Dominant Eye vs Cut Angle Perception

Pidge

Pidge

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I was wondering if having a dominant eye affects the way you perceive certain cut angles and more to the point cut angles to the opposite side. For example im left eye dominant and miss cuts to the right more often than to the left. I tend to hit them thick if I'm not concentrating, where as left cuts require no concetration I just get down.

I stand in the same position for both left and right cuts and I can "feel" my right eye taking over in the vizualisation process with cuts to the right, so I have to conciously focus my attention to my left eye and almost force it to take over. I've been experimenting with different body positions whilst behind the shot and its worked quite well, but in game situations where I'm in the zone my PSR that's been the same for 15 years takes over and its back to my right eye screwing things up for me!

Anyone else had a similar problem in their game?
 
Very frustrating

Pidge said:
I was wondering if having a dominant eye affects the way you perceive certain cut angles and more to the point cut angles to the opposite side. For example im left eye dominant and miss cuts to the right more often than to the left. I tend to hit them thick if I'm not concentrating, where as left cuts require no concetration I just get down.

I stand in the same position for both left and right cuts and I can "feel" my right eye taking over in the vizualisation process with cuts to the right, so I have to conciously focus my attention to my left eye and almost force it to take over. I've been experimenting with different body positions whilst behind the shot and its worked quite well, but in game situations where I'm in the zone my PSR that's been the same for 15 years takes over and its back to my right eye screwing things up for me!

Anyone else had a similar problem in their game?
Click to expand...

I suffer from this...i shoot right handed, but I'm left eye dominant. For whatever reason, my right eye wants to lead sometimes. I know when it happens, cuz I miss every shot I take...even straight in shots...I have to remind myself to bring my head over my cue far enough to line my left eye up with cue.

I haven't noticed it more with left cuts vs right cuts, but I will tell you it really affects your break. When my right eye is trying to lead, I'm not breaking the rack square, nor getting a square hit dead center on cue ball. My challenge is that I only practice one night a week. Maybe 2 hrs. Not long enough to work thru these issues, but knowing they are there, I can correct it quickly and on the fly. I close my rt eye during each shot when it's happening, re-align, open both, stroke and fire.

So frustrating.
 
your expieriences are absolutely correct!
Important is to have your dominant eye behind cue ball and ghost ball ( in case you do not use other aiming systems) and bend down keeping your dominant eye on your sighting line otherwise there is a danger that your non dominant eye takes over!
Beeing in your set position your dominant eye ( depending how strong dominant you are) should be centered over your shaft and behind the center of the cue ball.
I have just recenrly build a device (training tool for pool and snooker) that helps you finding your individual perfect eye position. This is valid for straight shots and for cut sots to the right and left too...
Any kind of shot is the same by the way as the eye has to be on the sighting line. Watch the video clip
In case you have questions just shoot me an e-mail: info@infinite-billiards.com
The Eyeliner:
http://youtu.be/OllrVYCmz_Q
 
Pidge said:
I was wondering if having a dominant eye affects the way you perceive certain cut angles and more to the point cut angles to the opposite side. For example im left eye dominant and miss cuts to the right more often than to the left. I tend to hit them thick if I'm not concentrating, where as left cuts require no concetration I just get down.
Click to expand...
It is not so important which eye might be "dominant" or not. What is important is that you have your personal "vision center" aligned properly. For more info, including useful video demonstrations on how to do this, see the vision center resource page.

Regards,
Dave
 
I have done tests with 237 players using the eyeliner in the last 6 months. All of them that tried ( not one ecxeption) had to have their nose centered over the shaft ( these were players that sighted with both eyes) or had to have their respective dominant eye exactly over the shaft and behind the center line of the eyeliner to perceive the correct center of the cue ball and the point of aim at the object ball on a true straight line using my device.
I respect you a lot Dr.Dave but I concur with your opinion... Or is what you say the same?
In case someone has a dominant eye he should have it over the shaft and perfectly behind the center of the cue ball imho.

I can't look through the eyes of my students, but the eyeliner gives you a perfect and objective picture...
Ekkes
 
Perfect Aim takes care of this...........

I've been teaching and traveling around the country for the last 4 years now teaching players that they all have this problem.

If the player is left eye dominant they cut the ball too thick when they cut to the right and if they are right eye dominant they cut the ball too thick when they cut to the left.

We are all the same with the exception of players that have monocular vision. Shoot with only one eye.

