Downward pressure through the stroke???

M

Mostly Miss

Alright, always miss
I have a friend, who plays "A" level pool, that tells me he puts downward pressure on his cue as he strokes through the ball. His theory is that it allows him to stroke through the nerves and really make sure that he is hitting where he wants to on the cue ball.

I have tryed this and find it awkward to do and find that it often throws me off. However, surprisingly, I make some shots that are low percentage shots by doing this once in a while.

He explains the pressure as coming from the back hand, excerting downward pressure on the bridge hand with sufficient force so that someone trying to lift the stick by the tip would have to exert some substantial efort with a few fingers.

I think in the long run it inhibits the stroke as it can not be fluid and smooth. I have a hard time dismissing the idea considering how good he shoots. However, I firmly believe that it is not for me.

Has anyone heard of this? Do you do it? Any feedback would be great.
 
I dont know exactly what you mean by downward pressure. If you push down on the butt, the tip will rise, right? Does he mean that he strokes through and downward with the tip? Mike S. actually teaches that stroke and explains it quite well. He likes his tip to finish at or near the cloth when he has completed his stroke.
 
Further explination

By downward pressure I mean leveraging the stick with your back hand as if you were trying to pin your bridge hand to the table.

If you can imagine you would be using the area between your thumb and first finger to push down on the stick and the fingers pulling up on the back.

It is awkward and causes your wrist to tighten up a bit. Thats why I want the input from different people.
 
That pretty much goes against ALL conventional wisdom about keeping your wrist and your grip loose.

I can see planting your bridge hand down fairly tight against the table, but not what you're talking about.
 
Mostly Miss...Your friend may be an "A" player (or not), but that is very poor advice, imo. The key to 'finesse' pool (the kind of pool played by the top players) is to let the cue do the work. That means that you must grip the cue lightly, and have a way to deliver the cue accurately, at any speed. We teach a pendulum stroke to achieve that, and NEVER use what you describe as 'downward pressure to pin the cue on your bridge hand'. If you grip the cue that tightly you will surely muscle every shot.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Mostly Miss said:
I have a friend, who plays "A" level pool, that tells me he puts downward pressure on his cue as he strokes through the ball. His theory is that it allows him to stroke through the nerves and really make sure that he is hitting where he wants to on the cue ball.

I have tryed this and find it awkward to do and find that it often throws me off. However, surprisingly, I make some shots that are low percentage shots by doing this once in a while.

He explains the pressure as coming from the back hand, excerting downward pressure on the bridge hand with sufficient force so that someone trying to lift the stick by the tip would have to exert some substantial efort with a few fingers.

I think in the long run it inhibits the stroke as it can not be fluid and smooth. I have a hard time dismissing the idea considering how good he shoots. However, I firmly believe that it is not for me.

Has anyone heard of this? Do you do it? Any feedback would be great.
Click to expand...
 
I agree with Scott. If you are under pressure to make a shot, step back from the table for a second and regroup. I think your friends advice will make you tense up and play worse.

If he does this method...and is a good 'A' player, then he probably isn't explaining the whole secret. He might think he is applying downward pressure, but he is probably just focusing more on not dropping his elbow and pushing through, he just doesn't know how to explain it, lol.

There are players all over the world, that have their own little tricks to make things work for them. Don't take this advice and try to emulate other players. Do what works for you and most of all PRACTICE.
 
what i do to stay down on the shot is make sure i firmly plant my bridge hand into the felt and try to keep it as stationary as possible. it works really for me b/c it isolates my hand and makes it very hard to jump up out of the shot
 
That downward pressure by your back hand can be a good strategy when you are shooting a cue ball frozen to the rail to help prevent a miscue. But during normal shots, it just makes things worse, as everyone in this thread already mentioned.
 
Scott Lee said:
Mostly Miss...Your friend may be an "A" player (or not), but that is very poor advice, imo. The key to 'finesse' pool (the kind of pool played by the top players) is to let the cue do the work. That means that you must grip the cue lightly, and have a way to deliver the cue accurately, at any speed. We teach a pendulum stroke to achieve that, and NEVER use what you describe as 'downward pressure to pin the cue on your bridge hand'. If you grip the cue that tightly you will surely muscle every shot.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...

Scott

You always give good advice. Can always depend on you. I would have been disappointed if you would have let this one slip by.

I bet that he is also one of those players that will tell someone to snap the cue back for a draw shot.
 
Pat Fleming

I believe Pat Fleming mentioned this for certain shots in "The Creative Edge."
 
That downward pressure by your back hand can be a good strategy when you are shooting a cue ball frozen to the rail to help prevent a miscue.
Click to expand...

I doubt that downward pressure would prevent any miscue, nor would a light grip cause one.

pj
chgo
 
All I can say is don't knock it 'til you try it. I'd never in a thousand years teach someone to do it, as it's true this will give you a very not-fluid stroke. But as my own little personal trick it's served me well when I want to cinch a long shot. I had no idea other people did it.

