Do you use an aiming system or go by feel?

[bstroud]

It's pretty dead on; that's why I like it. The 30-degree no-throw line hits the pocket midway between the points to within 1/8". Yours looks like the same thing, just skewed a little because of the different CB position.
pj
chgo

Patrick,

Thanks for the clear illustration. The pics represent exactly what I thought was required for a 30 degree setup. If Stan is making the ball he must be changing where he hits the object ball.

On another subject Stan seems to think a straight stroke is impossible.

For 50 years I used to pivot my cue just as I hit the cue ball. It worked fine until I started to play on 4" pockets. Then the margin of error was just too great.

Over the last year I have set up and shot a long diagonal straight in shot. Either stopping the cue ball without side spin or drawing it back into the pocket.
Sometimes I follow it into the pocket. I shoot it hundreds of times each day.

Is it possible that I can do all this without a straight stroke? Am I fooling myself?

Bill S.

 

[stan shuffett]

Patrick,

Thanks for the clear illustration. The pics represent exactly what I thought was required for a 30 degree setup. If Stan is making the ball he must be changing where he hits the object ball.

On another subject Stan seems to think a straight stroke is impossible.

For 50 years I used to pivot my cue just as I hit the cue ball. It worked fine until I started to play on 4" pockets. Then the margin of error was just too great.

Over the last year I have set up and shot a long diagonal straight in shot. Either stopping the cue ball without side spin or drawing it back into the pocket.
Sometimes I follow it into the pocket. I shoot it hundreds of times each day.

Is it possible that I can do all this without a straight stroke? Am I fooling myself?

Bill S.

Bill,

I can demo a straight stroke about as well as humanly possible.

Your comment about me on what I know about straight stroking is out in left field.

Stan Shuffett

 

[Pidge]

Why does this topic create so much animosity, hate, arguments and one sidedness?

I have learned to sit back and enjoy the ride. From what I can see the argument has 2 main parties. One side is he'll bent on tarnishing CTEs rep, the other is he'll bent on keeping and furthering it's rep. It comes down to how does it effect me. Do the Vanish ads on TV effect me when they say it gets products 50% whiter than its main rivals? No, it doesn't. I choose to either buy it and try it, or stick with what I know. If I buy it and realise that in fact, my favourite t-shirt is only 32.251% whiter than my current brand... I go back to using the other brand. I don't take to cleaning product forums and start tarnishing Vanish for it not working as it said on the bottle. That's just... Well, weird. Are those that can't get it to work, haven't tried it, or just enjoy arguing via the Internet weird? IMO yes. Well, not weird as such just pathetic if anything. Why argue? Are you scared that you're missing out on something? Are you scared of facing a CTE user on the table? Are you so up your self that you can't understand how or why it works.... Because after all, you are the smartest on this forum.... Right?

Then you have those that defend it fiercely. None more so that Stan. If I had a product on the market... Let's say it was called Banish... The cheaper cousin of Vanish... And some started out on some kind of boredom vendetta against it, would I sit back and take it? No, I would stand up for my product in a civil and professional manner... Much like Stan does. Now me an Stan aren't on each others Christmas card lists.. Our opinions have crossed but I can safely say he has always debated in a gentlemanly fashion. And that I have respect for. The rest of the CTE fan base haven't been so polite at how they approach it, but when ever CTE gets mentioned and you have the same old people joining in sticking their noses in when all they want to do is discuss CTE with others of the same mindset about it... It must get frustrating. So for that I can empathise with why they come across a bit fanatical. Still, it isn't helping persuade new comers to pick up a copy of the DVD. If they had any sense they wouldn't take the bait, or at least carry them selves in such a way as to come across as the civil of the two parties... It's the best way to attract newbies.

Like I said, I am not going to be getting a Christmas card from Stan this year and I'm not going to be using CTE any time soon. But, I admire how he comes across, how he handles situations when I'd lose it and get banned. I don't understand CTE, I have tried it though and I can say it did work for me. But for someone who hasn't ever struggled with aim, it didn't bring anything to my game. I still struggled with the same old pots... Wiping that thought of uncertainty out of a players mind when down is beyond CTEs control. I still made pots I would usually make. All in all my level of play stayed pretty constant. For me it had some big pros and some big cons. For others it will just be pros and then some others might just see cons about it.... Either way you can't really debate on the matter without actually buying a DVD and giving it a try... Otherwise you just look like an idiot who is just out for an argument.

