Fact or Fiction: Gambling Makes You A Better Player

In my experience, people who compete regularly improve more rapidly than those who don't. If you are in an area where you don't have a multitude of tournaments to choose from, gambling may be the only way to compete regularly. Most of the players I know who have been playing for 20-30 years and have plateaued at the C or B range are the type who, for whatever reason, hardly ever compete.

Maybe it has something to do with how competitive a person is? I'm not very competitive myself. I don't play well for funsies, because my goal is never to beat someone. If I'm competing, my goal is to make as few mistakes as possible and see what happens. I have seen lots of people who can't stand to lose, though, and they seem to just focus on "damn I want to beat this guy", and they often end up playing under their true speed. Probably some of those people refrain from competing because they are so afraid of getting beat. They might avoid a little humility, but in the end I think they are suffering a much bigger cost in their advancement as a player.

Aaron
 
book collector said:
When you gamble, does the person who beats you show you anything?
You will undoubtedly see them shoot shots you don't know and win your money , but you could watch a video and learn the same shots for free.
One thing for sure, if you gamble.....no one in the pool room will ever show you anything.
Why would they, you are a fish.
I gambled most of my life and I won and lost, the only thing that makes you better is practice, with practice comes confidence and with confidence comes winning. Play in tournaments to get pressure , they are much tougher to overcome than just 1 guy.
Also, 1 last piece of advice, if the guy you are playing is chirping and having fun , joking with the rail and it's a big party, pack up your stuff, you are in a trap 99% of the time.
Gambling when you are an established player is one thing , gambling to learn to play is something propigated from 150 years ago so that con men didn't have to work.
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Even with the likelihood that one of my stalkers will accuse me of being a "holier than thou" kind of guy, I have to take exception with what you said about gamblers telling the one who lost, "anything".

If I beat someone in a gambling match, I am far more likely to tell them what they did wrong or give them a tip that will improve their game. If someone shows that they have gamble and have chosen to lose a little dough to me instead of paying for a pool lesson, I will almost always (without mentioning it), see if they are interested in taking any advice. I kind of feel like I am obligated to give a little something in return for the lighter wallet.

If I was lucky enough to beat The GingerBread Man, I would not give him any advice because I already know, he knows more than me (besides, he can afford it more than me). :grin:
 
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billbOK said:
I totally agree with the OP and just can't agree with the argument above.

It is not the fear to lose that makes a great player, it's its will to win, IMO. The power of gambling in the process of progressing is far over rated here at AZB. The formula is the love of the game, the motivation, the dedication, then practicing and playing times (including gambling, why not).

If gambling was a so important factor in the learning process it will be apllied in any kind of activity. This is certainly why we don't gamble on math at school... for an example :grin:
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I disagree!!!!! Gambling on math at school would improve test scores like you wouldn't believe. It would also bring an unhealthy love of math to those who previously didn't care about it. To improve kids math even more we could have the losers of big bets be humiliated in front of the entire school. It would prove that placing value on improving through gambling really does make a difference, and public humiliation is always cool.
 
This is just food for thought, but how many pool players do you know that actually have any money to gamble (or otherwise spend on utilities at home for that matter)? I've seen more air barrels fired at the pool room than anywhere else, and I've been around professional gambling for years. Just look at our own "Action Room" sub forum. With the exception of Dippy D, Bartrum and perhaps a few others, it's just a bunch of woofing. I remember a Jesse Bowman thread going through pages ad naseum with no actual game materializing. I think that they should rename it the "Inaction" Room.


I have stated that I don't gamble, but that is a general rule. In order for me to gamble at a pool game, I just really have to NOT like you. And then, it's still NOT ABOUT THE MONEY. I just really want to punish you. I was approached by this misanthrope degenerate one time who "suckered" me into a 1 pocket game, even. When I had him sufficiently stuck and humiliated in front of his posse, he started to ask for weight, which I proceeded to give. When he could not win with that spot, and asked for a more, outrageous one, I gave that to him as well. I played just as well, but he was able to break even with that laughable spot. Don't worry though, he was beaten down enough that he never asked me to play any game ever again. Though no money changed hands, I would say that I clearly won the bet.
 
