FargoRate Question

[Flakeandrun]

I want to establish a Fargo rating, but I am playing far away from any Fargo related activities. There are players here who do have a Fargo rating, but no one really gives a flying F about it since covid... I did hear one of the Tournaments here is going to try and bring Fargo to the table, but not sure how they're going with that as post-CNY, and still waiting for the years tournament schedule.

I regularly play someone rated mid-600s (which he established when living in the US), who I beat very consistently (I'd say 8 out of 10 times I am finishing on top).
I have also beaten a couple of established 700+ players, and a 774 (I wrote previously here about this, these players were previously competing on the pro-circuit). There are some players I would say are playing at around that speed (by my eye) here, who play in tournaments domestically that I often play with, but these players have no interest in Fargo. I would say these players are currently considerably better than me, but I am competitive with them, and I would like to gauge my Fargo and work to being regularly more competitive with these guys.

I saw Salotto mentioned in another thread, how could I use that to establish a rating? Do I need to sign up to the Fargo app? Really a little clueless how it works. Help appreciated

 

[DeadStick]

I’m sure the Salotto app will tell you all you need to know. Your opponent(s) will need to have it also.

 

[Flakeandrun]

I’m sure the Salotto app will tell you all you need to know. Your opponent(s) will need to have it also.

So I can just get my friends to download it, and it's pretty straight forward? Sorry if that sounds like a dumb question

Can it change the language? Some of my friends aren't so proficient with English (and I don't fancy translating over and over for a group of friends)

 

[iusedtoberich]

Both you and opponent need to download the salotto app. It ties into your fargo account (but is a separate app). (It may make one if you don't have one, I forget). Once you have the app, you create a match, stating location, game, race, etc. Then you invite your opponent (via the app) to join. There is a fee of about 3 USD for a race up to 10. Whoever created the match pays the fee. The opponent does not pay anything. The button labeled "report to fargorate" must be clicked on, otherwise the scores won't be reported back to fargorate.

 

[Flakeandrun]

Both you and opponent need to download the salotto app. It ties into your fargo account (but is a separate app). (It may make one if you don't have one, I forget). Once you have the app, you create a match, stating location, game, race, etc. Then you invite your opponent (via the app) to join. There is a fee of about 3 USD for a race up to 10. Whoever created the match pays the fee. The opponent does not pay anything. The button labeled "report to fargorate" must be clicked on, otherwise the scores won't be reported back to fargorate.

Ok, I will see if I can encourage a few friends to download Salotto. I hope it makes one for me, less effort the better.
Thanks for your explanation on how that works It only does races to 10? (Here is usually 7 for fun, or 15 for $$$)
Wish it was cheaper than 3$ a go, as 600$ to get 200 games in (200 is the requirement for a solid rating right?)
Again, sorry if these questions are dumb

 

[iusedtoberich]

Ok, I will see if I can encourage a few friends to download Salotto. I hope it makes one for me, less effort the better.
Thanks for your explanation on how that works It only does races to 10? (Here is usually 7 for fun, or 15 for $$$)
Wish it was cheaper than 3$ a go, as 600$ to get 200 games in (200 is the requirement for a solid rating right?)
Again, sorry if these questions are dumb

Not dumb at all. I actually had a hard time figuring out the app to be honest.

You can play any race length you like. The app charges 3 USD "up to" a race to 10. If the race is longer, it's slightly more expensive. So from that standpoint, its cheaper to play a race to 10 rather than a race to 7, if you are only playing for fargo points and not also gambling.

Yes, 200 games is "established".

I doubt it has any languages other than English, but I can't confirm. There is not much to read, however, Its mostly numbers. Pick the game (8, 9, 10 ball), the race length, the location, etc. Once the set starts, you hit the + button for a player anytime they win a game, to keep score within the app. After the set is finished, the results will show up in your FargoRate app almost immediately, but will take about 2 days to affect your fargorating.

The thing I found hardest with the app is how to invite your opponent. And once you finish the first set, there is a button for "rematch". I found that hard for the opponent to accept.

It was more a usability issue, rather than a language issue. Common with small and independent app developers.

 

[iusedtoberich]

The fee is paid by whoever sets up the match in the app. It's paid through the apple app store system. It can't be decided after the set who pays. The fairest way I've found to split the fees is each set is started by the next person.

Or, you can pay it back in cash your half after the session is over.

 

[Atorontopoolplayer]

Ok, I will see if I can encourage a few friends to download Salotto. I hope it makes one for me, less effort the better.
Thanks for your explanation on how that works It only does races to 10? (Here is usually 7 for fun, or 15 for $$$)
Wish it was cheaper than 3$ a go, as 600$ to get 200 games in (200 is the requirement for a solid rating right?)
Again, sorry if these questions are dumb

Games meaning actual racks though not sets, only really about 15 races to 10 can get you to 200 racks

 

[Flakeandrun]

Games meaning actual racks though not sets, only really about 15 races to 10 can get you to 200 racks

Oh, that's more reasonable! I'll pitch it to a group of friends and see what they think

How is the base rate established? Or does everyone start at a specific rating?

 

[DeadStick]

Wish it was cheaper than 3$ a go, as 600$ to get 200 games in (200 is the requirement for a solid rating right?)

As I understand Salotto’s pricing (I haven’t used the app), it’s $3 to submit up to 10 games to Fargo. That’s $3 per 10 games, or $60 to get “established” with 200 games in the system. Races are meaningless - Fargo only cares about the win or loss of each game.

Ideally, you would find opponents with an established Fargo… otherwise you still won’t know where you stand.