 

[(((Satori)))]

It comes down to how does it effect me. Do the Vanish ads on TV effect me when they say it gets products 50% whiter than its main rivals? No, it doesn't. I choose to either buy it and try it, or stick with what I know. If I buy it and realise that in fact, my favourite t-shirt is only 32.251% whiter than my current brand... I go back to using the other brand. I don't take to cleaning product forums and start tarnishing Vanish for it not working as it said on the bottle. That's just... Well, weird. Are those that can't get it to work, haven't tried it, or just enjoy arguing via the Internet weird? IMO yes. Well, not weird as such just pathetic if anything. Why argue? Are you scared that you're missing out on something? Are you scared of facing a CTE user on the table? Are you so up your self that you can't understand how or why it works.... Because after all, you are the smartest on this forum.... Right?

It effects me because I bought the dumb dvd's based pretty much on one thing and that was the claim that Bustamante uses CTE. I wanted to see what that was about. Once I got into it and learned all of the total horse shit in the system I realized how much of a joke it was. When I see Stan on here claiming that Corey Deuel uses the system and Dennis etc, it makes me want to point out all of the dumb claims that I found when I tried the system because it is a system based and sold on lies imo. Superstar called Corey up himself to confirm if in fact he used the system and it was a big negative... just like Bustamante's response and no doubt Dennis' etc.

The difference in being pathetic, as you say, and going to a Vanish website is I am already here. Why not tell what I think?

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Pidge:
...you can't really debate on the matter without actually buying a DVD and giving it a try... Otherwise you just look like an idiot who is just out for an argument.

So if I say you can fly, you're an idiot if you won't jump off a building to try it?

Some of us know idiocy when we hear it.

pj
chgo

 

[Pidge]

It effects me because I bought the dumb dvd's based pretty much on one thing and that was the claim that Bustamante uses CTE. I wanted to see what that was about. Once I got into it and learned all of the total horse shit in the system I realized how much of a joke it was. When I see Stan on here claiming that Corey Deuel uses the system and Dennis etc, it makes me want to point out all of the dumb claims that I found when I tried the system because it is a system based and sold on lies imo. Superstar called Corey up himself to confirm if in fact he used the system and it was a big negative... just like Bustamante's response and no doubt Dennis' etc.

The difference in being pathetic, as you say, and going to a Vanish website is I am already here. Why not tell what I think?

You bought the DVD, you're entitled to your opinion. What's pathetic is buying something based on someone telling you a professional uses it. Did you expect to play like Corey after? This is what I see with people who bought the DVD and didn't like it. They're expecting to see a big jump in their level of play but it just doesn't work like that. Over time it will tell you where you are going wrong in your delivery and then you can work towards fixing it. I see aiming systems not as a means to improve, but as a way to improve consistency. You will either consistently pot balls if you have a solid fundamental base to rely on or you will consistently miss balls if not.

 

[Straightpool_99]

I had a fun idea. This is something I do when I find a good view of a pro player's stroke. This video might also shed some light on what Stan does to pocket a ball (but probably not!).

Here's Stan's original video called CTE Straightens Out the Shot Part 2:

https://youtu.be/orMhr2ezftA

Here's a video analysis I did last night. Hope you find it interesting.

https://youtu.be/wpljeVvOqRs

Great post. This confirmed my long held suspicions..

 

[Pidge]

So if I say you can fly, you're an idiot if you won't jump off a building to try it?

Some of us know idiocy when we hear it.

pj
chgo

Difference is people saying CTE works are potting balls. If you said I can fly, and I saw 100s of others jumping off and flying... I would first try jumping off a small wall. You know... Just to test it out. Have you jumped off a small metaphorical wall with CTE, Pat to the Rick? Of course not. You're just too damn smart and instantly know it doesn't work.

