Price is not an issue, I just don't know which one will suit me best. I play exclusively on bar tables and I'm not that good (APA 5 in 8-ball, don't play 9-ball) but always looking to improve. Just really racking my brain figuring out which one to get before I spend $200+.
Don't know if I should get an OB1, OB2, OB Classic, 314-2, or Z-2
- Thread starter Magyar19
- Start date
Really depends on what you like.... I have played with the Predator stuff and The OB stuff... I started out on the Predator wagon when they first came on the market... I think I single handedly made em swap to short ferrules based on the number of them I broke... They were great back in the day on customer service but that may have changed. I have had no personal interactions with them on that front...
I tried to swap to the OB1 when it came out and it felt different than the 1st Gen pred shafts I had so I didn't convert...
I quit playing because my eyes were getting bad and gave away my 1st gen shafts and when I came back I had to buy a new pred 314 and it had changed some but a little adjustment by a cuemaker friend and it was pretty good but not the same....
I had tried the Z2 but it felt too soft.....
I ended up playing several years with the Predator BK2... According to a deflection test I found the BK2 shaft actually had the same deflection as the original 314 shafts I didn't have a clue as to why I liked the BK2 but it matched years of mental images....
OB then decided to introduce something that changed my mind completely... The Classic and Classic Pro added feel back to LD... As far as I am concerned that was the best move they could have made... IF you are swapping from solid maple I'd say go OB Classic... I love the OB Classic Pro but some people don't like the smaller diameter shaft/tip..
$.02 worth of nothing
Chris
I tried to swap to the OB1 when it came out and it felt different than the 1st Gen pred shafts I had so I didn't convert...
I quit playing because my eyes were getting bad and gave away my 1st gen shafts and when I came back I had to buy a new pred 314 and it had changed some but a little adjustment by a cuemaker friend and it was pretty good but not the same....
I had tried the Z2 but it felt too soft.....
I ended up playing several years with the Predator BK2... According to a deflection test I found the BK2 shaft actually had the same deflection as the original 314 shafts I didn't have a clue as to why I liked the BK2 but it matched years of mental images....
OB then decided to introduce something that changed my mind completely... The Classic and Classic Pro added feel back to LD... As far as I am concerned that was the best move they could have made... IF you are swapping from solid maple I'd say go OB Classic... I love the OB Classic Pro but some people don't like the smaller diameter shaft/tip..
$.02 worth of nothing
Chris
I've had the OB 2 and Classic pro I say hands down the Classic pro. Classic pro has much more feel and feed back to me, stiffer hit. OB 2 is softer more finesse hit which fits others games well. Depends how you play I guess
I've used to play with a 12.75mm 314-2, then turned to a 12.5mm 314-2. Didn't like the feel (or lack thereof) so I gave the 11.75mm Z2 a try for a long while. It wasn't until I played with Classic and Classic Pro's from OB that I personally prefer over ANY LD shaft. So here it goes based on experience:
OB1 = Predator 314-2
OB2 = Z2
OB Classic = Jacoby Edge/Hybrid or BD SS360
OB Classic Pro - A league of it's own
My .0000000000002 and 1/1000th grain of salt.
OB1 = Predator 314-2
OB2 = Z2
OB Classic = Jacoby Edge/Hybrid or BD SS360
OB Classic Pro - A league of it's own
My .0000000000002 and 1/1000th grain of salt.
Chris:
I agree with you completely. I'm an OB Classic convert myself. You nailed it when you said OB "added feel back to LD" -- which was my biggest beef with engineered (read: laminated and cored-out) shafts. They previously hit like wet noodles to me.
Then I tried an OB Classic / Classic Pro, and I immediately liked it. I personally like the Classic Pro (which OB strangely renamed to just "Pro" but still ship "Classic Pro" decals for use with those blanks), because I prefer the European straight taper and small-diameter tip.
But getting back to the OP's question, if the OP is an admitted APA 5 in 8-ball, I honestly don't see the reason he wants to "burn" $200 just for having an engineered shaft. Unless it's for psychosomatic reasons? Me personally, I'd use those funds on a couple hours / half-day lesson with a PBIA-certified instructor, to get something that lasts much longer than the temporary euphoria that the "newness illness" (i.e. a new shaft or new cue) provides. I.e. get knowledge and a sound/reliable/repeatable stroke for that $200. But that's me.
-Sean <-- still thinks the best money he ever spent was on lessons those decades ago -- that's how long that investment lasted
I've shot with the Z2, 314-2, OB1, OB Classic, and Jacoby Edge Hybrid. I like the Jacoby and OB Classic the best. The OB1 was a little too soft feeling but I shot great with it, 314-2 felt weird and seemed hard to put top spin on the cb, Z2 was too skinny.
If you have a 3/8 x 10 pin there is a guy on here selling a Mike Webb LD shaft in the for sale section that will play amazing. I was just playing around with my friends cue that has that shaft on it, great feeling hit.
Predator Z2 gets my vote. I've shot with the OB1,2, (not the pro) and the 314^2 and Z^2 and I think the Z^2 is actually your best bet. I own the predator shafts, I've only played a few hours with the OB and they feel good too, but different.
