Dennis Orcollo Fouled for practicing a Jump shot on next table

[Cornerman]

Don't be angry at Dennis. He fouled, he accepted it, done.

Dennis complained very vocally while Wu had already got back to the table to the point that there was some fear that a "unsportsmanlike" was imminent .

The referee (John) was absolutely at the table the entire match. He was in a suit, and he was off and on camera throughout the match.

As a National Referee and Tournament Director, Ken Shuman is at the very least a proper consult. I can only imagine that John also called it immediately. These guys have been National Refs for a long time.

 

[Cornerman]

I'm looking forward to seeing it, if its available. If he just took a stroke in the direction of the other table, that's one thing. If he set up a ball on the other table and/or placed his bridge hand down and took a practice stroke, that's pretty dumb, and shouldn't be controversial. Was it debatable at all whether it really should have been considered practicing?

No debate. He was left a jump shot. He went and got his jump stick. He shot a jump shot on the adjacent table. It was a stab at a jump shot, but unfortunately it was a jump shot stab when he was clearly faced with a jump shot. That was a practice shot for the very shot he was about to shoot. That's been a foul (practicing during a match and shooting on a different table while in a match). Just smacking a ball is a gray area. This wasn't a gray area, IMO.

The moment he was down on the practice jump, I think everyone who's ever been a serious pool ref on any level called out foul aloud.

Freddie <~~~ loves Dennis, but yelled "foul" in an empty room

 

[parvus1202]

How many complained vocally when they foul? Some even break their cues, others pick a fight with the spectators. Some ride on the table like a horse with two feet up. It shouldn't happen but it does. That's what makes pool exciting.

 

[Black-Balled]

Okay so Dennis fouls due to hitting a ball on another table. TD calls it and other guy gets BIH.

What am I missing? Foul happened BIH was rewarded.

We all have made mistakes or done something we know not to do. Things slip our minds.

Good job by the TD IMO Dennis or anyone else this would happen to doesn't have the right to get upset but that doesn't stop most from getting upset in the heat of the moment.

IMO, could possibly be indicative of self-percieved 'diva' status.

Cross out the 'could possibly be' part.

You don't think top performers feel 'rules' don't have to apply to them? Look at all the politicians and stars that don't pay taxes, but could certainly have afforded to do so, through the years. And all the business executives who bend laws to suit their goals?

 

[warfdiesel]

Okay so Dennis fouls due to hitting a ball on another table. TD calls it and other guy gets BIH.

What am I missing? Foul happened BIH was rewarded.

We all have made mistakes or done something we know not to do. Things slip our minds.

Good job by the TD IMO Dennis or anyone else this would happen to doesn't have the right to get upset but that doesn't stop most from getting upset in the heat of the moment.

Well said my friend

 

[Woof Biscuit]

Dennis has more moves than Jello.

 

[12squared]

BCAPL Rules:

1-8 No Practice Allowed During Match

1. It is a foul if you practice at any time during your match, including during time-outs
and periods of suspended play. "Practice" is defined as any stroke or shot that is not a
part of your match, taken on any table at the event venue. (AR p. 75)

Any questions?

Dave

 

[Gilbertfan81]

Dennis

There are things u just don't do. This is obviously one of them. It seems when you get top the top of any profession you seem to become entitled. I think this is the case. That is absolutely cheating. And for that matter changing shafts to jump a ball is also. Apparently they let him cheat just because of who he is. The tournament director in tunica should have called it!

 

[Hungarian]

Dennis isn't the choir boy he's often portrayed to be.


Hungarian <~~~ Likes Rodney much more than Dennis

 

[Island Drive]

Being the best pool player alive is debatable but being the best player at this time is just fitting. After winning the 1-pocket chamipionsip over Corey Duel in a long drawn out battle he still has the nerve and drive to defeat Uchigaki, Van Boening, Dang Jin-Hu, Ko Pin Yi, and Wu Qiaqing in succession in the 10 Ball tournament which immendiately follows the 1- pocket. Those are world class top rated players, and doing it almost without rest of relief. The 10 ball is still ongoing, whatever, imho, he earned the best player title right now.

During match play, in a pro event. Non shooting player must be seated. Its common courtesy, expected and its the rule of play. Since DO has been showing cracks in his character as of late, this is just another BAD MOVE on his part. I expect other players to start doing things, Very subtle, back at em since his ''ways'' are surfacing and causing distractions during play. What comes around....

 

[parvus1202]

I think you should respect the Tournament directors. I don't think they let anybody cheat. As you can see, it's a BCA rule, created by Americans. That's only mean one thing, in the past American pro players disregarded their opponent. Practising and shooting at the other table while in a match and then come back when it's their turn to shoot. Hence the creation of this rule. No international players where responsible for that ruling. Orcollo was not practising at the other while Wu is shooting, he practise what he intend to do to his next shot. He did not disregarded Wu. But a rule is written, he fouled. I agree with that.

 

[gxman]

No one called any fouls on Earl when he was playing Ko.

 

[CreeDo]

During match play, in a pro event. Non shooting player must be seated. Its common courtesy, expected and its the rule of play. Since DO has been showing cracks in his character as of late, this is just another BAD MOVE on his part. I expect other players to start doing things, Very subtle, back at em since his ''ways'' are surfacing and causing distractions during play. What comes around....