The problem you are speaking of here has been understood by many players and teachers for years but no one had ever figured out how to really cure the problem.

The biggest problem is to first show the player that they have this trouble and only then can i show them how to fix it.

Just yesterday I showed Fred in Peoria. Fred and Jay have the pool school there. I showed them exactly what you are talking about here.

Then in Bloomington last night I showed Mike, he's Pool 101 on AZ billiards here and also teaches and has a website, teachpool.com..

Both of these teachers were amazed as everyone always is, not only to see the problem but learn how to correct it. Mike already knew he had the trouble and almost couldn't believe how easy it was too fix.

This is why I travel and teach. To show players everywhere to play better than ever before with a technique that helps them envision the shots correctly therefor getting the correct picture to the brain so the body can do it's thing.

Perfect Aim was and is a first in the pool world.

Some top player/teachers around the world are now teaching Perfect Aim with their own little twist to it but it is still Perfect aim.

But the bottom line is the ones that are now teaching it are helping players everywhere play better than ever before.

If anyone out there thinks the dominant eye doesn't matter when your aiming a pool shot they need to think again.

On my website I have hundreds of players around the country trying to tell everyone how well this works.

Perfect Aim is the real deal and you will to play better pool in a few short hours of once you learn and understand it.

I feel like a preacher that keeps on giving the same sermon over and over and over with the right message and only a few listen and hear it from time to time........
 
Thanks for the input guys. If I have my left eye over my shaft, what I perceive to be centre ball is infact around 3/4 of a tip of right english, and the reverse applies with my right eye over the shaft.

I must mention my method of aiming is parallel aiming. So I use my dominant eye to draw a mental line from pocket to OB, then parallel shift that line through the centre of CB to find both contact points then to align both contact points. I can not do this with my left eye shut, but I can with my right eye shut. Once I've found the line the CB needs to travel I get down on the shot with my nose pointing down that line and shaft pressed against my chin.

I've found this way of aiming completely removes this problem, as long as my left eye does all the "figuring" out whilst I'm stood up. I've not used this method of aiming for almost 10 years but I came back to it after the frustration. In a 3 hour session I made a couple of centuries and don't recall missing a right cut that wasn't pretty tough. Ill keep up with this and see if the problem creeps back into my game.
 
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theUBC said:
I have done tests with 237 players using the eyeliner in the last 6 months. All of them that tried ( not one ecxeption) had to have their nose centered over the shaft ( these were players that sighted with both eyes) or had to have their respective dominant eye exactly over the shaft and behind the center line of the eyeliner to perceive the correct center of the cue ball and the point of aim at the object ball on a true straight line using my device.
I respect you a lot Dr.Dave but I concur with your opinion... Or is what you say the same?
Click to expand...
I don't like to use the phrase "dominant eye" because it can be misleading and some people place too much emphasis on the role "ocular dominance" plays in pool. For more info, see the "dominant eye" resource page.

Most people have a "dominant eye" (i.e., they have "ocular dominance"), but many of these people will perceive CB center and the line of the shot better with the cue directly between their eyes. Some people (e.g., with strong eye dominance or visual impairment in one eye) will perceive everything better with the cue directly beneath their dominant eye. However, other people will perceive CB center and the line of the shot better with the cue somewhere in between the eyes but not centered. The key is for each individual to determine their own personal optimal head position. I call this position the "vision center." I think the best way to find your "vision center" is to use the drills and procedures demonstrated in the videos on the "vision center" resource page. Also important is how one sights a shot. For more info, see the sighting resource page.

Regards,
Dave
 
Just give me a call..............

I will help you understand how and why what you are doing is working.

I still do the phone free phone lessons.

Just be by a table and give me a call late in the afternoon or evening and I'll run you through.it.

I will help you see exactly what each eye is doing so you can totally understand the hows and whys.

Looking forward to your call. 715-563-8712.............
 
I noticed the same kind of thing over the weekend. I went to a friend's place for the first time where he has a tight 8' Valley. He wanted to sort of play a HORSE type game. I shoot lefty, but think I am right-eye dominant(I'm normally right-handed). Well, he set up a shot, a cut to the left from about a diamond up and over/right from the center of the end rail, with the OB about another diamond up and over, cutting all the way down. I drove it into the rail almost half the time out of 10 tries. A little later, he set up the same shot on the left side of the table, thinking that he knew my weakness. He flubbed it in a similar fashion, but not as badly, while I nailed 10 of 10. That was a frustrating experience, but made it pretty obviously where some of my problems lay. :(
 
dr_dave said:
I don't like to use the phrase "dominant eye" because it can be misleading and some people place too much emphasis on the role "ocular dominance" plays in pool. For more info, see the "dominant eye" resource page.