 

[stan shuffett]

It effects me because I bought the dumb dvd's based pretty much on one thing and that was the claim that Bustamante uses CTE. I wanted to see what that was about. Once I got into it and learned all of the total horse shit in the system I realized how much of a joke it was. When I see Stan on here claiming that Corey Deuel uses the system and Dennis etc, it makes me want to point out all of the dumb claims that I found when I tried the system because it is a system based and sold on lies imo. Superstar called Corey up himself to confirm if in fact he used the system and it was a big negative... just like Bustamante's response and no doubt Dennis' etc.

The difference in being pathetic, as you say, and going to a Vanish website is I am already here. Why not tell what I think?

All you have is your arrow slinging!

You can debate me at a table anytime you want to arrange it......You can bring your dirty mouth to the table, too, as that is about all that I can see that you have for ammunition.

Stan Shuffett

 

[(((Satori)))]

You bought the DVD, you're entitled to your opinion. What's pathetic is buying something based on someone telling you a professional uses it. Did you expect to play like Corey after? This is what I see with people who bought the DVD and didn't like it. They're expecting to see a big jump in their level of play but it just doesn't work like that. Over time it will tell you where you are going wrong in your delivery and then you can work towards fixing it. I see aiming systems not as a means to improve, but as a way to improve consistency. You will either consistently pot balls if you have a solid fundamental base to rely on or you will consistently miss balls if not.

No you are wrong. It has nothing to do with the improvement that I did not see. It has everything to do with the lies.

 

[ENGLISH!]

Why does this topic create so much animosity, hate, arguments and one sidedness?

I have learned to sit back and enjoy the ride. From what I can see the argument has 2 main parties. One side is he'll bent on tarnishing CTEs rep, the other is he'll bent on keeping and furthering it's rep. It comes down to how does it effect me. Do the Vanish ads on TV effect me when they say it gets products 50% whiter than its main rivals? No, it doesn't. I choose to either buy it and try it, or stick with what I know. If I buy it and realise that in fact, my favourite t-shirt is only 32.251% whiter than my current brand... I go back to using the other brand. I don't take to cleaning product forums and start tarnishing Vanish for it not working as it said on the bottle. That's just... Well, weird. Are those that can't get it to work, haven't tried it, or just enjoy arguing via the Internet weird? IMO yes. Well, not weird as such just pathetic if anything. Why argue? Are you scared that you're missing out on something? Are you scared of facing a CTE user on the table? Are you so up your self that you can't understand how or why it works.... Because after all, you are the smartest on this forum.... Right?

Then you have those that defend it fiercely. None more so that Stan. If I had a product on the market... Let's say it was called Banish... The cheaper cousin of Vanish... And some started out on some kind of boredom vendetta against it, would I sit back and take it? No, I would stand up for my product in a civil and professional manner... Much like Stan does. Now me an Stan aren't on each others Christmas card lists.. Our opinions have crossed but I can safely say he has always debated in a gentlemanly fashion. And that I have respect for. The rest of the CTE fan base haven't been so polite at how they approach it, but when ever CTE gets mentioned and you have the same old people joining in sticking their noses in when all they want to do is discuss CTE with others of the same mindset about it... It must get frustrating. So for that I can empathise with why they come across a bit fanatical. Still, it isn't helping persuade new comers to pick up a copy of the DVD. If they had any sense they wouldn't take the bait, or at least carry them selves in such a way as to come across as the civil of the two parties... It's the best way to attract newbies.

Like I said, I am not going to be getting a Christmas card from Stan this year and I'm not going to be using CTE any time soon. But, I admire how he comes across, how he handles situations when I'd lose it and get banned. I don't understand CTE, I have tried it though and I can say it did work for me. But for someone who hasn't ever struggled with aim, it didn't bring anything to my game. I still struggled with the same old pots... Wiping that thought of uncertainty out of a players mind when down is beyond CTEs control. I still made pots I would usually make. All in all my level of play stayed pretty constant. For me it had some big pros and some big cons. For others it will just be pros and then some others might just see cons about it.... Either way you can't really debate on the matter without actually buying a DVD and giving it a try... Otherwise you just look like an idiot who is just out for an argument.

Pidge,

CTE has been out here & on You Tube so much so that basically anyone can get a fair idea of what it is & what has been said about it.

