Efren's superman shot

I hate to be a naysayer, but in my opinion this shot is not a good example of Efren’s genius. It’s a magical shot because of who is playing, the situation (the finals of an event), and the hill-hill score.

This is one of those shots that you are just looking to make contact and see what happens. Sure, you might “see” the pocket, but that’s about it – you have no real expectation of making it. Efren got superlucky on this shot. He HAD to kick a very awkward two rails (someone asked how he even saw this shot – was there anything else?), and I’m sure if you asked him to take 20-1 on him making it, he’d say no.

We have all seen and done some amazing things on a pool table. Think of the last shot you made that was a total flyer; i.e., you thought maybe it might have a chance - and it was ludicrous - but you had no other choice but to try it because of the game situation. Does making one of those in every hundred you try mean you are a genius?

I will end on an obvious disclaimer – of course Efren is a superduperfantasticgreatamazing player, but in my opinion this shot is indicative of none of it. In this particular shot, he’s basically a guy that made an educated guess on the first rail, and got really, really lucky in a tournament once. Just because his educated guess is better than ours does not really mean much on this shot.

- Steve
 
Steve Lipsky said:
I hate to be a naysayer, but in my opinion this shot is not a good example of Efren’s genius. It’s a magical shot because of who is playing, the situation (the finals of an event), and the hill-hill score.

This is one of those shots that you are just looking to make contact and see what happens. Sure, you might “see” the pocket, but that’s about it – you have no real expectation of making it. Efren got superlucky on this shot. He HAD to kick a very awkward two rails (someone asked how he even saw this shot – was there anything else?), and I’m sure if you asked him to take 20-1 on him making it, he’d say no.

We have all seen and done some amazing things on a pool table. Think of the last shot you made that was a total flyer; i.e., you thought maybe it might have a chance - and it was ludicrous - but you had no other choice but to try it because of the game situation. Does making one of those in every hundred you try mean you are a genius?

I will end on an obvious disclaimer – of course Efren is a superduperfantasticgreatamazing player, but in my opinion this shot is indicative of none of it. In this particular shot, he’s basically a guy that made an educated guess on the first rail, and got really, really lucky in a tournament once. Just because his educated guess is better than ours does not really mean much on this shot.

- Steve
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I think your post is totally on the mark, and the fact that the ball went in is really just extremely lucky, but consider it from this angle: what about the coincidence that the greatest (luckiest) shot in professional pool was made by the greatest player in professional pool? I think it's no coincidence, because the reason Efren's called the magician is that he gives himself more of a chance than anyone else does that magical things will happen when he's at the table. The shot involves an insane bit of luck, but would it be as fitting if it happened to anyone else? I think it's telling that Efren is the one who made the shot.

-Andrew
 
shinobi said:
I've seen Earl clap for difficult shots on numerous occasions. Always seemed genuine.

Also, I could easily be wrong, but I don't recall ever seeing Earl's antics in a match against Efren Reyes.
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You mean Earl, who has many times publicly stated that they should ban the filipinos from playing over here. You mean that Earl.
 
jay helfert said:
You mean Earl, who has many times publicly stated that they should ban the filipinos from playing over here. You mean that Earl.
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Ouch!
The same one who turned around and asked Jan and Brooke why they were cheering for Efren?:rolleyes:
 
Andrew Manning said:
I think your post is totally on the mark, and the fact that the ball went in is really just extremely lucky, but consider it from this angle: what about the coincidence that the greatest (luckiest) shot in professional pool was made by the greatest player in professional pool? I think it's no coincidence, because the reason Efren's called the magician is that he gives himself more of a chance than anyone else does that magical things will happen when he's at the table. The shot involves an insane bit of luck, but would it be as fitting if it happened to anyone else? I think it's telling that Efren is the one who made the shot.

-Andrew
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One has to see Efren play some one-pocket and just see how insane Efren's banking and kicking ability is.
Or playing golf at the big table. I once saw him bank his out hole ball from the end rail to the side pocket, 3 rails. He even told Morro right before he shot it.
 
JoeyInCali said:
One has to see Efren play some one-pocket and just see how insane Efren's banking and kicking ability is.
Or playing golf at the big table. I once saw him bank his out hole ball from the end rail to the side pocket, 3 rails. He even told Morro right before he shot it.
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Hi Joey. Isn't any A-player a favorite to come within a diamond or so (either way) of making that shot on every attempt?

- Steve
 
Under those circumstances... WoW

Unbelievable shot! Hill - Hill pressure , unlucky safe gets him snookered- other end of the table, balls interfering with the kick, makes the thin hit, just enough to wiggle into the pocket ( sewer cap:) ), perfect po. He 's out!!
The champion- Efren Reyes- The Magician.

Efren has the same line every time he pulls off a ridiculous shot or beats someone after being down big, " I got lucky " I think he has gotten lucky a few too many times for it to truly be considered luck. He has been a world beater for 2 decades, lets give him the benefit of the doubt.

