Dirty Low Down Red

steveinflorida

steveinflorida

senior member
Silver Member
Is he still amongst the living? Got any stories about him
and some of the shenanigans he has pulled over the years. Like the time Red and a partner were on the road
and it seems Red was getting a little tired of his partners company, so out in the middle of nowhere, Red pulls over and informs the other guy that it feels as though a rear tire is low and would he please get out and check. About the time that his passenger arrives at the rear of the car, Red hits the gas and drives off leaving the poor sucker in the dust minus his luggage. Don't really know any more details to this story, but lets face it, unless the guy was Charles Manson or Hitler, he would deserve to be dropped in town, WITH his suitcase!
 
steveinflorida said:
Is he still amongst the living? Got any stories about him
and some of the shenanigans he has pulled over the years. Like the time Red and a partner were on the road
and it seems Red was getting a little tired of his partners company, so out in the middle of nowhere, Red pulls over and informs the other guy that it feels as though a rear tire is low and would he please get out and check. About the time that his passenger arrives at the rear of the car, Red hits the gas and drives off leaving the poor sucker in the dust minus his luggage. Don't really know any more details to this story, but lets face it, unless the guy was Charles Manson or Hitler, he would deserve to be dropped in town, WITH his suitcase!
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aka Preacher Red. He died in Vegas about five or six years ago. A hustler, a con man, a pool player and much much more. He could be ruthless and wasn't one to trifle with either. He owned a .45 and kept it loaded and ready at all times. Once, at a tournament in Birmingham, Al. in the 70's, the promoter went belly up and claimed he had no money to pay the players. He offered to settle with them for a third of their winnings, out of his own pocket. Red confronted this guy in his office and pulled out that big .45. He informed the promoter that he was going to be paid in full, right here and right now. The promoter made an exception for Red IMMEDIATELY!

I played Red several times over the years. But finally I got the message, he was BAD action. He just did not accept losing on any terms. He could get very nasty quick. Later on in life, I bought a lot of his pool memorabilia and several cues he had won from the less fortunate. I still have a large container stuffed with back issues of Billiards Digest. And a cane he made with an Eight Ball on the top. Red always had something for sale when you met him. He had something in every pocket it seemed. And his items were usually pool related.

Red was friends with Don King (two of a kind comes to mind) and he always got several comp seats to the big fights in Vegas. Of course, he sold them! :D
 
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He got a promotion

His name was Charles "Dirty-Low-Down Red" Jones. AKA Preacher Red. At one of the Stardust Vegas tournaments Red got a name promotion from Eddie the Hat Burton. He raised Red up to Dirty-Low-Down-Stinkin'-Red. Red seemed pleased with the upgrade. He played a little better than shortstop speed. I loved him. I have him rated as the 3rd greatest sharker in the world behind Ronnie Allen and Chicago's Fonzi Daniels. Once, at the Stardust in Vegas, I was shooting a difficult proposition bank shot with a certain amount of shots allowed to make it (15). Steve Mizerak was betting against me, and I had my whole bankroll up (about $400). Preacher Red (AKA Charles Jones, & D.L.D.S. Red) was presiding over the bet and counting the shots. With my whole B.R. up, I was dogging it slightly and the shot count was at 11. Red sensing my shakyness, and at the count of 12, he repeated "11," giving me an extra shot. That little edge motivated me enough to finally make the shot on the 15th and last (actually 16th) try. Naturally, Red eased over to me later and put his hand out for some "consideration" for his part in my score. I gladly paid off. All the bad things said about Red are probably true.
Little side-light: Red died recently in Vegas, an old man. Artie Bodendorfer and Red's mother attended the funeral.

the Beard

check my website for vintage videos and the pool movie script, "Roxanne's Game."
 
steveinflorida said:
Great stories, Jay and the Beard. Thanks.
Anyone else have any?
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After playing him once in Vegas and after railing his action several times, I consider him one of the best 1 pocket movers I've ever seen. Wore a jumpsuit around, and he liked to talk about the real old-time players like Ponzi, Taberski,etc. He didn't mind leaving balls on your side only to be able to bank 'em later.

By the way--still talking about Preacher Red.
 
This is my story from an earlier thread.

I've known the Preacher since the sixties. I didn't know he passed away. He was Quite a character.

Many years ago there was a billiard place in Los Angeles called Tournament Billiards where they held various turnaments including straight pool.

I was playing Philadelphia Joe Veasley and my buddy had a $200 side bet on me with the Preacher. The game was straight pool going to 150.

I remember Joe was at about 140 something and the Preacher was sitting front row center with his feet stretched out in the theater type sitting they had there. I needed maybe eighty or ninety balls when I started my run.

I ran out from there and sometime during my run the Preacher disappeared.

When the match was over my buddy went looking for the Preacher and went to the front door where Robert "Rags' Woods was collecting the tickets for the event. He asked Rags if he had seen the Preacher. Rags asks why. After explaining to him about the side bet, Rags started laughing.

