The best statement in the thread imo. Maple shaft with an ivory ferrule is the best hit you can get imo.
Do good players play with full Ivory ferrules?
- Thread starter mel_smOg
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The best statement in the thread imo. Maple shaft with an ivory ferrule is the best hit you can get imo.
batalarms
Ebony Hoppe Fanatic
It's a little off topic but,what about the ferrules that are "capless" or "through ferrules"? The ones where the wood goes all the way through the ferrule to the tip.These are supposed to deflect less than "standard" capped ferrules.And if the ferrule is an issue,why wouldn't all the top players use ferrule-less shafts?Just wondering.
Marc
Marc
I understand that, KM. I just thought it was worth mentioning that you can play pretty sporty with an ivory ferrule.
My take on the main issue is that a player will probably play with what they are most used to and/or what they like. "Like" being pretty subjective in terms of feel, sound, feedback. Chances are that if you grew up playing with ivory ferules, that's what you're going to prefer and be used to and probably play best with, the converse also probably being true.
I don't know what most pros today play with but given the number or endorsement deals from LD manufactures that seem to be available, I think perhaps some players are willing to play with those, even though they might not be what they prefer. I seem to recall that at least one pro said he played the best pool of his life with a traditional cue, but was later enticed to play with LD cue for the endorsement benefits. So, it's hard to say.
Lou Figueroa
I will use just about any ferrule material EXCEPT for ivory.
I will use just about any ferrule material EXCEPT for ivory.....it's very difficult to control....I don't even like ivory joint material....it makes the cue ball go crazy on some shots.....the BludWorth Cue I use originally had ivory joint and ferrule - I used it for one day and sent it back to Leonard and he changed it right away....it came back as one of the best hitting cues I've ever played with.....I still use it today and that was 23 years ago.
Play Well.....'The Game is the Teacher'
I will use just about any ferrule material EXCEPT for ivory.....it's very difficult to control....I don't even like ivory joint material....it makes the cue ball go crazy on some shots.....the BludWorth Cue I use originally had ivory joint and ferrule - I used it for one day and sent it back to Leonard and he changed it right away....it came back as one of the best hitting cues I've ever played with.....I still use it today and that was 23 years ago.
Play Well.....'The Game is the Teacher'
I highly doubt you or anyone else would be able to tell if they had an ivory jointed cue if they didn't already know it.
And this is how this argument always goes in my home pool hall. There is a rift now between the old "good" equipment and the modern LD stuff. For me, there's no comparison. Modern Predators and OBs are better in every way than the old solid maple shafts...ivory ferrule or not. Invest 2 weeks to get used to it, and you never go back.
I know that many pros use the equipment they use because of sponsorships, but I know first-hand that they prefer the playability of the modern stuff. It's ruined my old dream of getting an old Scruggs or Joss West as a playing cue, because now any cue with a Predator shaft plays better!
Actually he will give you any shaft you want ,, I hit his shafts all of the hit several Gina cues also neither play as good for me as a Predator shaft I'm long past the learning curb of playing with less deflection ,, I wouldn't even dream of playing with a reg shaft with or with out a ivory ferrule
Just like I don't play with a persimmon driver or flat blade forged irons with a sweet spot the size of a ant ,, I gave way to better equipment
1
When I said that's what he's selling I meant those are the shafts he pushes and likes best. Of course I didn't mean he won't sell you a shaft with a ferrule on it.
Like I said, it's all subjective. I wouldn't dream of playing with a Predator shaft. They have a dead hit to me and I feel like they are a bunch of B-Grade shafts cut up and glued together.
I don't quite understand this analogy. Forged irons are inferior?? You do know that most pro golfers prefer a smaller clubhead and many use forged irons because they offer much more precision, feel, and workability than a cavity-back club the size of a hockey stick right?
Ivory Ferrule
Plus the shaft was owned by a champion,the Skunk,which knows cues like you know cases. Rich aka the skunk.
Plus the shaft was owned by a champion,the Skunk,which knows cues like you know cases. Rich aka the skunk.
True dat.
