for you sandpaper freaks , lol
- Thread starter BHQ
- Start date
BHQ said:guy brings me his meucci original to retip
shaft was like a pencil
10.27mm
20 plus years of sanding on the shaft and this is what the ferrule looked like,
what was left of it
when i cut off the tip, ferrule came right off too
Damn. What was it 100 grit sandpaper or less?
BHQ said:guy brings me his meucci original to retip
shaft was like a pencil
10.27mm
20 plus years of sanding on the shaft and this is what the ferrule looked like,
what was left of it
when i cut off the tip, ferrule came right off too
I have seen the same thing happen a number of times. I did a little research, during the late 80's, through the mid-90's Meucci used two types of ferrules on their cues. While the material was the same, some of the ferrules used had a very thin wall to start with. I am unsure if this was intentional or just poor quality control. But I have seen both type ferrules on shafts that were still between 12.75 and 13 mm.
I see alot of them with oversized tenons also. The problem is alot of times the ferrule walls are too thin regardless of shaft dia, and can crack easily, especially if the tip gets too thin, altough there is more wood in there, and they may deflect less. Alot of people have had Me cut a normal sized tenon to increase the wall thickness of their ferrules. In some case It's more then the tenon size though, and the shaft has been sanded down over the years. At 10.27mm It sounds like It's had alot of sanding, and what probably happened here as suspected.
Greg
Greg
I sold a Meucci shaft like that to a friend who loves it
I sold a Meucci shaft like that to a friend who loves it. He is
from Europe, and was looking for a snooker shaft, and since
it's hard enough to find a place to look at and buy cues around
here, he *begged* me to sell it to him. I did not measure it
but I estimate it was 9-10mm. I asked him if it was too thin,
and he said "Hell no, I've played with 6mm shafts before".
I sold a Meucci shaft like that to a friend who loves it. He is
from Europe, and was looking for a snooker shaft, and since
it's hard enough to find a place to look at and buy cues around
here, he *begged* me to sell it to him. I did not measure it
but I estimate it was 9-10mm. I asked him if it was too thin,
and he said "Hell no, I've played with 6mm shafts before".
BHQ said:no, He doesn't want a new shaft. oddly enough, he asked me i could make him an extra at the same dimensions.
You realize that sanding a shaft never did that to that ferrule but someone with a lathe purposely turned it down to that size. For years Meucci used a MP tube ferrule material with a .375 tenon. This left the ferrule pretty thin to start with and the MP material, being as weak as it is to start with, that they cracked very easily. In years gone by I've replaced litterly hundreds of broken Meucci ferrules. However, MP plastics melt and can be shaped at low temperatures where as phenolics will break down. Another trait of MP type plastics is that they do not sand very well but must be cut. I'm sure you have noticed that on older Meucci cues that have been sanded or a green pad used on very much by the owner that the shaft will be much smaller in the area behind the ferrule. If the ferrule is that small then someone intentionally did it. Of coarse I have no idea if it was done to make the whole shaft that small or just to make the ferrule the same size as the shaft that was sanded down that far from bad sanding habits. People don't like change but they acclimatize to a cue very quickly. If they pick up a cue that weighs more than they are used to or has a smaller or larger shaft they seldom will like it at first. Usually, if they use it for a week or two then they will come to like it. Since his shaft has been whittled down over the years that is now what he is accustomed to and a quick change would be startling to him.
Dick
yeah, i know dickie. the ferrule was actually bugle shaped when i got it. the last time he had a tip put on, a few years ago according to him, he had the ferrule turned true to shaft diameter. since that time, his constant sanding on the shaft , left the ferrule larger than shaft except for where it meets the shaft, leaving that bugle shape to ferrule. it was approx. 25/1000ths diff from shaft to end of ferrule. i was just trying to point out what happens when somebody stands around all nite with sandpaper in hand while playing.rhncue said:
> You'd be surprised at how many I've seen like this. Some,like Richard noted,are indeed made this way. Others,and much more common in my area,are the ones that wind up this way from being happy with sandpaper,either from using it a LOT,or using way too coarse a grit to do anything but harm to a shaft. I could sponsor the IPT myself if I had 100 bucks for all the times I've seen locals in the room here go behind the counter,where there is almost always 1/2 sheet of 150 grit,and use that to "slick" up their shafts. They don't realize that slight "baby powder' effect caused by using the fresh sanding dust in the pores is what caused it to get all nasty to start with,and some will not be told otherwise. I just fix 'em up as best I can and send them back,because I know they'll BE back. I know several that aren't that bad,but are using 400-600 for the same thing,and use it quite often. They'll bring several 3-4" slips of 400,use them 5-6 times in an hour,then throw them away and get a fresh one. Can't tell them they're wrong either.
