Deep Knowledge

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Do you believe there is such a thing as "deep knowledge" when it comes to pool?

I mean, stuff not found in books or generally discussed? Certainly not the science. More like the knowledge that great players come to learn after years of study, practice and experimentation, hand down from father to son, hoard, maybe occasionally share amongst themselves, and eventually take to their graves.

What say you?

Lou Figueroa
 

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
Silver Member
Do you believe there is such a thing as "deep knowledge" when it comes to pool?

... Certainly not the science.
If there is such a thing as "deep knowledge", maybe describing/understanding it "scientifically" would actually limit its power - like observing something makes it "resolve" to one of multiple possibilities in quantum theory.

pj
chgo
 
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MattPoland

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I would’ve said no, until I saw some crafty One Pocket.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 

CocoboloCowboy

Cowboys are my heros.
Silver Member
Do you believe there is such a thing as "deep knowledge" when it comes to pool?

I mean, stuff not found in books or generally discussed? Certainly not the science. More like the knowledge that great players come to learn after years of study, practice and experimentation, hand down from father to son, hoard, maybe occasionally share amongst themselves, and eventually take to their graves.

What say you?

Lou Figueroa


I say yes, it is like doing something over, and over again. Then you get a vision of an easier way to accomplish same thing happen with ease.

Robots are machines, humans have brains, a small percentage of humans use their brains. JMHO.
 
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Black-Balled

He Rides the Skies
Silver Member
I say yes, it is like doing something over, and over again. Then you get a vision of an easier way to accomplish same thing happen with ease.

Robits ar machines, humans have brains, a small percentage of humans use their brains. JMHO.

:withstupid:, even though his example provides a high frequency activity, which wouldn't be a secret.

I believe there are things few people know, but at this aged time of the game, those are few and becoming fewer.

I also believe knowing things like that is really only measurably beneficial a few times in life- not enough to make a player better than he would otherwise be.
 

Black-Balled

He Rides the Skies
Silver Member
I would’ve said no, until I saw some crafty One Pocket.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
I do know this one shot where cb/ ob are close and ob is almost in pocket jaws...hit with secret sauce and the co reverses positions with ob.

OR DO I?:D
 

TATE

AzB Gold Mensch
Gold Member
Silver Member
Do you believe there is such a thing as "deep knowledge" when it comes to pool?

I mean, stuff not found in books or generally discussed? Certainly not the science. More like the knowledge that great players come to learn after years of study, practice and experimentation, hand down from father to son, hoard, maybe occasionally share amongst themselves, and eventually take to their graves.

What say you?

Lou Figueroa

Not simple verbal tips or secrets of that nature.

But otherwise yes, especially in the complicated games like straight pool and one pocket, where there are numerous choices. There is a certain approach in patterns that is learned through trial and error. Chess masters take years to develop their strategies. Pool is the same. Often the most obvious shot or position play is not the best shot. The more experienced the player, the better they are at determining what strategy is most likely to be successful.

There are some skills that are difficult to teach. Let's say, breaking out a cluster of balls - where to impact that cluster and at what speed to leave yourself a shot and spread the balls without creating more problems or tying up the cue ball, then playing position for that break out. Those kinds of things require mastery of the cue and deep knowledge that comes only through experience.
 
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MattPoland

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Yes is always the right answer, as the answer NO is just like saying, nothing new is ever possible.


I don’t think he was talking about new knowledge. I think he was talking about hidden secrets passed on from master to apprentice over the ages. Like the dragon scroll in Kung Fu Panda.


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philly

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Do you believe there is such a thing as "deep knowledge" when it comes to pool?

I mean, stuff not found in books or generally discussed? Certainly not the science. More like the knowledge that great players come to learn after years of study, practice and experimentation, hand down from father to son, hoard, maybe occasionally share amongst themselves, and eventually take to their graves.

What say you?

Lou Figueroa

Of course there is.

I always say if you can imagine it then you can do it or you could never have been able to imagine it.

That's about as close to anything mystical in pool that I know of.
When I have the elbow working and my wrist is right, things happen the way I imagine them consistently.

Don't know if that is what you are talking about.

Time for a little story.

When this Covid thing came down I got a 9 foot GCIII installed in the house.
Simonis of course, tournament blue.
4 1/2 inch deep shelf diamond cut pockets.
Table plays great.

My son decided he was moving back home for a while since he didn't want to stay in his apartment and isolate alone.
Great, glad to have him and he is an avid player also.
Watched him discover that the rails are his friend.
Enjoy watching him discover what he can do.
I like watching his eye movements as to what he is looking at as he observes the possibilities of the lay out and what he is planning on doing.
 

