Has anyone ever owned or used one of the numerous bootleg Instroke leather cases on ebay??? I was thinking of buying a 2x2 to have when I just feel like messing around instead of bringing my regular case. Do you think they are worth it? Im not looking for a replacement case but just an extra
Ebay Leather Cases
- Thread starter NOSAJ03
- Start date
Why would you want to support someone that sells rip offs? Buy from a reputable seller like Seyberts. Sounds as if you are being penny wise and dollar foolish. You are paying over $200 and may "save" about $20. Protect your money. In the movie Flim Flam Man the con artist said "You cannot cheat a honest man. The only reason you can cheat someone is becuase they think they are cheating you." Think about this. Everyone is looking for that bargain and if you shop around long enough you will find a way to get ripped.
preacher_eric
Registered
While I have never ordered from Seybert's, the site looks great and they carry some good products. I did purchase an inexpensive In-Stroke style case from Frank's Center, Inc. at the Super Billiards Expo last year. It looks just as good as In-Stroke, it weighs and costs less, and it's held up great. I had no problems with its quality.
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onepocketchump
Guest
preacher_eric said:
It is "Instroke" and not "In-Stroke" and the same company that makes Instroke cases also makes the knockoffs for Frank's center so it is not surprising that you would have no problems. Just like IBM makes clones of their computers Instroke makes clones of their cases to capture the market for those who will not step up for the very best. Mercedes also owns Chrysler.
John
i bought a vincitore and to my knowledge it is a rip off of instroke and think it was an incredible deal. A great case for the money
I have to disagree on this one. If only one company was allowed to make cases like the Instroke case there would be no other companies. If someone wanted to look at my Flowers case, to see how it is designed and put together, then make a similar case, that doesn't make it inferior. As a matter of fact, if I remeber right, this was exactly what John Collins did when he started Instroke in the early 90's. I knew John then, his cases were completely different than what is being sold now. He had bright colors with outstanding embrordery (sp?) to appeal to a different clientel than the Flowers case market. I remeber him making cases for Mike Massey, Jim Rempe etc that were excellent. The cases were built essentially the same though.
Now if a company from across the pond is mass producing a product as a copy that is completely different, and we should not support them, due to infringements. This would be smilar to Korea selling Nike knock-offs.
I hope this makes sense.
Jim
Now if a company from across the pond is mass producing a product as a copy that is completely different, and we should not support them, due to infringements. This would be smilar to Korea selling Nike knock-offs.
I hope this makes sense.
Jim
I bought an Instroke case from ebay it was one of there "tooled" leather (hand crafted design) cases but the instroke name plate looks different than most that I have seen on instroke cases, however the quality is excellent and I paid $170. THe case looks like a 400+ case. Now it could be an original instroke case the seller is a reputial ebayer.... good luck shopping
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onepocketchump
Guest
I am just going to say one thing. The Instroke case that I designed was an improvement over all other tube cases at the time of it's creation. Instroke cases have continually improved. The knockoffs are really crappy inside due to the various shortcuts taken in their construction. I know, having taken them all apart. You get what you pay for, a cheap price equals shitty construction. Whether the defective and dangerous methods are apparent or not from the outset, they are there. Buy a knockoff Instroke and you will get the barest facsimile of the protection and quality that Instroke delivers in EVERY case.
I have nothing against someone copying a design. When you look at a Cowboy style case though it is implying that it will protect your cue as good as an Instroke. This is not true. Let's forget about the shitty exterior construction on most of them. The interior is where the real ripoff comes from. This is the part you don't see until your cue is scatched, kept wet from moisture retaining fabric, banged around because the cheap foam disintegrated and so on. So, go on and buy the el Cheapo case.
The bitterness of poor quality is felt long after the joy of a cheap price has faded. I sometimes opt for cheap tools as well and even though I know what I am buying I am still pissed off every time they break when I need them most. My good, expensive tools never fail me.
John Barton
founder and designer of Instroke Cue Cases.
I have nothing against someone copying a design. When you look at a Cowboy style case though it is implying that it will protect your cue as good as an Instroke. This is not true. Let's forget about the shitty exterior construction on most of them. The interior is where the real ripoff comes from. This is the part you don't see until your cue is scatched, kept wet from moisture retaining fabric, banged around because the cheap foam disintegrated and so on. So, go on and buy the el Cheapo case.