He wasn't out of his chair while the other guy was shooting.
There's zero need to imply he's making a move or trying to shark his opponent.

He got out of the chair for his own shot. The problem is that he took a practice stroke
using another cue ball and table. If he'd taken a practice stroke without another ball, at his own table,
it's fine and legal.

The rule is fine, dennis deserved to eat the foul, but let's not twist it into some evil shark move.
He spaced out and forgot a rule that almost never gets called. If he remembered the rule he'd never
risk giving up BIH in a critical match, just to get in a single practice swing.

 

[jsp]

There are things u just don't do. This is obviously one of them. It seems when you get top the top of any profession you seem to become entitled. I think this is the case. That is absolutely cheating.

I would hesitate to label this "absolutely" cheating. I highly doubt Dennis would willingly cheat so blatantly in front of the entire world to see. He obviously did the practice jump out of plain ignorance of the rules.

That said, the more significant ding on his character is that he vocally complained after the foul was called, which was clearly unsportsmanlike.

So blame Dennis for his unsportsmanlike behavior, and blame him for his ignorance of the rules. But I wouldn't label him a cheater, at least for this particular instance.

 

[BRussell]

I think you should respect the Tournament directors. I don't think they let anybody cheat. As you can see, it's a BCA rule, created by Americans. That's only mean one thing, in the past American pro players disregarded their opponent. Practising and shooting at the other table while in a match and then come back when it's their turn to shoot. Hence the creation of this rule. No international players where responsible for that ruling. Orcollo was not practising at the other while Wu is shooting, he practise what he intend to do to his next shot. He did not disregarded Wu. But a rule is written, he fouled. I agree with that.

I'm not sure why this should turn into some kind of anti-American thing (there's enough legitimate ways to go that route if you want to). It's in the World Pool-Billiard Association rules as unsportsmanlike conduct, so it's not just some unique American thing. It's the world's rules.

 

[trob]

Okay so Dennis fouls due to hitting a ball on another table. TD calls it and other guy gets BIH.

What am I missing? Foul happened BIH was rewarded.

We all have made mistakes or done something we know not to do. Things slip our minds.

Good job by the TD IMO Dennis or anyone else this would happen to doesn't have the right to get upset but that doesn't stop most from getting upset in the heat of the moment.

I guess because dennis.. a pro player ..should know better and seeing dennis play in person on more then one occasion he can be a bit of Douche lol

 

[parvus1202]

I'm not sure why this should turn into some kind of anti-American thing (there's enough legitimate ways to go that route if you want to). It's in the World Pool-Billiard Association rules as unsportsmanlike conduct, so it's not just some unique American thing. It's the world's rules.

I'm not anti- American, what I said was, somebody was responsible for that ruling. Besides that was BCA rule adopted by WPA. BCA was created in 1948, WPA 1987.

"BCAPL Rules:

1-8 No Practice Allowed During Match

1. It is a foul if you practice at any time during your match, including during time-outs
and periods of suspended play. "Practice" is defined as any stroke or shot that is not a
part of your match, taken on any table at the event venue. (AR p. 75)

 

[nb92]

Dennis complained very vocally while Wu had already got back to the table to the point that there was some fear that a "unsportsmanlike" was imminent .

The referee (John) was absolutely at the table the entire match. He was in a suit, and he was off and on camera throughout the match.

As a National Referee and Tournament Director, Ken Shuman is at the very least a proper consult. I can only imagine that John also called it immediately. These guys have been National Refs for a long time.

you imagine wrong... Ken instructed John to call it... it was not called by John at first.

 

[frankncali]

IMO, could possibly be indicative of self-percieved 'diva' status.

Cross out the 'could possibly be' part.

You don't think top performers feel 'rules' don't have to apply to them? Look at all the politicians and stars that don't pay taxes, but could certainly have afforded to do so, through the years. And all the business executives who bend laws to suit their goals?

Sorry but while I agree with your last part it has little to do with this. He fouled plain and simple. If he is mad then he has to get over it. He fouled. Now as for it being a move or a DIVA situation I think that is crazy. He fouled.. that is all. He didnt stand up and say I am Dennis O biatches. He fouled.. TD did good job. DO has to face the music of his error.


I have seen Dennis play in person on more than a couple occasions. Never seen him do anything bad. All I have seen him do was play better than anyone else.
FTR the Tunica thing was weird and odd.. Dennis must have been a smooth tnalker to get out of that bet.

 

[frankncali]

I'm not anti- American, what I said was, somebody was responsible for that ruling. Besides that was BCA rule adopted by WPA. BCA was created in 1948, WPA 1987.

"BCAPL Rules:

1-8 No Practice Allowed During Match

1. It is a foul if you practice at any time during your match, including during time-outs
and periods of suspended play. "Practice" is defined as any stroke or shot that is not a
part of your match, taken on any table at the event venue. (AR p. 75)

Not questioning the rule but is this a WPA rule as well.

I see lots of guys do a practice stroke or two away from the cueball or stroke down a seem a couple times to try and get straightened out. Would that be a foul?

In the Ultimate 10ball I only watched a few matches but in 2 of them during a TO by player 1 player 2 hit balls. Announcers even made reference to it being good to do so to stay in stroke. I thought it was wrong to do but wasnt sure.