Basically the reason it helps me is I favor an open bridge and it gets the cue cupped in the "V" a little more snugly. It's only for very specific situations though... where I need to deliver a moderate or somewhat soft stroke on a long shot. I put a little downward pressure, draw back, pause, and deliver. I feel that it keeps the delivery part 'in check' and prevents and up, down, left or right deviation. I could maybe get the same effect with a closed bridge but for various reasons I just prefer open most of the time.

I should check to see what my make percent is on those shots with and without the pressure, just to make sure I'm not deluding myself =P
 
Scott Lee said:
Mostly Miss...Your friend may be an "A" player (or not), but that is very poor advice, imo. The key to 'finesse' pool (the kind of pool played by the top players) is to let the cue do the work. That means that you must grip the cue lightly, and have a way to deliver the cue accurately, at any speed. We teach a pendulum stroke to achieve that, and NEVER use what you describe as 'downward pressure to pin the cue on your bridge hand'. If you grip the cue that tightly you will surely muscle every shot.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...
Scott has it right.

Never forget there are always urthordox methods that players will recommend. Few players are 100% perfect. Most have some thing not exactly by the book. Picking up on that one thing almost never helps. With top players that one quirk is normally compensated for somewhere else and the player may not even know it, and therefore can't and won't teach it.

Stick with the time honored and long proven techniques as closely as possible. Learn from the pros not from the street. The Book is the fast track.
 
Mostly Miss said:
I have a friend, who plays "A" level pool, that tells me he puts downward pressure on his cue as he strokes through the ball. His theory is that it allows him to stroke through the nerves and really make sure that he is hitting where he wants to on the cue ball.

I have tryed this and find it awkward to do and find that it often throws me off. However, surprisingly, I make some shots that are low percentage shots by doing this once in a while.

He explains the pressure as coming from the back hand, excerting downward pressure on the bridge hand with sufficient force so that someone trying to lift the stick by the tip would have to exert some substantial efort with a few fingers.

I think in the long run it inhibits the stroke as it can not be fluid and smooth. I have a hard time dismissing the idea considering how good he shoots. However, I firmly believe that it is not for me.

Has anyone heard of this? Do you do it? Any feedback would be great.
Click to expand...



One might wonder how much better your friend could get by using a light grip and a great swing.....SPF=randyg
 
Just because a talented player can make it work doesn't mean it's a good idea. Look at Keith McCready's stroke; I know somebody who has taken lessons from him, and suffice it to say he doesn't recommend that other people stroke the way he does. He teaches traditional fundamentals, even though his own stroke is anything but traditional, because he understands what all people giving pointers on pool should understand: even though sometimes complicated things work well for different people, the simplest way to achieve great results is what should be taught.

In this case, I think using excess grip hand force to press the cue in any direction is a very bad idea. Your grip hand should only be holding the cue, not manipulating it. Gravity should be the only thing pressing it down onto your bridge hand.

-Andrew
 
Scott Lee said:
Mostly Miss...Your friend may be an "A" player (or not), but that is very poor advice, imo. The key to 'finesse' pool (the kind of pool played by the top players) is to let the cue do the work. That means that you must grip the cue lightly, and have a way to deliver the cue accurately, at any speed. We teach a pendulum stroke to achieve that, and NEVER use what you describe as 'downward pressure to pin the cue on your bridge hand'. If you grip the cue that tightly you will surely muscle every shot.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...


I'm with Scott on this one. The cue slide through your bridge and accellerate through the whole cue ball, and come to a natural shot/finish.

SPF

Pete
 
PROG8R said:
I dont know exactly what you mean by downward pressure. If you push down on the butt, the tip will rise, right? Does he mean that he strokes through and downward with the tip? Mike S. actually teaches that stroke and explains it quite well. He likes his tip to finish at or near the cloth when he has completed his stroke.
Click to expand...

Mike Sigel's stroke is actually incredibly close to the ideal stroke that today's best instructors teach their student's to strive for. His grip is solid but relaxed, his alignment is perfect, his practice stroke routine is rhythmic and very consistent, and all the movement in his stroke is pure pendulum (although he does drop his elbow a little on the follow-through for harder shots).

-Andrew
 
Andrew Manning said:
Just because a talented player can make it work doesn't mean it's a good idea. Look at Keith McCready's stroke; I know somebody who has taken lessons from him, and suffice it to say he doesn't recommend that other people stroke the way he does. He teaches traditional fundamentals, even though his own stroke is anything but traditional, because he understands what all people giving pointers on pool should understand: even though sometimes complicated things work well for different people, the simplest way to achieve great results is what should be taught.

In this case, I think using excess grip hand force to press the cue in any direction is a very bad idea. Your grip hand should only be holding the cue, not manipulating it. Gravity should be the only thing pressing it down onto your bridge hand.

-Andrew
Click to expand...

Mostly Miss has already tried this method and it didn't work for him but others have used this method and it worked for them.

I am of the school of thought: Try it; if it works for you great; if it doesn't work for you, put it in the round file.

Am going to try writing the Dali Lama to get tips on eliminating distractions. (Either that or I'm going to talk to Joe Tucker about his secrets of maintaining focus.)
JoeyA
 
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