I'm not particularly good either, I'm a 6 in APA but getting a Z^2 shaft has certainly increased my game. With a 11.75mm tip and LD properties, I'm constantly forced into focus shot by shot because the cuetip placement on the cueball has to be very precise. The smallest bit of unintended english on the cueball will throw your object ball out of your intended trajectory and if you're playing on a tight table or 9 foot table, forget about making your shot...
I'll say again, Z^2 in my opinion because you're forced into a very high level of concentration if you want to pocket your shot. It will slow your game down in a positive way, and in time you'll find yourself focusing much better on your shot and inevitably improve. It's a great training tool in itself! :thumbup:
(I also have a 314^2 and honestly I probably play better with it because it allows for a larger margin of error when striking the cueball, but I really do love how the Z^2 really shows the imperfections of your stroke like whether you have a tendency to throw balls to the left or right on longer straight, stop shots.)
my .02$
I'm not particularly good either, I'm a 6 in APA but getting a Z^2 shaft has certainly increased my game. With a 11.75mm tip and LD properties, I'm constantly forced into focus shot by shot because the cuetip placement on the cueball has to be very precise. The smallest bit of unintended english on the cueball will throw your object ball out of your intended trajectory and if you're playing on a tight table or 9 foot table, forget about making your shot...
I'll say again, Z^2 in my opinion because you're forced into a very high level of concentration if you want to pocket your shot. It will slow your game down in a positive way, and in time you'll find yourself focusing much better on your shot and inevitably improve. It's a great training tool in itself! :thumbup:
(I also have a 314^2 and honestly I probably play better with it because it allows for a larger margin of error when striking the cueball, but I really do love how the Z^2 really shows the imperfections of your stroke like whether you have a tendency to throw balls to the left or right on longer straight, stop shots.)
my .02$
If I could go back in time and change something when I was still learning pool,
it would be to invest in one of these shafts. You're going to get some people telling
you it's a waste, or it isn't necessary at your current skill level. This isn't correct.
Here's why.
First - understand what you're really buying. The shaft reduces deflection on moderate to heavy spin shots.
This will change your line of aim on those shots. That's it.
You're buying a different line of aim.
You're not buying extra spin, perfect draw, better cueball control, more 'finesse', and so on.
That stuff's all wishful thinking. The shaft is ONLY changing where you aim spin shots.
So why is buying a different line of aim useful for an APA 5?
• With a high deflection shaft, some shots look really weird if you have to hit them with lots of spin.
For example you'd normally hit the left side of an object ball if you're cutting it to the right.
But if you load up with tons of inside english, you may need to aim to hit the ball full in the face
(like a straight in shot), or even aim slightly to the right side of the ball.
Even if you hit this shot for the next ten years, aiming to hit the wrong side of the ball
will never quite look normal or natural. Your brain WANTS to aim at the left side of that ball.
With the low deflection shaft you won't need to compensate so much.
You can actually aim almost the way you would without english.
This greatly cuts down the confusion and frustration of hitting those heavy spin shots.
You can hit the ball with a little more confidence because your eyes aren't sending signals
to your brain like "WTF man this doesn't look right at all".
• When you get the new shaft you must relearn your line of aim for these shots.
So why spend the next 2-5 years learning a line of aim that compensates for deflection,
then buy the LD shaft and have several years of 'incorrect' aiming lines burned into your memory?
It will just make it harder to adjust. You don't need to be an APA7/9 to get the benefit of an LD shaft.
If anything, I think it helps a 5 more than a 9.
Don't learn how to aim the shot with cue "A" if you are definitely planning to use cue "B".
That's like preparing for a drag race by driving a pickup truck.
Sorry for the longwinded reply, lemme actually answer your question now:
I've used all the shafts mentioned and I slightly prefer the OB's, the OB2 and Classic Pro.
But the differences are small. I could pick up a Z2 tomorrow and play just fine. They don't play wildly different.
In fact, most players could not pass a "pepsi challenge" and hit balls blindfolded and tell you which
shaft is which. So don't sweat it too much. If I had to recommend just one, probably a classic pro.
A few people complain the OB2 feels kind of soft and mushy to them. I never heard complaints
about the classic pro.
it would be to invest in one of these shafts. You're going to get some people telling
you it's a waste, or it isn't necessary at your current skill level. This isn't correct.
Here's why.
First - understand what you're really buying. The shaft reduces deflection on moderate to heavy spin shots.
This will change your line of aim on those shots. That's it.
You're buying a different line of aim.
You're not buying extra spin, perfect draw, better cueball control, more 'finesse', and so on.
That stuff's all wishful thinking. The shaft is ONLY changing where you aim spin shots.
So why is buying a different line of aim useful for an APA 5?
• With a high deflection shaft, some shots look really weird if you have to hit them with lots of spin.
For example you'd normally hit the left side of an object ball if you're cutting it to the right.
But if you load up with tons of inside english, you may need to aim to hit the ball full in the face
(like a straight in shot), or even aim slightly to the right side of the ball.
Even if you hit this shot for the next ten years, aiming to hit the wrong side of the ball
will never quite look normal or natural. Your brain WANTS to aim at the left side of that ball.