The bitterness of poor quality is felt long after the joy of a cheap price has faded. I sometimes opt for cheap tools as well and even though I know what I am buying I am still pissed off every time they break when I need them most. My good, expensive tools never fail me.
John Barton
founder and designer of Instroke Cue Cases.
I have a nice bentley case that i bought used for $150. It's great! I get comments on it all the time, and i have accidentally left it in the car overnight a few times and it did a good job protecting them. Never had a problem with it at all. I would recommend a Bentley case to anyone.
John,
I was no way implying some cases were superior to Instroke. I think they are very high quality cases and highly encourage people to buy a genuine Instroke case.
I remember when you first started making cases. I used to run with Andreas, Mac (guy with blue eyeglasses), Moose and a few others. We used to play alot at Lindsey Air Station in Wiesbaden and would travel around Germany on the weekends. If I remeber right you were a high diver or something like that at the time. I guess I had your last name wrong, unless I'm thinking of someone completely different. The cases you made back in '90 or '91 were very bright colored leather with 9 ball racks or whatever on them and nothing like the cowboy cases made today.
Maybe my memory is going, none the less I wish you the best.
Jim
I was no way implying some cases were superior to Instroke. I think they are very high quality cases and highly encourage people to buy a genuine Instroke case.
I remember when you first started making cases. I used to run with Andreas, Mac (guy with blue eyeglasses), Moose and a few others. We used to play alot at Lindsey Air Station in Wiesbaden and would travel around Germany on the weekends. If I remeber right you were a high diver or something like that at the time. I guess I had your last name wrong, unless I'm thinking of someone completely different. The cases you made back in '90 or '91 were very bright colored leather with 9 ball racks or whatever on them and nothing like the cowboy cases made today.
Maybe my memory is going, none the less I wish you the best.
Jim
Someone commented about knockoffs from across the pond...that's funny. All Instroke cases are made across the pond. Some across the Atlantic, and some across the Pacific. I'm sure John can tell us the manufacturing location history.
I bought an Instroke Cowboy case from seyberts. I have no complaints about Seybert's service. But I'd say that the exterior finish quality of my Instroke case is mediocre at best. And, the design has one really crappy flaw, which is the latch. But I still think it was the best case for the money, and does its primary function (protect the cue) very well. Not a good choice if you want a light-weight case though.
I bought an Instroke Cowboy case from seyberts. I have no complaints about Seybert's service. But I'd say that the exterior finish quality of my Instroke case is mediocre at best. And, the design has one really crappy flaw, which is the latch. But I still think it was the best case for the money, and does its primary function (protect the cue) very well. Not a good choice if you want a light-weight case though.
I bought an Instroke 2X3 tooled black leather case made in Germany at the Las Vegas BCA and am very happy though I have to touch up the leather where the die rubs off (indicative of leather). The inside of the outside pockets are real leather.
A friend of mine ordered an similar Instroke case on the internet and it was flimsy and didn't hold it's shape like leather and it was made in Taiwan. The inside of the outside pockets had a fabric lining like vinyl. He paid just a little less than the discounted price that I got and was pizzed so he was set to send it back. He was told that they had one Instroke that was made in Germany out of buffalo hide if he would consider an exchange - he did - he's happy.
I saw the seller of my case at Vegas this month and he had all made in Germany cases and they were all great. Other Instroke cases at other booths that were made in Taiwan seemed flimsy but were cheaper OK if you only want the look.
A friend of mine ordered an similar Instroke case on the internet and it was flimsy and didn't hold it's shape like leather and it was made in Taiwan. The inside of the outside pockets had a fabric lining like vinyl. He paid just a little less than the discounted price that I got and was pizzed so he was set to send it back. He was told that they had one Instroke that was made in Germany out of buffalo hide if he would consider an exchange - he did - he's happy.
I saw the seller of my case at Vegas this month and he had all made in Germany cases and they were all great. Other Instroke cases at other booths that were made in Taiwan seemed flimsy but were cheaper OK if you only want the look.
LAMas: I have a Cowboy case where the pockets have a fabric lining on the inside. Does that fabric lining mean vinyl? My understanding was that it is just leather with a lining.
My main finish complaint is where the outside pockets are sewn onto the case. The pocket leather is not folded over when sewn on, so the edge of the leather is visible. It looks amateur.
