue costs say 1500, or take that sugartree sneaky for 800, yes very expensive for a sneaky...but if it "plays" meaning you miss less shots and is "the" cue for you...it is worth the money, if you cant shoot for worth of sh$t with the cue then its not.

Eric's cues command the money because they play, no question.

Why do some cues command more than others, it is usually due to their profound playability (or collectability or both) and that is priceless...as the cue will eventually pay for itself (or at least prorate the cost).

Which is why I always tell people, either shoot with the cue before you buy it, or have a cuemaker make a cue to "your" specs.

 

[Randy9Ball]

Brain (is it really Brain?)....often times cue prices are driven here by what I have fondly coined the "Cue du Jour Syndrome". In other words, that cuemaker which is currently enjoying a great deal of hype, thereby driving up demand, while supplies are low. It changes cuemakers from year to year, but that is the gist of it. Several years ago, Zylr cues was enjoying a similar condition....now those cues are back down to within a reasonable level. The BlueGrass cues go up and down, as RH opens and closes his orders list. I suspect the same will be true as Eric gets more of his orders completed, and those who got into the 'game' early enough flip them over for the quick, big buck.

This is not to say that these makers have not earned their reputation...far be it from me to say one way or another, as I have owned none-of-the-above.....precisely because the entire make money off of a cuemakers' work really tends to turn me off. I prefer to deal with makers directly, as when I order a cue, it is not to resell....or for it's potential resell value, but to actually PLAY with.

There are many fine cuemakers out there who have not been subjected to all the hype, who craft a cue that is very likely every bit as good a player as the makers who are being dealt like they are on the commodities market.

My best advice as to how to deal with this....trust me, I think some of the pricing is a bit whacked myself....is to stay true to yourself, and to get what YOU like, from a cuemaker that YOU would be comfortable with. YOU are the only person you have to please in the long haul.

In the end, the entire flipping market will all come crashing down like a house of cards, and only those makers who have earned their reputation for crafting a fine playing quality cue, with excellent customer service, will be the ones left remained standing.

Lisa

One of the finest posts I've read here. Very well written too! Rep to you Lisa!