I worked on one for a guy in Missouri that had been sanding on what started as a brand new 13.25mm Meucci,for years,similar to the guy Brent mentioned. The shaft came to me and I miked it at .432,just under 11mm,or in standard .080 worth of wood. His ferrule was REAL thin,like Brent's too. What amazed me was that as bad as the ferrule/wood shelf was,that the shaft was about .035-.040 smaller than that back in his stroking area,about 14" behind the ferrule. He broke hard with it weakened like that too,and it made a weird noise every time he broke with it,but the ferrule never cracked,and you swore the shaft was going to break right in the middle of his stroke. I can only attribute it not breaking to the fact that occasionally,you got really nice shaftwood from Meucci back then. That may be the only ferrule made out of that material I ever saw broke with that didn't eventually crack. They are prone to melting,easily removed in a lathe with leather as previously stated,and prone to all kinds of angular "burns" along the sides of the tip by going into the cloth when breaking,the heat melts part of the cloth into the ferrule,taking nasty chalk dust with it. For a really good example of this,watch your favorite Earl video,his break cue had them all over the place,Cuetec uses a very similar soft ABS-type plastic. Sometimes there are so many flat spots burnt into it you can't do anything but change them.
I've made it standard procedure to tell my customers how bad off their ferrule-wall thickness is on Meucci stuff,and give them the option of putting a new ferrule on it just like it is,and tell if them if I do,that they can be assured of them having to bring it back within a month for the same job. Or, having me cut the tenon down to 5/16,and install a ferrule of the same material,but "less" prone to crack due to the thicker walls. My 3rd option involves cutting the tenon down to thread it and install something that will play better and never break again. Not a single one of them has ever chosen #3,for just 10 bucks more. 90% of the local avid poolplayers think that changing from that stuff to something like Ivorine or Aegis is a sin,because then their "high-dollar" Moochi won't be "original". Tommy D.
I worked on one for a guy in Missouri that had been sanding on what started as a brand new 13.25mm Meucci,for years,similar to the guy Brent mentioned. The shaft came to me and I miked it at .432,just under 11mm,or in standard .080 worth of wood. His ferrule was REAL thin,like Brent's too. What amazed me was that as bad as the ferrule/wood shelf was,that the shaft was about .035-.040 smaller than that back in his stroking area,about 14" behind the ferrule. He broke hard with it weakened like that too,and it made a weird noise every time he broke with it,but the ferrule never cracked,and you swore the shaft was going to break right in the middle of his stroke. I can only attribute it not breaking to the fact that occasionally,you got really nice shaftwood from Meucci back then. That may be the only ferrule made out of that material I ever saw broke with that didn't eventually crack. They are prone to melting,easily removed in a lathe with leather as previously stated,and prone to all kinds of angular "burns" along the sides of the tip by going into the cloth when breaking,the heat melts part of the cloth into the ferrule,taking nasty chalk dust with it. For a really good example of this,watch your favorite Earl video,his break cue had them all over the place,Cuetec uses a very similar soft ABS-type plastic. Sometimes there are so many flat spots burnt into it you can't do anything but change them.
I've made it standard procedure to tell my customers how bad off their ferrule-wall thickness is on Meucci stuff,and give them the option of putting a new ferrule on it just like it is,and tell if them if I do,that they can be assured of them having to bring it back within a month for the same job. Or, having me cut the tenon down to 5/16,and install a ferrule of the same material,but "less" prone to crack due to the thicker walls. My 3rd option involves cutting the tenon down to thread it and install something that will play better and never break again. Not a single one of them has ever chosen #3,for just 10 bucks more. 90% of the local avid poolplayers think that changing from that stuff to something like Ivorine or Aegis is a sin,because then their "high-dollar" Moochi won't be "original". Tommy D.
Haha. This thread reminds me of a guy I knew who bought a new cue. He shoots with it for a rack and asks if I had sandpaper.
"Of course," I reply, figuring he wanted to shape the brand new tip.
I hand him some 150 grit sandpaper, and he takes it and SANDS DOWN THE SHAFT to smooth it. I look at him and he sees I have a look of horror on my face.
It was probably more that I was shocked anyone could think that 150 grit could smooth out his shaft. Too bad he didn't know I had other sand paper, ranging from 600 - 2000 grit with me!
"Of course," I reply, figuring he wanted to shape the brand new tip.
I hand him some 150 grit sandpaper, and he takes it and SANDS DOWN THE SHAFT to smooth it. I look at him and he sees I have a look of horror on my face.
It was probably more that I was shocked anyone could think that 150 grit could smooth out his shaft. Too bad he didn't know I had other sand paper, ranging from 600 - 2000 grit with me!
same as the steel wool guys, you can accomplish the same thing and not destroy your shaft, abrasive cleaners arnt necessary 99% of the time. If you dont care about your shaft then I suppose its cool. I like playing with the same diameter shaft month after month.