My main finish complaint is where the outside pockets are sewn onto the case. The pocket leather is not folded over when sewn on, so the edge of the leather is visible. It looks amateur.
O
onepocketchump
Guest
jhendri2 said:
No, you got it right. Wow, those were the days!!! I recently changed my name to Barton. I took my wife's name. The "cowboy" models were a concession to mass production. I still favor the originals I made and long to get back to making one of a kind cases again. I also just bought a Nissen trampoline to start training again. Thanks for the memories.
John
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onepocketchump
Guest
LAMas said:
Hello,
First of all there are no Instroke cases that are made in Germany. The counterfeit Instroke cases that were on sale at the BCA show are made in the Czech Republic and exported to the USA through Germany. I am the person who designed and made them in Europe and Taiwan. Secondly, the authentic Instroke cases that are made in Taiwan are in fact better cases. The reason that the German company was ordered to stop using the Instroke name on the cases they were having made is because they were not up to my quality standards and not being built according to my instructions.
Anyone is free to compare the two cases. The ones from Taiwan are the result of continuous improvement and have many features that are not available on any other cases anywhere. I know full well that there is a stigma attached to "made in Taiwan" and a sterotype of quality associated with "made in Germany". I am here to assure all of you that the Instroke case that is made in Taiwan is the very best Instroke case that I have ever been associated with. They are more solid than those from Europe.
PLEASE, please come by the Sterling Booth at the VNEA and compare for yourself. There is NO, NONE AT ALL, comprimise in quality, fit and finish on the new Instroke cases. I will stake my reputation and my 14 years with Instroke on this fact.
Yes, some people have indicated that they like the appearance of some of the European cases over similar models of Taiwanese cases. With over 70 models and literally thousands of combinations this is inevitable. I assure you however that the leather is just as good or better, just as thick or thicker, the zippers and zipper pulls are stronger and nicer, the latches are infinitely stronger, the fabric inside has the same properties, the tubes are better, the construction is better and the fit is better on the Taiwanese cases.
I sold Instroke last August. Everything that the Instroke case is comes from me and those who share my vision of what a cue case should be. I will put a Taiwanese Cowboy model up against a European Cowboy model any day in a blind test and bet LARGE amounts of money that the Taiwanese one wins out.
It is unfair to make comparisons of dissimilar models based on appearance alone. I also carried a European Saddle Series case with a gorgeaus tooled design. This case was NOT satisfactory to me until I modified it to have the improvements found on the Taiwanese cases.
Anyway, I ramble. The COUNTERFEIT Instroke cases sold by Brownwood Billiard Supplies from Texas will NOT be serviced by Instroke Sports for free. When they break you will need to send them to Germany for repair or pay for the repairs.
So buy them at your own risk. The only authentic Instroke cases on the market today are made in Taiwan. Check with your dealer to find out which one they carry.
Sincerely,
John Barton
founder and designer of Instroke Cue Cases
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onepocketchump
Guest
jer9ball said:
The lining is moisture resistant fabric. No Instroke uses any type of lining which is abrasive.
Sorry about the pockets. Depending on the type of leather used the edges are either folded or cut. I feel that stiffer leather looks better when left raw. The softer nappa and nubuk leathers are usually folded. You may want to look at a different model.
John Barton
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onepocketchump
Guest
jer9ball said:
The latch issue has been a thorn in my side for ten years. When I first used that latch I thought it was the best solution. All I can say is that the new diamond latch, invented by Instroke in Taiwan, is the solution. This latch is virtually indestructable and I put on about 40 of them last week at the BCA.
As for the manufacturing history; it's all at www.instroke.com but here it is in short. 1991-1993 I made unique one-of-a-kind cases in Germany. 1994-2000 the cases were mass produced in the Czech Republic. In 2001 there was a serious split between me and the company in Germany so I revoked their contract to produce cases using the Instroke name. From 2001 onward authentic Instroke cases have been produced in Taiwan. The German company continued to produce cases in the Czech Republic using the Instroke name illegally and I sued them successfully forcing a settlement last year which forbids them from sending any cases to the United States bearing the Instroke name.
Throughout the entire lawsuit period I continued to service the counterfeit cases and protect the investment made by innocent consumers. Now you know the story and the choice is yours.
Take care everyone.
John Barton
www.cuecaserepair.com
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