 

[Flakeandrun]

As I understand Salotto’s pricing (I haven’t used the app), it’s $3 to submit up to 10 games to Fargo. That’s $3 per 10 games, or $60 to get “established” with 200 games in the system. Races are meaningless - Fargo only cares about the win or loss of each game.

Ideally, you would find opponents with an established Fargo… otherwise you still won’t know where you stand.

I can do that, as mentioned above, there are some rated players around me. Does the app essentially start with an estimate, then work to establish a more solid/reliable result? I'll try and only enter games with the players who I know have ratings to begin with. Would like to get a clear rating as quickly as possible, as I think it can be useful to track.

Price wise that works better. Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[DeadStick]

I can do that, as mentioned above, there are some rated players around me. Does the app essentially start with an estimate, then work to establish a more solid/reliable result? I'll try and only enter games with the players who I know have ratings to begin with. Would like to get a clear rating as quickly as possible, as I think it can be useful to track.

Price wise that works better. Thanks for clearing that up.

The app likely starts you at 0, or without a rating. “Starter ratings” are typically done by LOs or TOs, who are supposed to be unbiased (unlike you).

It doesn’t matter where you started once you’ve got 200 games in, though. Your preliminary rating gradually has less weight on your way to 200.

 

[iusedtoberich]

The app starts you with no assumed rating. You will become closely "tethered" to the players you play, until you branch out and play many more players.

The wording of the price structure of the app makes it seem like "10 total games" = xyz dollars. But I think they actually mean a "race to 10 games" = xyz dollars, etc.

I'm not super experienced. I played 5 total salotto matches with 2 different people. 2 races to 10 (my opponent paid both of them and set both up).

Second opponent was 3 total sets, a race to 5, race to 5, and race to 7. We took turns setting up the match in the app to split the payment and both gain salatto setup experience. One of the sets I messed up, and I think I ended up paying for it even though we never started it. So I lost $3 that way.

One other thing, the app has a pay by month structure, and a free structure. You don't need to pay for the app. You only pay for the sets if you want them reported to fargo. I don't even know what the pay by month gets you, but it is NOT needed. It STILL requires you to pay by the set if you do pay by the month.

 

[Flakeandrun]

The app likely starts you at 0, or without a rating. “Starter ratings” are typically done by LOs or TOs, who are supposed to be unbiased (unlike you).

It doesn’t matter where you started once you’ve got 200 games in, though. Your preliminary rating gradually has less weight on your way to 200.

So if you are playing someone else who is unrated, what happens then?
There are many great players here who are currently unrated.

I really hope the tournaments here can utilize Fargo, that would make everything much easier for me lol

 

[Flakeandrun]

The app starts you with no assumed rating. You will become closely "tethered" to the players you play, until you branch out and play many more players.

The wording of the price structure of the app makes it seem like "10 total games" = xyz dollars. But I think they actually mean a "race to 10 games" = xyz dollars, etc.

I'm not super experienced. I played 5 total salotto matches with 2 different people. 2 races to 10 (my opponent paid both of them and set both up).

Second opponent was 3 total sets, a race to 5, race to 5, and race to 7. We took turns setting up the match in the app to split the payment and both gain salatto setup experience. One of the sets I messed up, and I think I ended up paying for it even though we never started it. So I lost $3 that way.

One other thing, the app has a pay by month structure, and a free structure. You don't need to pay for the app. You only pay for the sets if you want them reported to fargo. I don't even know what the pay by month gets you, but it is NOT needed. It STILL requires you to pay by the set if you do pay by the month.

Really appreciate that tip! Free is always best.
I will try to play the higher level friends I have for the most part, as a reason I want to establish a FR is to see growth

 

[DeadStick]

So if you are playing someone else who is unrated, what happens then?
There are many great players here who are currently unrated.

Nothing of any meaning can possibly happen until you or one of your opponents plays someone with a Fargo rating. If/when that happens, adjustments will be made retroactively so previous games and opponents can be put into proper context and your rating will get more accurate.

If you want the quickest and most accurate rating, only pay money to submit games against an established Fargo opponent.

 

[Flakeandrun]

Nothing of any meaning can possibly happen until you or one of your opponents plays someone with a Fargo rating. If/when that happens, adjustments will be made retroactively so previous games and opponents can be put into proper context and your rating will get more accurate.

If you want the quickest and most accurate rating, only pay money to submit games against an established Fargo opponent.

All noted, set-up both apps. Thanks for assistance

 

[Bob Jewett]

... I really hope the tournaments here can utilize Fargo, that would make everything much easier for me lol

I have seen situations where TDs did not want to use any such rating system because they wanted full control over the players' ratings/handicaps. Sometimes that desire is benign and other times it is not.

 

[Flakeandrun]

I have seen situations where TDs did not want to use any such rating system because they wanted full control over the players' ratings/handicaps. Sometimes that desire is benign and other times it is not.

I think the tournaments in Shanghai will continue to use their own methods of player assessment for handicap situations, but a few of the players were wanting them to still use the FR system on the side. Before CNY many were chatting about it, and it seemed like that is their aim for the coming year here.

 

[iusedtoberich]

For the FargoRate app, it is offered as free, and as paid $12 (about) per year. The paid version shows you all of your match history. The free version does not. To me, it was worth it to see my match history, and to support the efforts by Mike and his team.

In my experience, when a location starts using Fargorate, some players will be very against it, while some players will be very for it. I think the ones for it will be greater, and there will even be players traveling from further away than normal to participate in tournaments that use it.