One does not have to leave the planet, but instead can make a few key observations & then apply intelligent, logical, rational, critical thinking & conclude that the earth is not flat but instead 'round' in its nature.

One does not have to continually travel around it looking for the edge from which to fall.

Pythagoras is probably the 1st. Greek that 'knew' that the world was 'round' in about 500 B.C. & he did NOT have to buy a DVD that said the earth was flat in order to figure that out.

I could agree with much of what you were saying until you got to that point.

Best Wishes.

 

[stan shuffett]

No you are wrong. It has nothing to do with the improvement that I did not see. It has everything to do with the lies.

What it has to do with is the SUCCESS of CTE PRO ONE.......and the fact that you and your cohorts can not put out the fire. I am still standing after 8 years. And the closer that CTE inches toward its tipping point, the larger the frenzy becomes. I don't mind being the target at all. There are some sweet days ahead.....
Thanks for your opposition......my book will be that much stronger for it...

Stan Shuffett

 

[bstroud]

Bill,

I can demo a straight stroke about as well as humanly possible.

Your comment about me on what I know about straight stroking is out in left field.

Stan Shuffett

If that is true why don't you use it? Do you find that spinning the cue ball works better for you?

I am not criticizing just interested.

Bill S.

 

[stan shuffett]

Pidge,

CTE has been out here & on You Tube so much so that basically anyone can get a fair idea of what it is & what has been said about it.

One does not have to leave the planet, but instead can make a few key observations & then apply intelligent, logical, rational, critical thinking & conclude that the earth is not flat but instead 'round' in its nature.

One does not have to continually travel around it looking for the edge from which to fall.

Pythagoras is probably the 1st. Greek that 'knew' that the world was 'round' in about 500 B.C. & he did NOT have to buy a DVD that said the earth was flat in order to figure that out.

I could agree with much of what you were saying until you got to that point.

Best Wishes.

Here is something to chew on....

I have been at CTE for nearly a decade.....at a table not a keyboard.
The visuals and pivots are good to go....the foundation is solid...

But some bottom line insights and info that I never let up on will come to light.....and you and your tag team will be flat on your tails and I will be standing taller than ever with the CTE banner held higher and higher and PROUD in every way, so much so that I might even pop.

Stan Shuffett

 

[stan shuffett]

If that is true why don't you use it? Do you find that spinning the cue ball works better for you?

I am not criticizing just interested.

Bill S.

I do and you do TOO!

Stan Shuffett

 

[ENGLISH!]

Difference is people saying CTE works are potting balls. If you said I can fly, and I saw 100s of others jumping off and flying... I would first try jumping off a small wall. You know... Just to test it out. Have you jumped off a small metaphorical wall with CTE, Pat to the Rick? Of course not. You're just too damn smart and instantly know it doesn't work.

That's not true about me. I did try it & was impressed with some shots that fit the 'prescription' but rather quickly came to realize that there were issues.

Then when I saw the 5 shots perception YouTube video by Stan, I knew that there would be NOTHING forth coming to explain or show that is any king of totally objective system or method.

As I've said, if that assertion we to be retracted then IMO most, if not all, of the hub bub would disappear.

Then things could be much like you outlined. It's a method, try it you might like it or you might not.

BUT... That assertion buts it into a completely different realm from ALL other methods.

Quite simply... it is not what that assertion says that it is & anyone considering trying it should know that going in or... at least know that that assertion as not been proven not unproven.

If they know that going in then they go in without the pull of that assertion & that's fine.

Best Wishes.

PS I'll say it again.

If anyone wants to or is considering buying & trying CTE they should do as they wish but should know that the assertion that it is a totally objective 'system' has not been proven nor unproven.

 

[JoeyInCali]

Here is something to chew on....

I have been at CTE for nearly a decade.....at a table not a keyboard.
The visuals and pivots are good to go....the foundation is solid...

But some bottom line insights and info that I never let up on will come to light.....and you and your tag team will be flat on your tails and I will be standing taller than ever with the CTE banner held higher and higher and PROUD in every way, so much so that I might even pop.

Stan Shuffett

Stan,
Who are qualified to teach it ?
Have you seen anyone MISREPRESENT IT ?
When is the book coming out ?