Rags informed him that Marvin Henderson had just come in an asked him why the Preacher was in the alley standing on a pile of boxes and watching the matches through the window?

My buddy ran out to the alley and confronted the Preacher. In those days the Preacher used to carry a brief case loaded with watches, rings, gold chains and other stuff. He tried to pay off with some of that stuff. I think my friend got half cash and half merchandise.

We became good friends and I liked the guy. I didn't know he passed away. Sorry to hear the news.
 
dabarbr said:
This is my story from an earlier thread.

I've known the Preacher since the sixties. I didn't know he passed away. He was Quite a character.

Many years ago there was a billiard place in Los Angeles called Tournament Billiards where they held various turnaments including straight pool.

I was playing Philadelphia Joe Veasley and my buddy had a $200 side bet on me with the Preacher. The game was straight pool going to 150.

I remember Joe was at about 140 something and the Preacher was sitting front row center with his feet stretched out in the theater type sitting they had there. I needed maybe eighty or ninety balls when I started my run.

I ran out from there and sometime during my run the Preacher disappeared.

When the match was over my buddy went looking for the Preacher and went to the front door where Robert "Rags' Woods was collecting the tickets for the event. He asked Rags if he had seen the Preacher. Rags asks why. After explaining to him about the side bet, Rags started laughing.

Rags informed him that Marvin Henderson had just come in an asked him why the Preacher was in the alley standing on a pile of boxes and watching the matches through the window?

My buddy ran out to the alley and confronted the Preacher. In those days the Preacher used to carry a brief case loaded with watches, rings, gold chains and other stuff. He tried to pay off with some of that stuff. I think my friend got half cash and half merchandise.

We became good friends and I liked the guy. I didn't know he passed away. Sorry to hear the news.
Click to expand...

The legend of Frank "The Barber" continues! You were probably the "dog" in that match with Joe Veasey, but you didn't know it. He had a little dog in him sometimes if you put the heat on him. You never had much dog in you! :D

Rags and Marvin were the best players around back then. Most road men avoided Tournament Billiards because of them. If you could get past The Iceman, Black Nate, Billy Kenyon and Cecil, then they would sic Marvin or Rags on you. Nobody that I know of got past these two, except Jimmy Marino who broke even with Rags after two days. Even Jimmy wouldn't play Marvin any One Pocket and Marvin refused to play Jimmy 9-Ball (I was in with Marvin and I said NO NO NO).

Even Lou Butera ducked this joint saying why do I need to play these guys. To his credit Richie came in there a few times and NO ONE would play him 9-Ball. NO ONE!! But he wouldn't play One Pocket either. Marvin even beat Ronnie one week after Ronnie won the All Around at the Stardust in Vegas. Marvin had the purest pool stroke I ever saw! Only one close was Eddie Kelly. Man, were these two guys sweet! Artists of the green.
 
dabarbr said:
This is my story from an earlier thread.

I've known the Preacher since the sixties. I didn't know he passed away. He was Quite a character.

Many years ago there was a billiard place in Los Angeles called Tournament Billiards where they held various turnaments including straight pool.

I was playing Philadelphia Joe Veasley and my buddy had a $200 side bet on me with the Preacher. The game was straight pool going to 150.

I remember Joe was at about 140 something and the Preacher was sitting front row center with his feet stretched out in the theater type sitting they had there. I needed maybe eighty or ninety balls when I started my run.

I ran out from there and sometime during my run the Preacher disappeared.

When the match was over my buddy went looking for the Preacher and went to the front door where Robert "Rags' Woods was collecting the tickets for the event. He asked Rags if he had seen the Preacher. Rags asks why. After explaining to him about the side bet, Rags started laughing.

Rags informed him that Marvin Henderson had just come in an asked him why the Preacher was in the alley standing on a pile of boxes and watching the matches through the window?

My buddy ran out to the alley and confronted the Preacher. In those days the Preacher used to carry a brief case loaded with watches, rings, gold chains and other stuff. He tried to pay off with some of that stuff. I think my friend got half cash and half merchandise.

We became good friends and I liked the guy. I didn't know he passed away. Sorry to hear the news.
Click to expand...

Deleted - duplicate post
 
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Culver City?

jay helfert said:
The legend of Frank "The Barber" continues! You were probably the "dog" in that match with Joe Veasey, but you didn't know it. He had a little dog in him sometimes if you put the heat on him. You never had much dog in you! :D

Rags and Marvin were the best players around back then. Most road men avoided Tournament Billiards because of them. If you could get past The Iceman, Black Nate, Billy Kenyon and Cecil, then they would sic Marvin or Rags on you. Nobody that I know of got past these two, except Jimmy Marino who broke even with Rags after two days. Even Jimmy wouldn't play Marvin any One Pocket and Marvin refused to play Jimmy 9-Ball (I was in with Marvin and I said NO NO NO).