I think gambling makes you better at gambling, It is also a way
to remain focused while practicing. But for me, That is where the
benefit ends
Petey
 
u play for $ and it affects your whole game. you have to remember i miss and that $ is gone so the pressure can make you take the wrong shot or make you shake or just plain out miss . it put's a more yes i'm good . than playing were nothing matters
 
JesseAllred said:
I disagree!!!!! Gambling on math at school would improve test scores like you wouldn't believe. It would also bring an unhealthy love of math to those who previously didn't care about it. To improve kids math even more we could have the losers of big bets be humiliated in front of the entire school. It would prove that placing value on improving through gambling really does make a difference, and public humiliation is always cool.
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I like your style :grin:
 
Good question. IMO:

Gambling could make you a better gambler and a wiser player. Gambling alone does not make you a better pool player.

Knowledge and then perfect Practice would make a better player.

It's very hard ( if not impossible) to implement something new while you are playing. Possibly a stategy or new technique, yes. But a new PSR or stroke sequence takes practice.

Just my thoughts
SPF=randyg
 
JesseAllred said:
I disagree!!!!! Gambling on math at school would improve test scores like you wouldn't believe. It would also bring an unhealthy love of math to those who previously didn't care about it. To improve kids math even more we could have the losers of big bets be humiliated in front of the entire school. It would prove that placing value on improving through gambling really does make a difference, and public humiliation is always cool.
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This is a great point! Can I now disagree with the OP??? Is that allowed on this forum? Don't misunderstand me, I believe in the motivating factor of competition in all of its forms, including gambling. Quite frankly, math scores would improve if we adopted your mindset.

I guess it's too late now but maybe the question should have been: If you were looking to improve your game and you had to choose either gambling or practice, which would you choose? I'm willing to concede the fact that gambling can help with the mental side of the game and even help you learn how to WIN. I'm not really concerned with that at this point. I just want to play better pool and for me I am going to continue to hit the practice table and validate my improvement by matching up and playing in tournaments.
 
randyg said:
[...]
Knowledge and then perfect Practice would make a better player.
[...]

Just my thoughts
SPF=randyg
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Oooo, Randy! Geno-marketing-machino has the trademark on that phrase, and you're supposed to capitalize the "p" in the word "perfect," not the word "practice." Any spellings or capitalizations to the contrary are a violation of the trademark, and he'll come after you! :p

J/K,
-Sean
 
Someone name all these top American players that never gambled? Gambling will not make you play better, it will only teach you to play under pressure. Most people, over 90%, will never learn to play shortstop speed reguardless of how much they play. I have seen it in everything in life, where everyone gets to their level and never gets better. There is a limit to how well anyone can do things with few exceptions. Gambling will make most dog it, not play better. I will give a example. Take someone who plays a ball better than me, but doesn't gamble, i will be a big favorite over this person gambling,why, because he has never played under real pressure. As some have mentioned, they feel pressure playing a league tournament, or a few bucks a game,so, what would you do under real pressure? Well,really you said you were easily motivated,but i think this is more accurate. Also, everyone has dogged it more than once. Also,when you talk about scumbag gamblers that tried to cheat you out of ten dollars, you were not playing a gambler, you were playing a knit. Real gamblers could care less about such small bets!
 
If I may add this to what I posted earlier.

When I was out there playing for money on a regular basis. I felt I had a decisive advantage when it came down to making key shots in close matches whether I was playing in a tournament or playing for money.

If a road player came through my area and I wasn't gambling, at the time, there was no way I would play them. They had to much of an advantage.
 
sfleinen said:
Oooo, Randy! Geno-marketing-machino has the trademark on that phrase, and you're supposed to capitalize the "p" in the word "perfect," not the word "practice." Any spellings or capitalizations to the contrary are a violation of the trademark, and he'll come after you! :p

J/K,
-Sean
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Ya, I'll slap my finger. Geno knows where to find me, we grew up together (same area).....:eek:

Happy Thanksgiving Sean.

SPF=randyg
 
How many would admit they don't gamble because they found out they choked for the cash, which makes it no fun,could never shake that feeling they had, and is the real reason they don't gamble? Don't take this wrong,i think most would be better off if they never gambled. I also think its nothing to be ashamed of, and its better to admit instead of hating gamblers that can do something you couldn't!
 
