ratcues said:
I have always used CA on plastics only. I have original Meucci parts at the shop and I can break them apart by squeezing them between my fingers. Meuccis use a type of epoxy that breaks down in time. It has nothing to do with with time saving, I believe the bond is strong.
When I replace the ringwork in a plastic type cue, I cut all of the necessary rings and then scuff them. That's the trick. If the CA has nothing to bite to, then it will not hold.
CA will also hold to wood IF you use the correct viscosity. That's why I paid a company to test everything. They did destructive testing and the plastic broke down before the bond.
The Rat cues do not have any plastic of any kind so I can build them with 2 ton epoxy. I do not even CA the tips on my cues.
I can relate to what your saying, and doing alot of them Myself in the past I have seen alot of the issues you mentioned. Most older ones are cracked rings, and the newer ones, alot of times the glue simply breaks down from what I see. The parts of the sleeves come loose from each other easily like you mention sometimes also. I aggree with you on the viscocities too and the scuffing part. Here's a senerio I have seen- plastic to wood, and an undersized tenon that the brittle type epoxy was slopped in to fill the gap between It and the sleeve. Usually the thinner viscocity ca gets better penatration, but wicks up, and does'nt fill gaps well just as you mentioned, The thicker viscosity fills the voids better but not sure about penatrating as well to aquire as good of a bond as the thin, but if not thick enough it could just seep out of the joint before It completely kicks off. Like I mentioned I know there are many types of ca's out there, and have used many different types for this or that at one time or another. I'm just not familiar enough with one that has the best of both worlds, but there are many out there I have'nt tried. It seems that when you have gaps to be filled the glue can break down in the middle, or otherwise put- the bond to the materials does'nt always come loose on one side or the other, but rather the glue comes loose from It'self and breaks in the middle of the gap. A brittle epoxy can be no different then some ca's are depending on what's used, so I'm not saying either is better then the other, I don't dought there may be a ca equal to the 2 ton in the same respect, and may not be as brittle as some I have experienced. I just have'nt found one personally I trust that much yet, and have had good luck with what I use. There are many epoxies I would'nt trust either. Sounds like you have found one you have faith in, so I can't argue that, You know your track record with It better then anyone, the same as I do with mine, and not many people enjoy having to redo the work for free, so I believe you when you say It works. Kind of jealous, wish I had one I had that much faith in.
I don't use the brittle type plastics that crack either. I do use some composites such as phenolics and ocasionally a multi poly type material, but the 2 ton seems to work well with those anyway. Delrin I only use for joint protectors or tooling type stuff. The only straight up plastics I glue are in repair work. They do seem to come loose alot, no matter if it was ca or epoxy. I feel the real difference is how brittle or easily the glue breaks down over time, and how well the tenons are sized to the sleeves, whichever type glue was used. Properly sized parts seem to stay together better in the first place IMO.
PVC's are held together By sort of a weld, where the glue heats up and melts the 2 pieces together, and Ca heats up, so I can see that taking place when 2 plastics are glued together, but what about the wood? does this make viscosity the biggest issue?
Alright you want a funny shop story, might not be the best, but the best I can come up with on short notice. This has happened a few times, but one time I did'nt catch It. I always mix My epoxy up on My stool, I use small paper plates to mix it up. Well I was glueing some parts up one day, came out of My shop was talking to the little woman (that let me walk outside), walked outside did some stuff out there, then walked over to My parents, sat down, talking to them for a few minutes, they kept chuckling and looking at each other funny, so I'm starting to wonder what I missed, and why I'm the butt of some obvious joke they had going. well, I get up to walk out the door, And My dad says with this big ol smile "before you leave I gotta ask, why do you have that plate stuck on your ass". I reached back and sure enough I sat in that epoxy
, the 2 of them just busted out laughing. when i was outside there was tons of people walking back and forth. I can only imagine what was going through there minds when they saw this guy walking around with that plate stuck to his hind end like that. the only thing that was missing was Kick Me written on it
My appologies If you took My post the wrong way.
In this case not to be. I had it set up on the shaft taper bar and forgot to change it over. I was tired but hey, maybe shafts that look like house cues will be the next craze!