 

[(((Satori)))]

What it has to do with is the SUCCESS of CTE PRO ONE.......and the fact that you and your cohorts can not put out the fire. I am still standing after 8 years. And the closer that CTE inches toward its tipping point, the larger the frenzy becomes. I don't mind being the target at all. There are some sweet days ahead.....
Thanks for your opposition......my book will be that much stronger for it...

Stan Shuffett

No you are wrong too. I could care less how successful you are. I doubt that there really is a fire but hey if there is then whatever. Makes no difference to me.

 

[Straightpool_99]

You bought the DVD, you're entitled to your opinion. What's pathetic is buying something based on someone telling you a professional uses it. Did you expect to play like Corey after? This is what I see with people who bought the DVD and didn't like it. They're expecting to see a big jump in their level of play but it just doesn't work like that. Over time it will tell you where you are going wrong in your delivery and then you can work towards fixing it. I see aiming systems not as a means to improve, but as a way to improve consistency. You will either consistently pot balls if you have a solid fundamental base to rely on or you will consistently miss balls if not.

Why would anyone buy any aiming system? Because they want to improve that's why! And some of us put a great deal of work in, to achieve just that. We are not all D players who can't run 3 balls, you know.. A large part of Stans and Hals claims were that pros were secretly or unknowingly using CTE... Of course it's silly to buy stuff based on the claims in the commercial, but for a long time prior to myself buying CTE DVD 1, the forum had been SPAMMED by shills and fanboys about how wonderful CTE was and how it was going to change your game. Then some of us decided, hey lets check it out, I might be missing out here. Maybe I can move up my skill just one ball, even half a ball...I tried and tested it EXTENSIVELY, and guess what, there were problems with it. The improvement did happen, but only after ditching aiming systems.

Should all the unsatisfied customers now shut up and bow our heads in shame? NO, because being bullied into silence is not the right way to deal with stuff like this. A friend of mine bought a vacuum cleaner off the tv that looked like some sort of alien tehcnology and promised to be the greatest vacuum cleaner ever. After paying dearly it turned out that it was just another vacuum cleaner, only 3 times as expensive and noisy. Of course his story made me chuckle, but in a sense we've all been tricked by advertising and will continue to be... We were stupid to believe this crap, I'll grant you that, but there is no reason not to expose what we consider to be problems. When people are demonstrating CTE, pocketing balls, while looking like they are trying to parry a forward thrust from a longsword, then maybe it isn't quite as perfect as they claim...I would say that stroke anomalies like that is proof that you are aligned/aimed incorrectly, and at the last moment your subconscious corrects the aim...

 

[(((Satori)))]

Why would anyone buy any aiming system? Because they want to improve that's why! And some of us put a great deal of work in, to achieve just that. We are not all D players who can't run 3 balls, you know.. A large part of Stans and Hals claims were that pros were secretly or unknowingly using CTE... Of course it's silly to buy stuff based on the claims in the commercial, but for a long time prior to myself buying CTE DVD 1, the forum had been SPAMMED by shills and fanboys about how wonderful CTE was and how it was going to change your game. Then some of us decided, hey lets check it out, I might be missing out here. Maybe I can move up my skill just one ball, even half a ball...I tried and tested it EXTENSIVELY, and guess what, there were problems with it. The improvement did happen, but only after ditching aiming systems.

Should all the unsatisfied customers now shut up and bow our heads in shame? NO, because being bullied into silence is not the right way to deal with stuff like this. A friend of mine bought a vacuum cleaner off the tv that looked like some sort of alien tehcnology and promised to be the greatest vacuum cleaner ever. After paying dearly it turned out that it was just another vacuum cleaner, only 3 times as expensive and noisy. Of course his story made me chuckle, but in a sense we've all been tricked by advertising and will continue to be... We were stupid to believe this crap, I'll grant you that, but there is no reason not to expose what we consider to be problems. When people are demonstrating CTE, pocketing balls, while looking like they are trying to parry a forward thrust from a longsword, then maybe it isn't quite as perfect as they claim...I would say that stroke anomalies like that is proof that you are aligned/aimed incorrectly, and at the last moment your subconscious corrects the aim...

Great post.