With the low deflection shaft you won't need to compensate so much.
You can actually aim almost the way you would without english.
This greatly cuts down the confusion and frustration of hitting those heavy spin shots.
You can hit the ball with a little more confidence because your eyes aren't sending signals
to your brain like "WTF man this doesn't look right at all".
• When you get the new shaft you must relearn your line of aim for these shots.
So why spend the next 2-5 years learning a line of aim that compensates for deflection,
then buy the LD shaft and have several years of 'incorrect' aiming lines burned into your memory?
It will just make it harder to adjust. You don't need to be an APA7/9 to get the benefit of an LD shaft.
If anything, I think it helps a 5 more than a 9.
Don't learn how to aim the shot with cue "A" if you are definitely planning to use cue "B".
That's like preparing for a drag race by driving a pickup truck.
Sorry for the longwinded reply, lemme actually answer your question now:
I've used all the shafts mentioned and I slightly prefer the OB's, the OB2 and Classic Pro.
But the differences are small. I could pick up a Z2 tomorrow and play just fine. They don't play wildly different.
In fact, most players could not pass a "pepsi challenge" and hit balls blindfolded and tell you which
shaft is which. So don't sweat it too much. If I had to recommend just one, probably a classic pro.
A few people complain the OB2 feels kind of soft and mushy to them. I never heard complaints
about the classic pro.
Admittedly I only scanned most of these posts so if this has been said please forgive me for being lazy. 
I suggest trying them out and finding the one you like and sticking with it. If low deflection is what you want get the OB2. If you don't like the smaller shaft then get the OB1. Hit with the classics to determine if the different feel is worth the higher deflection. Shaft choice is a very personal thing. Everyone is gonna see things a little differently. I would even go so far to say that you would be fine with a good maple shaft. The trick is to choose and stick with it.
In closing I want you to know that purchasing this shaft will not make you a better player. It will give you what I think is one of the best shafts ever produced but it won't make you better. Only time, knowledge, and effort can do that.
Good luck with it! There is no wrong answer.
Ken
p.s. I use an OB1.
I suggest trying them out and finding the one you like and sticking with it. If low deflection is what you want get the OB2. If you don't like the smaller shaft then get the OB1. Hit with the classics to determine if the different feel is worth the higher deflection. Shaft choice is a very personal thing. Everyone is gonna see things a little differently. I would even go so far to say that you would be fine with a good maple shaft. The trick is to choose and stick with it.
In closing I want you to know that purchasing this shaft will not make you a better player. It will give you what I think is one of the best shafts ever produced but it won't make you better. Only time, knowledge, and effort can do that.
Good luck with it! There is no wrong answer.
Ken
p.s. I use an OB1.
I have an OB Classic & McDermott i2 I like them both but the OB Classic is lighter on the front end & squirts the cue ball a bit less but not hardlt a noticable amount. I will probably add the Classic Pro as I like the conical taper with the smaller tip since I am now playing with TOI.
I agree that a shaft alone will not make you a player but I certainly recommend an LD shaft to anyone whether you intend to play with english or are going to try yo play hitting center alone.
I hope this helps some.
Good Luck with what ever you choose to do.
Regards,
I agree that a shaft alone will not make you a player but I certainly recommend an LD shaft to anyone whether you intend to play with english or are going to try yo play hitting center alone.
I hope this helps some.
Good Luck with what ever you choose to do.
Regards,
Last edited:
Short, sweet, and gets directly to the point!!!
Maniac (agrees with the rest of CreeDo's post regardless of his long-windedness :smile
LD shafts
I have been shooting with a 30" OB Classic with a Onyx tip for about 20 hours now and feel I am used to the shaft. I had it modified to the dimensions of my 2 Diveney shafts which are 12.5mm with an 18" extended taper. I also used a 314-2 for a couple weeks but really did not give it much table time. I don't really know if it helps me shoot any better then a Meucci Black Dot or my very good Diveney Lake Salvage shafts. Because so many world class pool shooters used and still use a regular maple shaft I am not convinced a LD shaft is needed. I am convinced being familiar with your cue, shaft and tip is very important. That and lots of table time using good technique and learning from mistakes makes one shoot better. If you got the cash then try one out. Chasing new gear in order to improve is fun in a hobby, whether it is pool, guns, ATV's, etc. Have fun and good luck.
I have been shooting with a 30" OB Classic with a Onyx tip for about 20 hours now and feel I am used to the shaft. I had it modified to the dimensions of my 2 Diveney shafts which are 12.5mm with an 18" extended taper. I also used a 314-2 for a couple weeks but really did not give it much table time. I don't really know if it helps me shoot any better then a Meucci Black Dot or my very good Diveney Lake Salvage shafts. Because so many world class pool shooters used and still use a regular maple shaft I am not convinced a LD shaft is needed. I am convinced being familiar with your cue, shaft and tip is very important. That and lots of table time using good technique and learning from mistakes makes one shoot better. If you got the cash then try one out. Chasing new gear in order to improve is fun in a hobby, whether it is pool, guns, ATV's, etc. Have fun and good luck.