We used to talk about this on RSB over 10 years ago: tip-CB contact time, the impulse speed of maple, how the sound/energy wave traverses the stick. Anywhos, here is what is probably the most pertinent post from that era:
#####
John McChesney
6/14/99
Here's something interesting we tried in 1991:
At an event we had 16 cues with the butt, joint and the ferrules
covered with masking tape...then numbered.
No one could "see" if the cue was a steel, plastic or wood joint (as in a
Pete), nor detect by the style of ferrule.
We had 70 players...each hit balls with the cues throughout the weekend.
The results:
Of nearly 800 attempts over the time period, the players guessed wrong
about what type joint was in the cue more than 7 out of 10 times.
A top pro (Meucci staffer) happened to be there, having done an exhibition
and the cue he liked the most during the attempts:
He thought was surely a Meucci, plastic joint when in reality it was an
older Adams with a piloted steel joint; and additionally guessed the Meucci he
shot with as a cue with a steel joint.
Again, I maintain that cues with different joint materials may sound
differently; may be balanced differently, but what is "hit" ?
Doesn't "hit" have to do with all the senses:
Vibration (feel), sound, balance, etc.
What is a "soft" hit? What is a "hard" hit? (what does this mean, if not
the sound the cue makes upon impact, or are people ref. to the vibration in the butt?)
Does a hard hit vibrate more and make a different sound?
A soft hit vibrate less with a different sound?
I maintain that the primary criteria that differentiates one cue from
another begins with:
>The tip (soft, med or hard)
>The shaft diameter and density of the wood
>The taper (or stiffness of the shaft)
To this day, I still don't believe the joint has much to do with the
reaction of the cue ball off the shaft, rather it is the 3 aforementioned that have far more bearing on how a cue plays than anything else.
Remember, what makes the predator shaft play differently is what is located
at the tip, inside the shaft, the ferrule and the laminations....not the joint or butt.
In closing, our experiment asked which cue the players liked best:
Of the 70 players, nearly 55 liked the hit of two cues with different
numbers:
When the two were exposed, they both were sneaky petes, wood to wood joints,
(one a Scruggs and the other a Huebler); both about 19 oz., both about 13
1/4mm and tended to be on the stiff side of "hit". By the way, the 55 who liked the hit of these two cues:
more than half thought they would be steel jointed.
John McChesney
Texas Express
National Nine Ball Tour
PO Box 700814
Dallas Tx 75370
Voice 214 495 tour (8687)
Fax 214 495 7616
j...@texasexpress.com
http://www.texasexpress.com
#####
Lou Figueroa
RSB was the Teacher
Who would have thought that simply putting masking tape on a wood joint cue would make it hit like a steel joint?
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The feel of the hit is what's subjective , how it hits has nothing to do with how it plays ,,, The only time a ivory farrule shaft will play as good as a LD shaft is with dead center ball
The second you move away from center the LD shaft is much more predictable
As for golfers their forged clubs have a much bigger sweet spot today ,, and their woods that are no longer wood are double the size and the sweet spot is much much larger
1
I won't play with an ivory jointed cue....ever!!!
I'm not sure, it would seem that it effects the flex of the cue. The only important thing I know it I won't play with an ivory jointed cue ever again......that's about as much as I need to know.
'My Game is the Teacher'
I'm not sure, it would seem that it effects the flex of the cue. The only important thing I know it I won't play with an ivory jointed cue ever again......that's about as much as I need to know.
'My Game is the Teacher'
I'm not sure, it would seem that it effects the flex of the cue. The only important thing I know it I won't play with an ivory jointed cue ever again......that's about as much as I need to know.
More flex = less deflection ..... Ivory would have more flex than steel. Your theory doesn't add up lol. Unless I'm missing something here.
if i recall it correctly, that TAR podcast with johnny archer, Django uses deflection and then shoots the object ball a little thick. he said that if he shot the object ball on it's true angle (going to the pocket) then he would probably miss. on that same podcast, JA also said "i like deflection."
Cole Dickson shot with an ivory ferule. It was my conversations with him regarding what he liked in a cue that led me to do the same. I shoot with a Joss cue with ivory ferule and steel joint made for Cole in the 1980's. The couple of times I hit balls with cues with ivory joints, they did have a more lively feel.