BasementDweller said:
This is a great point! Can I now disagree with the OP??? Is that allowed on this forum? Don't misunderstand me, I believe in the motivating factor of competition in all of its forms, including gambling. Quite frankly, math scores would improve if we adopted your mindset.

I guess it's too late now but maybe the question should have been: If you were looking to improve your game and you had to choose either gambling or practice, which would you choose? I'm willing to concede the fact that gambling can help with the mental side of the game and even help you learn how to WIN. I'm not really concerned with that at this point. I just want to play better pool and for me I am going to continue to hit the practice table and validate my improvement by matching up and playing in tournaments.
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I would choose practice. I chose gambling early on, playing even against champions. I was told that was the "only way to become a player". After losing about $90k I became a winning player, but now looking back I think gambling and practicing with people your own speed or slightly better would be optimum.
 
randyg said:
Good question. IMO:

Gambling could make you a better gambler and a wiser player. Gambling alone does not make you a better pool player.

Knowledge and then perfect Practice would make a better player.

It's very hard ( if not impossible) to implement something new while you are playing. Possibly a stategy or new technique, yes. But a new PSR or stroke sequence takes practice.

Just my thoughts
SPF=randyg
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We are on the same page
Petey
 
I've brought this up before, but I'll try it again....

what was my motivation to get a hit in the bottom of the 9th, 2 outs, and a man on 2nd - down one run? Would I have been more likely to get the base knock if I'd bet the pitcher $100? Some (and I'll concede it is only SOME) have crazy competitive drive regardless of any $$$ on the line. What's really scary is when those folks get the gambling bug. Then you have Charles Barkley and Michael Jordan betting five figures on a ping pong game. Will it make them play better ping pong? I don't really think so. Does it add to the WIN? Absolutely.

I know lotsa players who are willing to bet the farm when they have an advantage, but won't bet a nickel if it's an even match. Are "they" gonna be better players in PRESSURE situations?? Just because folks are good money players (when the game is right) doesn't always equate to beating a non-money player in an even game (like in a tourney). Playing for something makes you better at playing for something. ANd I don't think losing at anytime (with anything) is meaningless, whether it's for (as most on here like to say) funsies, or a gazillion dollars. I don't wanna lose a game of 1P for $1....so losing one for $100 is only different monetarily. I don't think raising the stakes to try to put a more damaging dent in my wallet will increase or decrease the mistakes I make. JMO
 
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exoldschoolpro said:
How many would admit they don't gamble because they found out they choked for the cash, which makes it no fun,could never shake that feeling they had, and is the real reason they don't gamble? Don't take this wrong,i think most would be better off if they never gambled. I also think its nothing to be ashamed of, and its better to admit instead of hating gamblers that can do something you couldn't!
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I like this post on a lot of different levels. I think it's very telling and a lot of good info.

I do think if you want to be better at tourneys you have to go figure out a way to play against different competition. Go to the tourneys within a few hours and play the guys there and get the seasoning. Tourneys are a lot of pressure cause you get one set to win.

If you wanna be a gambler, you need more knowledge and be able to honestly rate your own speed. If you know how good your opponent plays and you know how good you actually play...you might never make a bad game.

If you want to get better though, gotta put the time at the table in mostly practicing. Figure out what you want to practice and then master it before moving on. You dont shoot that tough shot until you make it, you shoot it until you cant miss it.
 
peteypooldude said:
I think gambling makes you better at gambling, It is also a way
to remain focused while practicing. But for me, That is where the
benefit ends
Petey
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Hey Petey;

Don't you think learning how to remain focused while playing would improve your game a significant degree?

Mike
 
exoldschoolpro said:
How many would admit they don't gamble because they found out they choked for the cash, which makes it no fun,could never shake that feeling they had, and is the real reason they don't gamble? Don't take this wrong,i think most would be better off if they never gambled. I also think its nothing to be ashamed of, and its better to admit instead of hating gamblers that can do something you couldn't!
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This post made me think of a local player, He dogs his brains out, If
all is perfect, Then he will jump straight in the air mid=stroke. He
Has also never learned his lesson. He lost his house and vehicles
and will still play for more than he is holding. He is our local FOOL.
I dont do a lot of gambling, I have more important obligations.
I also am not insecure about my game, ( I will get in the box)
But most of the time, I have a backer and the nuts. I dont bark
at players, but I will bite if the situation is right. LOL
 
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