Most people have a "dominant eye" (i.e., they have "ocular dominance"), but many of these people will perceive CB center and the line of the shot better with the cue directly between their eyes. Some people (e.g., with strong eye dominance or visual impairment in one eye) will perceive everything better with the cue directly beneath their dominant eye. However, other people will perceive CB center and the line of the shot better with the cue somewhere in between the eyes but not centered. The key is for each individual to determine their own personal optimal head position. I call this position the "vision center." I think the best way to find your "vision center" is to use the drills and procedures demonstrated in the videos on the "vision center" resource page. Also important is how one sights a shot. For more info, see the sighting resource page.

Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...


Good info Dr Dave, I could never identify a 'dominant eye' through the tests I've seen posted, sometimes it comes up right eye, sometimes left eye. This is doing it many times at different times, I've even tried to do it quickly on a spur of the moment to try and avoid consciously willing myself to one eye. If my 'vision center' is somewhere in between then that makes sense. I'm left handed and shoot right handed also FWIW...
 
I've noticed that cutting one direction over the other the 'correct' angle looks different to me. It is easiest for me to notice this by shooting a ball down the rail first on one side of the table and then on the other. However, much like what Pidge mentioned, if I take a line from my desired pocket through the object ball to the contact point and then take a line from that contact point to my cue ball the problem seems to go away on its own. If instead I make a shot down one rail and try to mentally hit that same point while shooting down the other rail it's a no go every time.

I always shoot with my head centered over the cue. I forget who but Randy G showed me video once of a female pro who shoots right handed but plays with her left eye over the cue - looks really odd but it must work for her.
 
Some players have the cue under their chin in between the eyes but look across the line of aim with the tip of the nose and therefore bring their more dominant eye more over the shaft. (Or the tilt theor head slightly)
@Dr.Dave: I think, we are talking about the same but we are just using different termini...

In case you are interested in testing the eyeliner for yourself or any of your students just shoot me an e-mail or pm
Ekkes
 
I played some UK 8 ball tonight and decided to give having my dominant eye over the shaft a try. It didn't work. I couldn't find centre ball and that just cast doubt over the shot which ruined my stroke on a shot. Then I tried doing it with a "side on" stance, compared to my normal "square" stance. It worked a little better but again I couldn't find centre ball.

If Gene or UBC are ever in the UK drop me a message because I'd love to have a few lessons with you guys but for now I'm going to stick with parallel aiming.
 
How to find out which dominant eye you are...

Kaiser Bob said:
Good info Dr Dave, I could never identify a 'dominant eye' through the tests I've seen posted, sometimes it comes up right eye, sometimes left eye. This is doing it many times at different times, I've even tried to do it quickly on a spur of the moment to try and avoid consciously willing myself to one eye. If my 'vision center' is somewhere in between then that makes sense. I'm left handed and shoot right handed also FWIW...
Click to expand...

The way I found out was while taking hunter safety thru DNR with my son 5 yrs ago...

You start with your hands fully extended out in front of you, as far as you can reach forward...like your holding a dinner plate out in front of you, as if you were looking at your reflection in the plate...
You focus on a small item across the room while holding your hands out in front of you...
As you are looking at the small item, you start to close your hands together...starting with the size of a dinner plate, getting smaller and smaller until you've got a hole you can barely see the small item thru, them ...start bringing your hands up to your face, while never losing sight of the small item, until your hands reach your face...the hole in your hands will be over your dominant eye at this point.
 
8onthebreak said:
The way I found out was while taking hunter safety thru DNR with my son 5 yrs ago...

You start with your hands fully extended out in front of you, as far as you can reach forward...like your holding a dinner plate out in front of you, as if you were looking at your reflection in the plate...
You focus on a small item across the room while holding your hands out in front of you...
As you are looking at the small item, you start to close your hands together...starting with the size of a dinner plate, getting smaller and smaller until you've got a hole you can barely see the small item thru, them ...start bringing your hands up to your face, while never losing sight of the small item, until your hands reach your face...the hole in your hands will be over your dominant eye at this point.
Click to expand...

