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Do even the most well respected cue makers make cues with uneven points, at times?
- Thread starter justinb386
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i am by no means a cue maker, but i have been a woodworker for over 35 years. i will say this, in all my years working with wood, it is very unpredictable. set up a blank and cut the points one day. come back the next and they have moved. wood is a living creature even though technically the tree is dead it still moves daily based on weather and temps. i have tried to replicate some projects i do but never get similar results. there is always a slight difference due to the character of the wood. its what makes wood so beautiful!
Mike
Mike
I don't feel that a cue maker should put out a cue with visibly uneven points. A 1/4" is totally unacceptable. A 1/16th is probably OK but I really think that a cue maker should practice his craft until he can put out even points or a least ones that are barely noticeable.
Points should be even, but remember, you have the top of the point(veneer) and also the main point. One can be even and the other can be off, so look at both.
If the cuemaker doesnt start correcting after the first pass, they will probably not get them even - there's only so much wood unless you wanna build a jump cue....or a Pen lol.
Jason
If the cuemaker doesnt start correcting after the first pass, they will probably not get them even - there's only so much wood unless you wanna build a jump cue....or a Pen lol.
Jason
A CNC machine can be used to make half spliced points. A manual lathe can be used to make half spliced points. A mill can be used to make half spliced points. All three of those machines make the same basic cuts. They can all use the same basic cutters. One is controlled by a GCode program written by the cuemaker via a computer. The other two machines are controlled manually by handwheels and dials.
A CNC machine can be used to make floating/flat bottom inlayed points. A manual pantograph type inlay machine can be used to make floating/flat bottom inlayed points. They both would make the same basic cuts and could use the same exact cutter. One would be controlled by a GCode program written by the cuemaker via a computer. The other would be manually controlled by the cuemakers hands (and some handwheels/dials) via a template and a stylus. That template was likely made on a CNC machine.
The point is many cuemakers use a CNC machine to construct spliced points. When discussing points, one should discuss what kind of points they are, not guess what type of machine was used to make them. There is no way to look at a cue and accurately guess what type of machine was used to construct the points, except for what most cuemakers typically use.
Spliced points VS floating inlayed points. A CNC machine or a manual machine can be used to make either/both.
Machines are used to cut wood. You have to make cuts in wood to make a half spliced forearm. What do you think cuemakers use to make spliced points if they don't use machines? The Vee grooves are not carved out with a gouge and the point blanks are not cut and shaped into uniform dimensions with sandpaper.
Technically a CNC style point created by a CNC machine is rounded off (not squared off), because it was cut by a round bit. How "sharp" a point (or the corner of an inlay) can be is dependent upon the diameter of the bit being used. The smaller the diameter of the bit, the "sharper" the point (or corner of an inlay) will be, although they will always still be rounded at the very tip because the bit was round no matter how small it was. Super tiny bits can be used to make points that will look sharp if you are not seeing them close up but this isn't usually practical because it takes much longer since you have to cut them so slow to avoid breaking those tiny bits, and/or because you will still break lots of bits anyway and they aren't cheap.
To clear up what sounds to be some possible confusion elsewhere in the thread about what exactly a CNC point is and how it is done, here is another video. This shows CNC style points made with a CNC machine. When all of the point shows on the cue as it does on the cue in this video, it is known as a "floating point". In some cases the back end of the point is intentionally covered up by the wrap so that it will look a little more like a traditional half spliced point.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adUbpn7WZYA&t=1m42s
This video that I posted earlier is the half splice type point.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PV_PvZYP3o
And here is a picture that allows one to see how full splice points are constructed if anyone is curious.
http://www.arnotq.com/pages/21/21.html
As MVPCues pointed out, things can sometimes get confusing to talk about because a half splice point type can be made using CNC machinery, and a CNC style inlayed point can be made other ways too (such as with a pantograph which cuts the same way as a CNC machine does with a bit but it is guided manually by the person using a template much the same way as with a key cutting machine where the person is manually guiding the machine against the good key so that a bit is cutting an exact duplicate into the key blank beside it). It can be a good idea to clarify if someone is talking about the actual machine that was used or the style of the point but generally they are talking about the style of the point as opposed to the actual machine that was used to create it.
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I should have been more clear. When I said machine I was referring to a CNC machine and when I said squares I should have said rounded. Playa9's post depicts exactly what I was trying to say.
The bottom line is the phrase "CNC style point" is a terrible description.
Repeating that over and over again creates misinformation about what CNC is and how it works. Spliced points can be done on a CNC machine all day long. Floating/flat bottom points can be done on a manual machine all day long.
Repeating that over and over again creates misinformation about what CNC is and how it works. Spliced points can be done on a CNC machine all day long. Floating/flat bottom points can be done on a manual machine all day long.
I think I get what you both were saying. Essentially you were saying a CNC machine cannot make sharp points because they use round bits. The problem is you were only thinking about the typical CNC style inlayed points and either didn't know or just forgot to consider that a CNC machine can be used to make other point styles too. Which is what MVPCues was pointing out, that technically you can make sharp points with a CNC machine if you use it to make half splice points as an example which of course would be very sharp.
This is an example of how the point style verses the actual machine used to create it can be confusing at times if we don't specify which one we are specifically talking about. The statement "a CNC machine cannot make sharp points in the typical CNC inlayed style" would have been a true one had it been stated that way.
My experience has been that in general when someone says "CNC point" they are usually talking about the style of point (an inlayed point) without having given much thought to which specific machine was used to create it, and when someone is talking about using a CNC machine to do points they are talking about the inlayed style of point without having given thought to the fact that a CNC machine can be used for other styles of points too (although it would be being used in a different way in such case). But it is probably a better idea to just specify if we are talking only about the point style, or only about the specific type of machine being used, or both, rather than having to assume what was meant.
I think it is pretty clear to anyone what is meant by that without any ambiguity at all, but "inlayed point" or "inlayed point done with a CNC machine" would probably be better choices. More precision in speech is almost always better.
Here is one way to make sharp points using CNC: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVSZOK1DK1s