Get_A_Grip

Truth Will Set You Free
Silver Member
There are many tricks in pool to make specific shots easier. One example is that when your cue ball is on or near the rail, to grip to cue more firmly.

Nowadays almost all of the tricks and tips can be found in various instructional videos. Now grant it, you might not find all of the best tricks and tips in a single video, but there are certainly some videos that include a treasure trove of these "tricks" and advanced shots and kicks and how to execute them.

I think that there aren't likely many if any tricks or tips that haven't been documented on video at this stage.
 

CocoboloCowboy

Cowboys are my heros.
Silver Member
I don’t think he was talking about new knowledge. I think he was talking about hidden secrets passed on from master to apprentice over the ages. Like the dragon scroll in Kung Fu Panda.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


You might be right, but I believe much can be learned, by watching people, what they do, and how they do it.
 

alstl

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Yes I agree. There things players do which they can't always explain - they just know how to do it.
 

gregcantrall

Center Ball
Silver Member
Do you believe there is such a thing as "deep knowledge" when it comes to pool?

I mean, stuff not found in books or generally discussed? Certainly not the science. More like the knowledge that great players come to learn after years of study, practice and experimentation, hand down from father to son, hoard, maybe occasionally share amongst themselves, and eventually take to their graves.

What say you?

Lou Figueroa

Deep knowledge is kind of like the, “far heavy” kind of stuff. I have had far heavy knowledge passed to me just because they liked me and saw that I had the desire to learn. I always payed for my lessons on one level or another. At first it was just a dollar a game.

Respect the game. Some times the knowledge is presented and then overlooked or ignored by others.

Some of my mentors have passed and I strive to uphold the examples they set for me.

Ya wanna’ play some?🥴
 

Banger

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Seems sort of like a Catch-22 situation. I mean, if everyone takes their "deep knowledge" of the game to the grave, then we will never know if this "deep knowledge" ever existed. Thus, we can only speculate.

Far out man.....this philosophy stuff is deep. :thumbup:
 

straightline

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
My take on deep knowledge is having to play guys that leave nothing for racks on end. Thankfully I don't have to actually face this enigma. I do recall a guy they call Box on POV pool talking 1P strategy almost in terms of terrain and emphasizing concepts like the wedge around the back pockets as focal strategic options.
Little too deep for me.
 

CocoboloCowboy

Cowboys are my heros.
Silver Member
Seems sort of like a Catch-22 situation. I mean, if everyone takes their "deep knowledge" of the game to the grave, then we will never know if this "deep knowledge" ever existed. Thus, we can only speculate.

Far out man.....this philosophy stuff is deep. :thumbup:


In 2020 we have so much information available to help you play poolbetter. Books, DVD's Instructors, Learnig AIDS, and even U-Tube that is almost free.

Problem is even with all this information people hate to practice, people hate the word work. People want some gizmo that will turn them into a world class player without practicing, or working on build their skills.

Truth is most people who are in the top teer of any sports, if you see how they got to be great, or best at something. Most worked real hard to achieve the high level, or greatness.

Sorry people there is no Magic Pill you can take every a.m., between 6-7 am to make you a great at,___________________ fill in the blank.:D


JMHO.
 

overlord

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Of course there is deep knowledge and whenever you see a group of top Pinoys in a pool room they are discussing the game and the various strategies and tactics.
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
Do you believe there is such a thing as "deep knowledge" when it comes to pool?

I mean, stuff not found in books or generally discussed? Certainly not the science. More like the knowledge that great players come to learn after years of study, practice and experimentation, hand down from father to son, hoard, maybe occasionally share amongst themselves, and eventually take to their graves.

What say you?

Lou Figueroa

I think there may be almost as much deep knowledge as there is common knowledge. Even at the pro level, there are big gaps in the quality of shot design, and those with the deep knowledge have an advantage that surfaces several times in a typical match.

Sometimes, deep knowledge utilized is barely even noticed by either viewers or commentators. For example, certain types of two way shots seem to be the sole domain of the Filipino contingent, and the rest of the world hasn't caught up yet. Such shots are a good example of using deep knowledge in an innovative way.

There is also a lot of deep knowledge that pertains to the kicking game --- subtleties in the use of spin speed and angle to open up some additional possible good results.

Giving oneself subtle extra chances through extraordinary shot design is one of the trademarks of the elite few, and it's a consequence of superior deep knowledge, a comprehension of the game that exceeds anything ever written about the game. In the case of Efren, we called such shots "magic", but he's hardly the only one that saw extra chances by applying deep knowledge of everything going on at the pool table.

In my view, deep knowledge applies to practically every game played on a pool table.

I feel a 1,000 page book could be written called "pool theory that has never been documented in the game's history."
 
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