Finish

[cuejo]

Let me also say that I have used the cue finish from joe and it looks good too.
I don't see too many cues hanging out in the sun so the potential yellowing on the west system is kinda moot with me....
If I have to refinish a cue in 15 years due to yellowing, I may have to do some re thinking.



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[Joe Barringer]

I know that most cues don't hang out in the sun and most adhesives aren't subjected to Vegas sunshine. The point was to show that some products do yellow and I'm not willling to take the chance when there are products that don't yellow and provide something better (or is perceived to be better).

When I test something, I test to extremes. I want to know a products limitations and if it will hold up for my uses. The adhesive yellowed, not acceptable for me, so we looked for a product that didn't yellow.

Like Rick stated, especially for Cyano you need a non-yellowing base coat and West, G5 and Devcon are unacceptable. You can use Cyano without a base coat but if you choose to use a basecoat then choose one that won't yellow even when subjected to excessive testing.

If you're using West with clear coat and it's been working well then hey, go with it. No doubt you know what you're doing otherwise you wouldn't still be here. :thumbup:

 

[scdiveteam]

I know that most cues don't hang out in the sun and most adhesives aren't subjected to Vegas sunshine. The point was to show that some products do yellow and I'm not willling to take the chance when there are products that don't yellow and provide something better (or is perceived to be better).

When I test something, I test to extremes. I want to know a products limitations and if it will hold up for my uses. The adhesive yellowed, not acceptable for me, so we looked for a product that didn't yellow.

Like Rick stated, especially for Cyano you need a non-yellowing base coat and West, G5 and Devcon are unacceptable. You can use Cyano without a base coat but if you choose to use a basecoat then choose one that won't yellow even when subjected to excessive testing.

If you're using West with clear coat and it's been working well then hey, go with it. No doubt you know what you're doing otherwise you wouldn't still be here. :thumbup:

Joe,

Your points are well taken and the cyno is so water clear your test is very valid and you went to the extream... Over kill is always good when you want to be prudent.:idea:

Rick

 

[wdcustomcues]

Thanks to everyone that replied. I have went with an automotive clear coat I'm extremely happy with the results.

 

[Cue]

The 20 minute finish cure Epoxy also yellows, these are brand new bottles and you can see the hardener has yellowed.

 

[cueman]

The 20 minute finish cure Epoxy also yellows, these are brand new bottles and you can see the hardener has yellowed.

The Cue Cote hardener I use also yellows with shelf life, but is really stable when mixed and applied. So I am guessing the UV inhibitor is in the resin. That could also be the case with the finish cure. Auto clear coats also yellow over time. It is just how much time it takes. They seem to be the most stable color wise.

 

[treed]

clearcoats

i have used all the methods mentioned,none really satisfied me.hats off to all the expermenting that i have learned from on here.but you guys need to try the diamond clear from kbs coatings,hard, non-yellowing,permanatly flexible,and super clear.brush it on(foam brush no mixing toss brush),i usally do two coats.drys to the touch in less than 2 hrs.no sanding in between coats,razor blade(shave high spots).don't wanna create a fine dust to get in any pores, blow and tack cloth.by the way do use bloxgen and plastic film when you close the lid,it gets so hard that you will destroy the lid if you don't.now for the ca you've created a great base,now for the mirrow shine,add 3 to 5 coats of ca,but not any ca,i use the woodturners version,medium thickness designed to dry slower to create better flow.sand and polish.checkout my cues and you will see the results i get.thanx TR cues

 

[Joe Barringer]

The 20 minute finish cure Epoxy also yellows, these are brand new bottles and you can see the hardener has yellowed.

This post has no bearing on the reality of how this product works. Yes, it is yellow in the packaging (normal) but goes on clear, dries clear and does not yellow. Out tests proves that.

 

[Dirtbmw20]

i have used all the methods mentioned,none really satisfied me.hats off to all the expermenting that i have learned from on here.but you guys need to try the diamond clear from kbs coatings,hard, non-yellowing,permanatly flexible,and super clear.brush it on(foam brush no mixing toss brush),i usally do two coats.drys to the touch in less than 2 hrs.no sanding in between coats,razor blade(shave high spots).don't wanna create a fine dust to get in any pores, blow and tack cloth.by the way do use bloxgen and plastic film when you close the lid,it gets so hard that you will destroy the lid if you don't.now for the ca you've created a great base,now for the mirrow shine,add 3 to 5 coats of ca,but not any ca,i use the woodturners version,medium thickness designed to dry slower to create better flow.sand and polish.checkout my cues and you will see the results i get.thanx TR cues

So you did 2 coats of Diamond clear, and then 3-5 coats of CA on top of the Diamond clear, then sand and polish...... and the result is the finished cue pictured ?? Beautiful finish !!!

 

[Cue]

I have used this BSI epoxy in model airplanes for 15 years, it does yellow on them when exposed to the sunlight/UV. It is used mostly to glass white foam wings and it shows the yellowing against the white foam easily, although probably not noticeable on a cue.

This post has no bearing on the reality of how this product works. Yes, it is yellow in the packaging (normal) but goes on clear, dries clear and does not yellow. Out tests proves that.

 

[whammo57]

I have used this BSI epoxy in model airplanes for 15 years, it does yellow on them when exposed to the sunlight/UV. It is used mostly to glass white foam wings and it shows the yellowing against the white foam easily, although probably not noticeable on a cue.

