Ga-Young Kim
- Thread starter over60pirate
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Like Varner said long ago....when asked about skill and....why men are better than women. ''More men play pool than do women'', simple as that he said. Ga Youngs background playing women and men, is and has been at a higher level than most all her peers, past and present cept maybe Jean, but how good waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaas Dorthy Wise, really????. When Allie stepped into the American pond, she was a ball better than her peers, right otta the gate. She could cut the hair off a ball, been around the great male snooker players, teachers and alike and was very disciplined....now she was in the states playing gals groomed on gambling and pool room life American Style. Also, she was playing with large cut pockets, or pocket sizes that were very accommodating, to make the WPBA TV production better. Allie/Ga/Balukus. Jean saw the writing on the wall. Allie and Ga are two very special gals, able to create a life from hard work and a strong will. The game tho, will never let em go. 
it's what keeps em grounded.
it's what keeps em grounded.. Jean saw the writing on the wall. Allie and Ga are two very special gals, able to create a life from hard work and a strong will. The game tho, will never let em go. it's what keeps em grounded.[/QUOTE]
i try to avoid these as jean was a good friend whom i played about a thousand sets with...google the story stupid...she left because the same bag of *****es she was fighting for screwed her
no disrespect to allison or ga young....
it's what keeps em grounded.[/QUOTE]i try to avoid these as jean was a good friend whom i played about a thousand sets with...google the story stupid...she left because the same bag of *****es she was fighting for screwed her
no disrespect to allison or ga young....
So I absorbed the list of names you mentioned, considered their merits, and am left wondering what was inaccurate about my assertion that Allison reigned unopposed until Karen Corr came along?
I mean, HOF means nothing in this context considering it's completely relative to the era. Remember the 2+ years J.Lee was ranked 2nd behind Allison? How big was that gap?
Objectively, Allison could've given any one of those gals the 7 out. GYK maybe even more.
Lot of delusion in this thread. Though often in the conversation and at times the arguable best, Ga Young has never been the clear best player in the world among the women.
When Allison and Karen stopped dominating, perhaps about 2007, Ga Young was comparable, but not superior to, Jasmin Ouchan and Kelly Fisher. From 2008-12, I'd say Ga Young and Kelly Fisher were equals, and in more recent times, Ga Young, Han Yu, and Siming Chen are roughly equals.
At no point has Ga Young dominated her sport, and her game has never been even nearly comparable to the top men of her era. Allison rarely competed against the men, but Jean Balukas competed with some success against the professional male players of her day, owning match victories over probably thirty different male HOFers. Karen Corr has several Joss tour titles and has pro match wins over many of the greatest male players of her era. Ga Young has a long way to go to be in the conversation with the likes of Allison, Karen, and Jean. Perhaps she'll get there. She's a legend of the game, but she'll have to do more to convince this avid 40-year follower of women's pro pool that she's worhty of comparison with the all-time greats.
When Allison and Karen stopped dominating, perhaps about 2007, Ga Young was comparable, but not superior to, Jasmin Ouchan and Kelly Fisher. From 2008-12, I'd say Ga Young and Kelly Fisher were equals, and in more recent times, Ga Young, Han Yu, and Siming Chen are roughly equals.
At no point has Ga Young dominated her sport, and her game has never been even nearly comparable to the top men of her era. Allison rarely competed against the men, but Jean Balukas competed with some success against the professional male players of her day, owning match victories over probably thirty different male HOFers. Karen Corr has several Joss tour titles and has pro match wins over many of the greatest male players of her era. Ga Young has a long way to go to be in the conversation with the likes of Allison, Karen, and Jean. Perhaps she'll get there. She's a legend of the game, but she'll have to do more to convince this avid 40-year follower of women's pro pool that she's worhty of comparison with the all-time greats.
Do you really need to SEE GYK beat some of the current male greats? Liz Ford, Jennifer and many lesser players than GYK have beaten the male greats one time or another-you have doubts GYK would beat many, given the chance?. YEARS ago she got 2nd in the monthly Hard Times 96 man Open-losing to Oscar in the finals. She could care less if she is playing a man. Put her in 5-6 men's events and a great or two will fall along the way for sure. She just went undefeated in a 48 man event (Top pros were barred) last weekend in Melbourne Fl
Right Now she is playing better than Allison and Karen ever did imo-Jean I dont know- never saw her play.
GYK has 3 WPCs btw- I dont see any for Karen-but GYK can't compare? Ahaha
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And she just got 9-12th place in the tornado 10ball which includes tons of men champs, and she beat Danny Smith before losing to Efremmm.