Would he bet the house on the shot? No certainly not. Did he try to make the ball? I believe so. Playing a three rail kick safety with 4 balls on the table is low odds anyway. Bottom line- He made the shot... We will never know for sure what he was thinking nor can we assume that anybody has that fantastic imagination to really decipher his intentions. Just tap your cue or clap your hands. That was great shot pulled off by the greatest!Unfortunately Efren's greatness is on the other side of that hill. Gonna miss watching that guy...:(

Rob
 
The commentators are Bill Incardona and Jim Rempe. The match was played at the Sands Regency Open XXI (June, 1995). It's a very entertaining match, with not much safety play until Efren's attempt during the hill-hill game. There are some very strong run-outs during the match.

You can get a copy of the video from Accu-stats.com HERE.

-djb
 
donovan: no i ment the last shot. The first one was obviously not intented, or he wouldnt have tried to put the cb behind the ball. what i ment was what steve lipksy said, but he just said it better :p

double dave, u can check my signature for my ranking. not sure if u read it, but ive had some stroke/consistency problems for around 3 4 months, and u can see it in my ranking scores. I havent made much improvement in the last 3 rankings. but the stroke is back on track, as i saw in the loontjes open. so i should win some more places in the next ranking. not only 3 or 4 places. I played vs a dutch guy there. Guliano smidt. was winning 1-3 with a chance for 1-4 but missed a shot, and lost 6-3. To bad u couldnt make it to the loontjes open, it was a greath tournament, with a VERY high standard. In fact , it had all the top players there. Never saw so many good matches in one tournament. Good luck if u are going to the amsterdam's open. I wont be able to make it.
 
Solartje said:
donovan: no i ment the last shot. The first one was obviously not intented, or he wouldnt have tried to put the cb behind the ball. what i ment was what steve lipksy said, but he just said it better :p

double dave, u can check my signature for my ranking. not sure if u read it, but ive had some stroke/consistency problems for around 3 4 months, and u can see it in my ranking scores. I havent made much improvement in the last 3 rankings. but the stroke is back on track, as i saw in the loontjes open. so i should win some more places in the next ranking. not only 3 or 4 places. I played vs a dutch guy there. Guliano smidt. was winning 1-3 with a chance for 1-4 but missed a shot, and lost 6-3. To bad u couldnt make it to the loontjes open, it was a greath tournament, with a VERY high standard. In fact , it had all the top players there. Never saw so many good matches in one tournament. Good luck if u are going to the amsterdam's open. I wont be able to make it.
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WOW! My bad! I can't believe you thought that was a safety. Oh well, I'll stay out of it. You're still my bro Sols! :D
 
What is the Accustats tape listed under? I looked under “Williebetmore’s partner” and found nothing.:confused:
 
breakup said:
What is the Accustats tape listed under? I looked under “Williebetmore’s partner” and found nothing.:confused:
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breakup,
I had Accu-Stats change his title to Efren Reyes. I couldn't let them continue to catalog his matches using the old "Williebetmore's partner/cue bearer" designation that we all are so familiar with - just think what harm that would do to Efren's self esteem in the long run. It's time for Efren to fly on his own - I've taught him everything I know (it took almost 40 seconds of my valuable time).
 
Donovan said:
WOW! My bad! I can't believe you thought that was a safety. Oh well, I'll stay out of it. You're still my bro Sols! :D
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thx bro :cool: , like they say in stickman, u'r my m8 donovan :D

well im not convinced it was a safety, im sure he played it for the pot, but i was more wondering what efren thought his succes rate would be on the shot. Did he think to play it like a shot to nothing? pot + safety together. Or did he just think, pot or lose?... just stroke and we'll see what happens? curious to know what was in his mind when he is walking around the table before that shot.
 
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I've got to iterate, Buckster_uk, Thanks a ton for posting that. A prime example of the greatest pool player I have ever seen.
 
I think Incardona asked Efren after the match what he was thinking when he took the shot, and Efren said, "Man, I got to get luuuckky!!!"

But even though he knows it's a hopeless longshot, I think what is NOT luck is that he played it at the right speed, so that if he happened to get lucky enough, he'd have a good shot on the 6. Or maybe if he missed, the 5 might have bounced back to around the center of the head rail.
 
I remember watching that match at the pool hall back in 95 with the other pool bums. After that shot, everyone just about fell out of their stools. That shot remained the topic of discussion the whole night! and then some.

ghost ball
 
Ah right, now I see it, I normally have signatures and avatars turned of. 65th isn´t half bad within a year of starting. Gilliano Smit is one of the most feared dutch players, one of six dutch representatives for the E.C. in Germany, so if u were 1-3 up, not bad! I would agree with you that the shot Efren played wasn´t a percentage shot, but I think he went for it full-blooded.

gr. Dave
 
Travis Bickle said:
I think Incardona asked Efren after the match what he was thinking when he took the shot, and Efren said, "Man, I got to get luuuckky!!!"

But even though he knows it's a hopeless longshot, I think what is NOT luck is that he played it at the right speed, so that if he happened to get lucky enough, he'd have a good shot on the 6. Or maybe if he missed, the 5 might have bounced back to around the center of the head rail.
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Luck is the residue of design.
Branch Rickey
 
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