Cue Selection

S

Shane33

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I know this topic has been discussed . I have used the search engine on this site as well as the internet . But had a few questions .

I am going to buy a production cue because I can get it at a wholesale price . I want a Pechauer , Joss or Schon .

I know Schon is highly recommended here as well as the 2 others I mentioned . I looked at a used Schon STL 8 the other day . I believe that was the model . Anyway I could feel the rings on the butt pretty good . Is this more common than I think ?

That's not the quality I would expect . Is that a rarity ? Like most people , finding these cues local to try is not going to happen . I am a family guy , coach baseball and am to busy to go to the local pool halls and ask random strangers to try their cues .

Can any one speak to the quality of these cues that actually has bought one recently ? Like in the last year ? Also as to if you liked how it played ?

I shot with Meucci's in the past and still shoot with a sneaky on its last leg . I know its a softer hit . I have shot really good with my kids action steel joint ,12mm shaft recently . So thinking I would like the steel joints of the 3 production cues I mentioned .

Still trying to decide on 12.75mm or 12.50 but will get one or the other for sure . I know I like a longer pro taper which the Pechauer seems to have . Can anyone give me recent info on these and what they think because I am tired of looking and about to order something soon .

Thanks
 
I do not believe the ring pop is a quality issue. Metal rings pop on cues of all levels, and there are many factors to consider. A few makers I know have some knowledge of how to prevent it, but as far as I can tell, most do not. Even the very best can have ring pop issues as the cue moves from one climate to the next, especially if it's a sudden and/or severe climatic change. It's not an indication that the cue isn't made well, or that it won't play well, or that the maker does sloppy work. It doesn't mean any of those things. In most cases it's nothing but a difference in how different material shrink/swell as the climate changes. A lot of times it's merely the finish shrinking as it cures. Lots of finishes we use in cues "set up" or "harden" to the point where the cue can be polished & sent out. But the finish may continue to cure for weeks or even months, and as it does it may shrink. And that's only a couple of the factors that cause ring pop.

So no, the ring pop doesn't mean the Schon is crappy quality. They are fine cues, quite possibly the best American made Production cues. OB also makes great cues, as does Joss. IMO, if you're going production, I'd say pick one you like looking at, in the weight you like, and have a repair guy tweak it to your liking if it isn't quite right to begin with.
 
You should be happy with any of those cues, I've played with all 3, as I'm sure many on here have, they all are built well. Your main issue will be finding the right shaft and tip combination more than picking out of those 3 brands. I had a Joss made in the early 90s that just about everyone that tried it called one of the best Joss cues they ever hit with, and I've tried other Joss cues from that era and newer ones that did not hit nearly as nice as mine. Shaft wood and tip difference is what made most of the difference there.

As long as that used Schon is straight, you don't feel any odd vibrations or hear funny sounds, it will be a good cue. If someone offered me one of those 3, I'd pick the Schon.
 
Any one of those will be a giant leap over what you have now.Of the 3 you have mentioned my choice would be
#1-schon
#2-schon
#3-schon.
 
You may already be aware but metal rings don't really "pop". It is the finish and/or the wood that shrinks as that is the nature of these materials over time. Ring "popping" can happen with just about any cues with metal rings and Schon cues are certainly not any worse than average in this regard.

A couple of other thoughts. Although all three hit a good bit stiffer than the Meucci you are used to, the Pechauer is the least stiff of the three and will be closest to what you are used to. The Schon is a bit stiffer than the Pechauer, and the Joss is stiffest of the three.

All three are considered to be good quality production cues.

The Schon would be the easiest to sell down the road since it is the most popular of the three and will hold its value slightly better. Joss and Pechauer are pretty close in this regard although Joss probably has a slight edge.

As far as initial value, it is probably the exact reverse. You can get more cue at a lower cost with Pechauer followed up by Joss and Schon.

If you get a 12.75mm shaft you can always have it taken down in size a bit down the road if you end up finding that you would prefer to have it a bit smaller, but obviously the reverse is not true.