Was the epoxy also exposed to fuel ?

Kim

 

[whammo57]

i have used all the methods mentioned,none really satisfied me.hats off to all the expermenting that i have learned from on here.but you guys need to try the diamond clear from kbs coatings,hard, non-yellowing,permanatly flexible,and super clear.brush it on(foam brush no mixing toss brush),i usally do two coats.drys to the touch in less than 2 hrs.no sanding in between coats,razor blade(shave high spots).don't wanna create a fine dust to get in any pores, blow and tack cloth.by the way do use bloxgen and plastic film when you close the lid,it gets so hard that you will destroy the lid if you don't.now for the ca you've created a great base,now for the mirrow shine,add 3 to 5 coats of ca,but not any ca,i use the woodturners version,medium thickness designed to dry slower to create better flow.sand and polish.checkout my cues and you will see the results i get.thanx TR cues

The finish you speak of is $50 a quart. It is supposed to be a super finish.

Why did you put CA over it. Did you try buffing the diamond clear first?

I am curious because I was considering using it.

Kim

 

[Cue]

No, they are Electric powered.

Was the epoxy also exposed to fuel ?

Kim

 

[Joe Barringer]

I have used this BSI epoxy in model airplanes for 15 years, it does yellow on them when exposed to the sunlight/UV. It is used mostly to glass white foam wings and it shows the yellowing against the white foam easily, although probably not noticeable on a cue.

Once again your application is not this application. You're playing with toys in the field when we're discussing building professional products in a forum that is for cue makers. Are you a cue maker?

Furthermore, we put it on white paper and exposed it to direct sunlight for days. No yellowing whatsoever.

Here's the proof:
http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/cuecomponents_2229_88030336

 

[treed]

diamond clear

i have'nt yet got the diamond to buff and look as good as the ca,i hope i can ,as it is solvent resistant when dry.i think that the multistep process with adding the ca is similiar to the old technic of adding multiple coats of laquer.the woodworkers ca is also important,as i have tried other ca with different results.the process usally takes a few days,as i like for the diamond to cure fully before adding the ca.this is when you find out just how hard this stuff gets.this is also not only the best,but one of the cheapest finishes i've tried.i used to get some chipping around the joint when facing with other finishes,but not with this stuff it bites.

 

[GBCues]

I think this coating looks worth trying, but I wish they had a link to the Material Safety Datasheet or whatever it's called - I can't find one.

My shop is in my basement and while I do have an exterior exhaust, I would still like to know what's in it.

Gary

 

[Dirtbmw20]

I think this coating looks worth trying, but I wish they had a link to the Material Safety Datasheet or whatever it's called - I can't find one.

My shop is in my basement and while I do have an exterior exhaust, I would still like to know what's in it.

Gary

There is a link to the right of the page where you can REQUEST a MSDS be sent to you, but it is not available for viewing on their website.

 

[Cue]

Joe, Im just telling my experience with it.
Not that it matters but I have been building cues for over 15 years as a hobby, got 6 or 7 lathes and build other things as well.

Leave it in the sunlight for 1-3 years, not 3 days which is what my findings show, if you don't don't agree I cant help that, I am just adding to the discussion and relaying my experience to what has happened using this epoxy.

Cue are just as much toys as my airplanes, maybe even more since they are for Playing a game :wink:
A $5000 30 pound airplane or a $20,000 Turbine jet is not much of a kids toy, but I see all the time where the general public has no knowledge about them. :smile:

Once again your application is not this application. You're playing with toys in the field when we're discussing building professional products in a forum that is for cue makers. Are you a cue maker?

Furthermore, we put it on white paper and exposed it to direct sunlight for days. No yellowing whatsoever.

Here's the proof:
http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/cuecomponents_2229_88030336

 

[Joe Barringer]

Joe, Im just telling my experience with it.
Not that it matters but I have been building cues for over 15 years as a hobby, got 6 or 7 lathes and build other things as well.

Leave it in the sunlight for 1-3 years, not 3 days which is what my findings show, if you don't don't agree I cant help that, I am just adding to the discussion and relaying my experience to what has happened using this epoxy.

Cue are just as much toys as my airplanes, maybe even more since they are for Playing a game :wink:
A $5000 30 pound airplane or a $20,000 Turbine jet is not much of a kids toy, but I see all the time where the general public has no knowledge about them. :smile:

OK, pardon me -- adult toys and let's not get perverted. The difference between men and boys is the price of their toys. So my statement was quit in line with mentioning toys. That being said....

We're not talking about leaving our cues exposed to sunlight for 1 to 3 years. And, our test was for more than 3 days. Point being, it doesn't yellow. We've used it for years and haven't experienced one cue yellowing because of it. I don't know anyone who plays pool in the sunlight so I don't see the relevancy. To the contrary, everyone plays pool indoors in dimly lit rooms.

And now for the real resaon why it may be yellowing in your application. Finish Cure epoxy does not yellow when, like any product, its used correctly; period. However, when it isn't applied properly, it may yellow. It needs to be applied at a temperature of at least 85 degrees and that's probably why you're experienceing yellowing.

 

[TomHay]

I just got back from my chemical blending Plant in Jacksonville. I have a two part non yellowing epoxy. It is a Hybrid but the formulation is not new, many make it. High Solids though so it is more expensive than Car Clear Coat.