Even Lou Butera ducked this joint saying "Why do I need to play these guys?" To his credit Richie came in there a few times and NO ONE would play him 9-Ball. NO ONE!! But he wouldn't play One Pocket either. Marvin even beat Ronnie one week after Ronnie won the All Around at the Stardust in Vegas. Marvin had the purest pool stroke I ever saw! Only one close was Eddie Kelly. Man, were these two guys sweet! Artists of the green.
Click to expand...

Tournament Billiards. Wasn't that the all nite joint in Culver City? My memory isn't sure. If so, I played bank or one pocket with everybody in that joint except Marvin. He wasn't in town at the time. Augie Catarella and Little Frankie, both from Jersey City, would go with me there on a regular basis. We'd pop a few uppers and play marathons. I won just about all the bank matches, including Rags Woods. The only guy to give me bank trouble -- we would go back and forth -- was Cecil the Serpent. As you said, not many white players ventured in there. One who did was the Baltimore Beatle. Remember him? He was on the run for deserting the Army. Played nice 9 ball.

the Beard
A treasure trove of vintage pool videos, insults, products, bad advice, hustling secrets and more @ www.bankingwiththebeard.com
 
Drinking a coffee

alstl said:
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=64426

Here is a link to the other thread from a while back about about Low down dirty Red including a picture posted by Grady.

I forgot that I had asked which guy in the video was Omaha Fats. I still can't figure out which one he is. Is he the guy smoking a cigarette?
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In the first few minutes of the video you get to see a bald Omaha Fats drinking coffee from a white plastic cup.

the Beard
 
jay helfert said:
The legend of Frank "The Barber" continues! You were probably the "dog" in that match with Joe Veasey, but you didn't know it. He had a little dog in him sometimes if you put the heat on him. You never had much dog in you! :D

Rags and Marvin were the best players around back then. Most road men avoided Tournament Billiards because of them. If you could get past The Iceman, Black Nate, Billy Kenyon and Cecil, then they would sic Marvin or Rags on you. Nobody that I know of got past these two, except Jimmy Marino who broke even with Rags after two days. Even Jimmy wouldn't play Marvin any One Pocket and Marvin refused to play Jimmy 9-Ball (I was in with Marvin and I said NO NO NO).

Even Lou Butera ducked this joint saying "Why do I need to play these guys?" To his credit Richie came in there a few times and NO ONE would play him 9-Ball. NO ONE!! But he wouldn't play One Pocket either. Marvin even beat Ronnie one week after Ronnie won the All Around at the Stardust in Vegas. Marvin had the purest pool stroke I ever saw! Only one close was Eddie Kelly. Man, were these two guys sweet! Artists of the green.
Click to expand...

This post was so good I read it twice! :D

~rc
 
freddy the beard said:
In the first few minutes of the video you get to see a bald Omaha Fats drinking coffee from a white plastic cup.

the Beard
Click to expand...

Thanks Freddy.
 
freddy the beard said:
Tournament Billiards. Wasn't that the all nite joint in Culver City? My memory isn't sure. If so, I played bank or one pocket with everybody in that joint except Marvin. He wasn't in town at the time. Augie Catarella and Little Frankie, both from Jersey City, would go with me there on a regular basis. We'd pop a few uppers and play marathons. I won just about all the bank matches, including Rags Woods. The only guy to give me bank trouble -- we would go back and forth -- was Cecil the Serpent. As you said, not many white players ventured in there. One who did was the Baltimore Beatle. Remember him? He was on the run for deserting the Army. Played nice 9 ball.

the Beard
A treasure trove of vintage pool videos, insults, products, bad advice, hustling secrets and more @ www.bankingwiththebeard.com
Click to expand...

Yeah, but you were CRAZY Freddie. You would go anywhere and play anyone! BANKS!!!

Sure, I remember the Beatle, a buddy of mine back then. I'll think of his name after a while. He was rolling good until he met up with Jimmy Marino at Ye Billiard Den. Jimmy put his bankroll on a diet. :)
 
Dale (the Baltimore Beatle)

jay helfert said:
Yeah, but you were CRAZY Freddie. You would go anywhere and play anyone! BANKS!!!

Sure, I remember the Beatle, a buddy of mine back then. I'll think of his name after a while. He was rolling good until he met up with Jimmy Marino at Ye Billiard Den. Jimmy put his bankroll on a diet. :)
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Jay, I just remembered. His real first name was Dale. I know he either got caught or turned himself in. But I dont think anything really bad happened to him for being a deserter. Hippie Jimmy Marino became the best young 9 ball player in the world for a short spell.

the Beard

Scene Vllll of Roxanne's Game going up today. Roxanne learns the Hustler Code and Freddy gets heisted. Http://scriptforroxannesgame.blogspot.com/
 
freddy the beard said:
Hippie Jimmy Marino became the best young 9 ball player in the world for a short spell.

the Beard
Click to expand...
I believe Marino currently has a room in Bridgeville, Pa., south of Pittsburgh. Maybe Terry or Cal could verify.

Doc
 
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