All three are great quality production cues but if I were in your shoes I would get a Pechauer with a 12.75mm shaft. Pechauers are good quality with good shaft wood, have the best production cue lifetime warranty in the business, the hit and taper is closest to what you are already used to and proficient with, and with the 12.75mm size you always still have the option to reduce the shaft size if/as needed.
 
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How are Schon cues doing now that Evan Clarke bailed and some fellow named John....probably a talented wood craftsman in his own right.......is handling things..........The evolution is from Bob & Terry to Evan to now to John?

Things may be the same as before but I'd probably be inclined to buy an older Schon and see how things go with John at the Schon helm before I would order a new Schon cue........heck, John might be the most talented cue-maker of the group.........wouldn't that be a kick.....I hope so.
 
Poolplaya9 said:
You may already be aware but metal rings don't really "pop".
Click to expand...

I'm aware that they do "pop". I have experienced it first hand with metal rings between phenolic, without finish. Just the act of polishing them can heat them up enough to swell to the point where you can feel the ledge.
 
qbilder said:
I'm aware that they do "pop". I have experienced it first hand with metal rings between phenolic, without finish. Just the act of polishing them can heat them up enough to swell to the point where you can feel the ledge.
Click to expand...

My post was intended to inform the OP about what generally causes ring "popping" the majority of the time, which is generally movement of the wood and/or finish over time (with influence from the climate or changes to the climate (temperature and humidity)). Chances are the used Schon he referred to did not have the fairly severely popped rings at the moment it was finished brand new, although as you point out it is certainly possible.
 
I work in the furniture industry. I see a lot of high end furniture I am familiar with wood movement. If it is kiln or machine dried to the proper humidity and gets to a good climate controlled environment in a timely manner then its usually good.

If it sets around in our dry whse it shrinks and the seams start showing and season splits will form. I get it . However some of the top lines can set around through whatever for years and look just like the day it came in.

If the Pechauer will be the least stiff as I am already moving from softer hitting cues then that may be my best choice.

Is the Pechauer speed joint ok ? I am not familiar with the different joints as far as actually using them. . I have read that the radial is the best. I am sure the speed joint is fine.

I have a local person that will turn down and change taper on whatever I get if I need too.
 
Poolplaya9 has some very good points especially regarding resale. I was in your position a few years ago and did a ton of research. All 3 of your options are good quality. I actually started with a cheap $50 Dufferin. Then went from a Pechauer 2006 PS-18 to an older 90's Schon, to a custom '11 Darrin Hill. Although I wish there was a formula, It really does come down to personal preference. I found the Pechauer to have a very firm hit. The Schon felt heavier with a softer hit and more feed back. The custom Hill was just right-the most feedback, a bit lighter weight providing more control. Out of your 3 I would recommend a Schon but an older one.
 
measureman said:
Any one of those will be a giant leap over what you have now.Of the 3 you have mentioned my choice would be
#1-schon
#2-schon
#3-schon.
Click to expand...

The only thing I can add to my friends recommendation here, is a Schon/Predator shaft to go along with it. Take care of it and it will out play and out last you by at least a hunnert years. :smile:
 
I know the predator shafts are popular. I did get to shoot with one for a few. Just didnt do it for me. Just going to stick with a regular shaft for now.

I know cuestix is one of the stores I can order from but they don't sell Pechauers there. Could get a cx series Schon or a JOS16 there though.

Have to see what the other places I can order from this weekend , so that may force me to go one way or the other.
 
As has been stated, you can't go wrong with any of the cues you mentioned for sure. This being said, I play with a Joss 12.25mm and love it. I like the Joss pro taper. Taper is important to me. Save yourself some money and get an entry level Joss unless your into ring work, points, inlays etc. The Schon and Pechauer entry level sticks are more expensive than the Joss entry level I believe. Also even though Joss is a big company, every time I called them, Dan Janes, the owner, answered the phone himself and he is very easy to work with if you have any questions.
 
I like the 3 choices you are down to, all great quality production cues.

The other one I'd also consider is Mezz.

Regarding what can cause ring pop, qbilder is right about woods vs metals vs other materials having different expand/contract rates in changing temps, humidity, etc.

