Dr. Dave SAWS calibration

[SpiderWebComm]

The analogies don't work. In golf spin is a product of changing your stroke. In pool, spin is just a product of hitting the cue ball in a different spot.

Talking with you is like talking to a huge chuck roast fresh from the grocery store. Spin in golf can be caused with an open or closed club face and at different places on the golf ball at impact whether planned or unplanned based on angle of attack.

Who cares about the instructor stuff.

At least you cleared that up. NO, you aren't an instructor, but anyone can pawn themselves off as one on a forum. Actually, we can all be instructors because there's at least one or two people who are newbies or worse than us.

Like I said the analogies always fall apart. Someone can make a good golf analogy and upon closer inspection it falls apart as the games are just different.

Of course, their different but it's still an implement striking a ball with a human trying to control the implement.

Here's an analogy I could probably defeat...

Bowling. I know very little about bowling but no matter ...

Even less than pool? Whoda thunk? Adios muchacho.

 

[BasementDweller]

Talking with you is like talking to a huge chuck roast fresh from the grocery store. Spin in golf can be caused with an open or closed club face and at different places on the golf ball at impact whether planned or unplanned based on angle of attack.

At least you cleared that up. NO, you aren't an instructor, but anyone can pawn themselves off as one on a forum. Actually, we can all be instructors because there's at least one or two people who are newbies or worse than us.

Of course, their different but it's still an implement striking a ball with a human trying to control the implement.

Even less than pool? Whoda thunk? Adios muchacho.

I say adios to you as well. You're probably the most disgruntled person on here. Not sure why. It seems you have a lot to add about pool and life but you're always so aggressive. I'm just a huge chuck roast talking about pool here.

 

[maha]

when i want to get good at anything i learn as much as i can about it. stupid people pass up that part.

with pool all the correct knowledge you can learn is best. but only worth anything until you can make your stick go exactly straight where you aim every single time with eyes open or closed.

few ever bother to get that right while learning. all they try to do is pocket balls with a crooked stroke. over and over until that is ingrained and hard to change under pressure.

there is no apa 4 or 5 that has a straight stoke except in their mind. so their upside is severely limited.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Why does a smaller diameter miss more...?

Would you please do a video for accuracy and post it showing how your 10mm tip works on all types of shots and offsets?

Or you could just describe one shot/offset that it doesn't work on.

It's not so much about the shot but whose hands the cue is in with the ability to aim and strike the CB exactly where it needs to be struck. It could be any shot.

What happened to "working on all types of shots and offsets"? When you're challenged to describe just one of those "all types of shots", suddenly it's about the shooter.

lol - same old tapdance...

pj
chgo

 

[dr_dave]

I purchased Dr. Daves System for Aiming With Sidespin (SAWS) video.
...
However, there are some times were this doesn't see to be working...

To use SAWS effectively, you need to use a consistent bridge length with the cue as level as possible, and be able to aim center-ball shots accurately and consistently. You also need to be able to do BHE and FHE pivots accurately and consistently. You also need to be able to judge the speed you will use on a particular shot. If any of these things is amiss, SAWS will not be reliable.

has anyone else purchased this video? and if so, can you share your results?

I use SAWS very effectively, but I am very careful with everything and have practiced SAWS a lot.

im a APA 4 and would like to start using SideSpin more in my game.

As an APA 4, you should probably focus less on sidespin and more on improving your fundamentals, shot making, and CB control (without sidespin). Lots of help will all these things can be found here:

pool fundamentals tutorial

pool aiming tutorial

CB control tutorial​

I hope this helps.

 

[dr_dave]

im a big believer in this system. i feel that if i was to try and play by "feel" it would take an incredible amount of time to gain the intuition needed

Same here. Before I created SAWS and incorporated it into my game, I would often miss sidespin shots (all all distances and speeds), especially those requiring lots of sidespin. SAWS dramatically improved by success percentage with no need for intuition/feel/judgement built from countless hours of successful practice and experience.

 

[dr_dave]

While I agree that the end goal is for your intuition/experience to fully take over, for beginner players systems like this can be a great way for speeding up the process of learning. Depends on your personality, some learn faster with systems, some despise them even as beginners. But whatever your road of progression is, eventually you'll let go of the conscious systems and just "know what to do" when it comes to aiming or adjustments.

Well stated. I agree 100%. Even if you don't use SAWS now or in the future, the process of learning and working with SAWS will teach you a lot about sidespin, CB deflection, and accurate aim compensation, and this will help accelerate your learning process.

 

[dr_dave]

If your calibrations are not working out for you, it may be an indication of inconsistency of bridge length and/or cue butt elevation.

Good point. To use SAWS effectively, your bridge length and cue elevation need to be consistent. For shots where you need to use a different bridge length or cue elevation, you need to adjust the SAWS numbers or aim by feel.

 

[garczar]

Just one statement regarding golf, FEW if any good players hit a straight ball. To a target YES but not straight as in the flight of the ball. Virtually every decent-to-great player has a predominate ball flight, either right-2-left or vice versa. Just about every good teacher will tell you hitting the ball straight is the hardest thing to do and don't waste time trying to make someone do it. Go watch pros play in person, you'll rarely see the ball go straight at their intended landing spot.

 

[dr_dave]

There will be in errors in your stroke and your contact with the cue ball. Work on overcoming those and the SAWS method will work for you too.

Agreed. SAWS is useless if you cannot aim center-ball shots accurately and stroke straight.

 

[garczar]

Good point. To use SAWS effectively, your bridge length and cue elevation need to be consistent. For shots where you need to use a different bridge length or cue elevation, you need to adjust the SAWS numbers or aim by feel.