Looks like I'm right eye dominant, thanks! +Rep
 
Pidge said:
Thanks for the input guys. If I have my left eye over my shaft, what I perceive to be centre ball is infact around 3/4 of a tip of right english, and the reverse applies with my right eye over the shaft.

I must mention my method of aiming is parallel aiming. So I use my dominant eye to draw a mental line from pocket to OB, then parallel shift that line through the centre of CB to find both contact points then to align both contact points. I can not do this with my left eye shut, but I can with my right eye shut. Once I've found the line the CB needs to travel I get down on the shot with my nose pointing down that line and shaft pressed against my chin.

I've found this way of aiming completely removes this problem, as long as my left eye does all the "figuring" out whilst I'm stood up. I've not used this method of aiming for almost 10 years but I came back to it after the frustration. In a 3 hour session I made a couple of centuries and don't recall missing a right cut that wasn't pretty tough. Ill keep up with this and see if the problem creeps back into my game.
Click to expand...

It sounds like you determine the contact point on the OB and then align the corresponding contact point on the CB..do you do this while standing and continue that line/stance when down on the shot?

On a cut shot, especially on a thin cut, the CP to CP line will be away from the center of the CB and you need to shift the cue parallel from that line in order to get the cue/tip to the center of the CB. This isn't that easy to do and a slight angle off from parallel will change the cut angle.

I wonder how you accomplish this parallel shift?

I often aim CP to CP while standing, using my cue on that line so that my eye/s can determine if I am (exactly) on that line and not affected by parallax. I hold the cue at my right side for I am right handed. I then move the cue parallel to the center of the CB and then move my eye/s and body aligned to the new location of the cue (resting on the table) and then drop down on the shot. Without English, I should be able to accomplish the desired shot...even with my eyes closed for I am in the correct stance for the shot.

This method is geometrically correct, not that anyone cares, and if you miss the shot, you can blame the parallel shift not being exact...or your stroke.

Thanks for the thread.:smile:
 
Ah nice, I believe this is why I would perceive certain shots to be in, and then have it miss off into the rail near the corner instead, next time I hit the pool hool, I'm going to see if I can debug my head position.
 
LAMas said:
It sounds like you determine the contact point on the OB and then align the corresponding contact point on the CB..do you do this while standing and continue that line/stance when down on the shot?

On a cut shot, especially on a thin cut, the CP to CP line will be away from the center of the CB and you need to shift the cue parallel from that line in order to get the cue/tip to the center of the CB. This isn't that easy to do and a slight angle off from parallel will change the cut angle.

I wonder how you accomplish this parallel shift?

I often aim CP to CP while standing, using my cue on that line so that my eye/s can determine if I am (exactly) on that line and not affected by parallax. I hold the cue at my right side for I am right handed. I then move the cue parallel to the center of the CB and then move my eye/s and body aligned to the new location of the cue (resting on the table) and then drop down on the shot. Without English, I should be able to accomplish the desired shot...even with my eyes closed for I am in the correct stance for the shot.

This method is geometrically correct, not that anyone cares, and if you miss the shot, you can blame the parallel shift not being exact...or your stroke.

Thanks for the thread.:smile:
Click to expand...
I do everything whilst stood up, whilst I'm down on a shot I just think about the speed and trust my initial alignment.

After I've got both contact points I place my right foot (being right handed) on the contact point to contact point line with my toes pointing down that line. Next my left foot moves out, 90 degrees parallel to my right foot with my toes pointing slightly outwards. Then whilst my eyes go from CB contact point to OB contact point (continuously, until I'm down) I just move down into centre ball, which for some reason is always parallel to the CP line. If I'm using english then everything is the same but when I get down on the shot I just angle my cue slightly depending on how much english and the distance. I guess this is the equivalent to BHE, but I do it whilst bending down into the shot, rather than when down.

The one problem with this is that it slows my play down a bit. I was using Pro1 for years before but it doesn't work with UK Pool due to the CB being smaller than the OBs. And I remember when I started using Pro1 it really slowed my game down. I'm sure after a month I will be able to have both contact points locked in my head within a couple seconds.
 
Pidge

"...In a 3 hour session I made a couple of centuries..."

Do you give lessons?

I like how you aim...great results. I wonder how many here can run centuries?

Be well.:smile::thumbup:
 
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