I have a couple of cues where the metal rings go back and forth from feel-able to flush with the seasons.

best,
brian kc
 
Bavafongoul said:
How are Schon cues doing now that Evan Clarke bailed and some fellow named John....probably a talented wood craftsman in his own right.......is handling things..........The evolution is from Bob & Terry to Evan to now to John?

Things may be the same as before but I'd probably be inclined to buy an older Schon and see how things go with John at the Schon helm before I would order a new Schon cue........heck, John might be the most talented cue-maker of the group.........wouldn't that be a kick.....I hope so.
Click to expand...

Matt,

Some fellow named John?.. You're funny....John has been at Schon for a long time. There is nothing that was "physically" done that will change. They'll build the same cue build but without the attitude. No need for a "see how things go" period.
 
Shane33 said:
I work in the furniture industry. I see a lot of high end furniture I am familiar with wood movement. If it is kiln or machine dried to the proper humidity and gets to a good climate controlled environment in a timely manner then its usually good.

If it sets around in our dry whse it shrinks and the seams start showing and season splits will form. I get it . However some of the top lines can set around through whatever for years and look just like the day it came in.

If the Pechauer will be the least stiff as I am already moving from softer hitting cues then that may be my best choice.

Is the Pechauer speed joint ok ? I am not familiar with the different joints as far as actually using them. . I have read that the radial is the best. I am sure the speed joint is fine.

I have a local person that will turn down and change taper on whatever I get if I need too.
Click to expand...

I have a Pechauer break cue with their speed joint. It's held up well over a few years of breaking. All of the cues you listed have a good reputation...can't go wrong with any of them.
 
I have one of each and like them all. Love the hit on my Joss, though it is linen which I realize that I do not prefer. I will probably change it to leather. I use a Schon STL2 everyday that I did change the wrap to leather. Love it. My break is a Pechauer and I have wrapless Pechauer in cocobolo with a curly maple handle. It is very nice looking, they use great woods. It's a good player but I prefer the hit of the Joss and Schon. That's me...Bear in mind as well that the Pechauer has it's own joint and while it is very good, if you decide to experiment with LD shafts down the road, or acquire another cue the 5/16 X 14 is more common.
 
qbilder said:
I do not believe the ring pop is a quality issue. Metal rings pop on cues of all levels, and there are many factors to consider. A few makers I know have some knowledge of how to prevent it, but as far as I can tell, most do not. Even the very best can have ring pop issues as the cue moves from one climate to the next, especially if it's a sudden and/or severe climatic change. It's not an indication that the cue isn't made well, or that it won't play well, or that the maker does sloppy work. It doesn't mean any of those things. In most cases it's nothing but a difference in how different material shrink/swell as the climate changes. A lot of times it's merely the finish shrinking as it cures. Lots of finishes we use in cues "set up" or "harden" to the point where the cue can be polished & sent out. But the finish may continue to cure for weeks or even months, and as it does it may shrink. And that's only a couple of the factors that cause ring pop.

So no, the ring pop doesn't mean the Schon is crappy quality. They are fine cues, quite possibly the best American made Production cues. OB also makes great cues, as does Joss. IMO, if you're going production, I'd say pick one you like looking at, in the weight you like, and have a repair guy tweak it to your liking if it isn't quite right to begin with.
Click to expand...

What he said. +1
 
I have to figure out exactly what the discount will be because $400 is my max . But these are the cues I like from each of the 3 I am considering .

Pechauer / P03-F , P13-F , P15-F


Joss / JOS16 , 10-01B


Schon / CX33 , CX86 , STL-3


There are a couple of others but down to these for the most part . I see that some of the Schon STL series look just like some of the CX series . I know originally the CX were for Cuestix .


Can anyone tell me why the Schon cues for the most part are higher priced . What are you getting to justify the price ? The name ? These 3 companies seam to be about the same quality . I would even say you get less look for the money with Schon .

I am not ruling anything out yet but going to order within the next week or two at the most and want to nail it down a little more . That kinda older school plain jane with the ring work really appeal to me . Like the Pechauer P03-F and the Schon STL-3.
 
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