And she just got 9-12th place in the tornado 10ball which includes tons of men champs, and she beat Danny Smith before losing to Efremmm.
That was bar table right? She NEVER plays on them.
I know! Cause there were none in TW or Korea.
Which makes it an amazing performance :thumbup:
This is not accurate. Jean beat the all-time greats like Mizerak, Butera, Hopkins, West, Hall, and many others considered among the best players that ever lived on countless occasions. I am not aware of Liz or Jennifer having beaten anyone of comparable pedigree in this era, and do not concur that Ga Young would fare well against the greats of this era such as SVB, Orcullo, Ko, Appleton, Feijen, Pagulayan, Reyes, Bustamante, Archer, Strickland. When has Ga Young collected a scalp of this quality, let alone dozens of them as Jean did?
I didnt say she would fare well against the men greats-I said she would get her wins just like Karen Corr has done on the Joss Tour which you seem to tout as critical. GYK doesn't live in the USA so she hasnt gotten those chances. Where did you expect her to get those scalps?
If you play in enough tournaments YOU would get wins against the greats-Karen doesn't have a winning record against the "greats" She's just had enough chances to win some. Also the greats that you list above are a bit above the ones you allude to on the Joss IMO.
PS_Liz definitely beat Earl in a tourny and I thought Jennifer did also but if not whoever she beat to win the Predator ( Sossei and/or Robles?) has to count.
What was Jean's best finish in a men's tournament? 2nd, 4th? 8th?
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I don't know the answer to your final question. Probably 1st.
We're not far apart here. We both see GYK as one of the all-time greats. We're only debating where she stands in the pecking order.
I don't see having a strong resume against men as critical, but it does help to frame the level of play for some of the all-time great women. In particular, Ruth McGuiness, a 130+ ball runner at 14.1, beat Greenleaf on a few occasions, though, just like Jean, she was a large cut above the women of her day. One win over a hall of famer is impressive, but ultimately meaningless. FYI, Sossei and Robles are not legends of the game, not even close, but had Jean played in this era and had beat either, nobody would have called it an upset.
Allison, Jean, Ruth and Karen merit mention as the four best women ever, but GYK can catch them all with a strong finish to an already phenomenal career. Looking forward to watching her continue to climb the ladder of all-time greatness.
I only pointed out the win over the hall of famer who you had listed as one of the greats to show that it is easy and common to get wins over greats if you play them enough. For you to somehow downplay GYK's game for not having these wins, given no opportunity to do so, when she surely would get her share is just a little illogical to me.
She OWNS the Tournament of Champions-Must have won it 5 or 6 times.
I agree that it's illogical to downplay the GYK career due to lack of big wins over top men, but to suggest that Liz Ford's one win over Earl is somehow mentionable with Jean's estimated twenty five wins over current hall of famers is even more illogical. For what it's worth, I have beaten a current BCA HOFer by a score of 11-0, but I will not embarrass them by naming them here, nor will I request status as a legend of the game. Things happen and serious underdogs win occasionally, but repeatedly beating the male legends means something, even if you don't think so, and Jean has done it.
Inclusive of the men, Jean was probably a top 30 in the world player. I really don't think that GYK has ever been even in the top 250 in the world if the men are included.
Just a shame that Jean was from a different era..
She was a force of nature on the women's tour and the whole rest of the field showed up fighting for second...
You are comparing something that cannot be compared but for my money I would give Jean the nod for now... Just the way it is since it's just opinion as there is no way to compare the 2 and no head to head battles to crown a winner...
I love GYK and watch her any chance I get as she is the embodiment of what a professional player should attempt to be as an ambassador for the sport..
In the very end she may get my nod over Jean.. Just not yet.....
I crash on Ga Young Kim
I crash on Jaenette Lee too
But I crash on Shanelle Loraine as well and I used to crash on Dorothy Wise once
I crash on Jaenette Lee too
But I crash on Shanelle Loraine as well and I used to crash on Dorothy Wise once
Even though i expalined it 2x, you still dont get why i mentioned Liz over Earl ( 8 yrs or more ago) . Im not repeating it. You build a nice strawman though. Plus i'll GIVE you Allison and Jean!!
What i wont give you is that GYK ISN'T IN THE CONVERSATION with the "likes of Karen" as far as best players of all time is concerned. Unless you are including Snooker that is!
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Yes, perhaps in the conversation with Karen. As I've said, she has a chance to eclipse all of them, and we should both enjoy watching how it all plays out.