System/#'s/data-driven learning works fine for some left-brain types. Most right-brain players will get to the same place but in a far more natural/intuitive way. Not knocking any one approach but i've known WAY more RB/natural players that got to super high level play than those using a data heavy numbers approach. Not saying pool is to be science free but its more art than science.

 

[BasementDweller]

Agreed. SAWS is useless if you cannot aim center-ball shots accurately and stroke straight.

Do you really think it's this binary, or are all of our varied pool skills really on a spectrum? So how many players EVER truly cue straight? At what point do we think we are cueing "straight enough" to work on or just enjoy other facets of the game?

This is where @Tin Man has pulled me closer to his camp, believing that we can focus too much on fundamentals. While I agree that beginners should focus on straight cueing, I also think they need to just enjoy playing as much as possible. Experimenting with English should be a part of this.

If we really dissected the journey of the greats, I would be shocked if we found any of them that weren't using English right out of the gate.

 

[BasementDweller]

And another thing....these things aren't mutually exclusive. You can work on straight cueing while also working on English shots. Just shoot the same shot over and over again and try to get the same result. I suppose that would be moving towards creating a repeatable stroke as opposed to a straight one, but the repeatable stroke is more important anyway.

 

[SpiderWebComm]

lol - same old tapdance...

pj
chgo

Your right. I don't have all the steps and different ways you do to weasel your way out of actually demonstrating something on the table. In addition to tap dancing yourself, you can Cha-Cha, Rumba, Samba, Hip Hop, Ballet, Salsa, Waltz, and Swing.
With the exception of a few from RSB days, nobody even has a clue what you look like let alone go through all of the antics you do at the table in trying to set up and take a shot. Do I have your OK to post a picture of you? What say you, champ?

 

[SpiderWebComm]

Agreed. SAWS is useless if you cannot aim center-ball shots accurately and stroke straight.

I'm not a certified instructor and don't give lessons. But I have shown a few people who never held a cue in their hands
to do what you posted above and totally agree with the aiming center-ball shots accurately and stroking straight. No offset, no spin/English, and not even an OB.

The first thing I did was teach them how to hold the cue with either an open or closed bridge and then how to stand behind the ball and position their head and eyes to get it to go where the target was. The target was the pockets and the only ball hit
was the CB close to a pocket in the beginning and then further away until the entire width and length of the table was used.
It wasn't exactly an easy task for most of them, or me to have the keep doing it repeatedly and still miss. Even with that, their stroke was disjointed and awkward.

Eventually if they stuck with it for a number of days, we included an OB. And then the fun, or lack thereof, started all over again.
We don't remember those days for ourselves now, but pool isn't easy. Adding tip offsets to shots for spin too early is a kiss of death for newbies and unskilled players. Even skilled players can blow shots from the use of spin and miscalculations.

 

[Zerksies]

B-o-o-o-r-i-n-g

I think this is the main reason beginner players don't get totally hooked on pool. If you're not spinning the cue ball around, the game quickly begins to feel like putt-putt.

Spin the rock, have fun.

And this is why he's going to be stuck at a 4 for quite a long time

 

[SpiderWebComm]

Just one statement regarding golf, FEW if any good players hit a straight ball. To a target YES but not straight as in the flight of the ball. Virtually every decent-to-great player has a predominate ball flight, either right-2-left or vice versa. Just about every good teacher will tell you hitting the ball straight is the hardest thing to do and don't waste time trying to make someone do it. Go watch pros play in person, you'll rarely see the ball go straight at their intended landing spot.

We don't even need to worry about hitting the ball. The part of golf most like pool that wins or costs where you finish in a tournament for a pro or amateur is PUTTING. Rolling the ball on the green from all kinds of distances far and near to get it into the hole. And you certainly don't want to ever try applying spin on it. It's so tough to do under pressure, that a number of them
can come down with what's referred to as "whiskey nerves", aka YIPS.
Rory McIlroy blew the US Open this year by choking on a few short ones at the end. And it happens every week with somebody or another. Agreed?

 

[garczar]

We don't even need to worry about hitting the ball. The part of golf most like pool that wins or costs where you finish in a tournament for a pro or amateur is PUTTING. Rolling the ball on the green from all kinds of distances far and near to get it into the hole. And you certainly don't want to ever try applying spin on it. It's so tough to do under pressure, that a number of them
can come down with what's referred to as "whiskey nerves", aka YIPS.
Rory McIlroy blew the US Open this year by choking on a few short ones at the end. And it happens every week with somebody or another. Agreed?

Maybe on the 16th but the putt he had on 18 was FAR more brutal than tv made it look. Downhill cross-grain and about 5ft. Yes he missed but it wasn't due to choking. The one on 16 tho was pretty bad. At higher levels of golf almost all missed putts are mis-reads. Yes the do push/pull some but misreading is biggest culprit. Higher h'cappers misread AND mis-hit putts. I'm adept at both forms of missing putts.

 

[SpiderWebComm]

Maybe on the 16th but the putt he had on 18 was FAR more brutal than tv made it look. Downhill cross-grain and about 5ft. Yes he missed but it wasn't due to choking. The one on 16 tho was pretty bad. At higher levels of golf almost all missed putts are mis-reads. Yes the do push/pull some but misreading is biggest culprit. Higher h'cappers misread AND mis-hit putts. I'm adept at both forms of missing putts.

Don't forget the nastiest word in golf even for the once BEST putters on tour that force them into long putters, anchoring (before it was banned), weird whacko ways of gripping the putter, etc. The dreaded YIPS! Ernie Els at his worst!

 

[SpiderWebComm]

Everybody is a pro player on an internet forum that can spin shots like crazy and make everything. Amazing! But what about
the PROs? Surely, they can do it also, right? Watch one that starts at the 2:54 mark if you want to see what nerves can do to a stroke.