GENDER IN POOL ... Do Men Play Better Than Women? ... Recent Legal Trial

@sjm
Measurimg someone's conceptualization abilities just by watching them may be misleading, especially if you're talking about the top female players. It's really not possible to know if they are shooting a shot incorrectly due to a conceptualization error or simply because of competence. You really need to talk to them about their decisions. Listening to Allison Fischer in the booth tells me she's pretty sharp. I will often shoot a shot different than a high level pro because I'm more likely to miss it if I shoot it "correctly". I'm sure this plays a part in the female game. Another factor is the top females know what it takes to compete at the rotation games -- so that's what they focus on. Not too many of them spend their off hours banging out 20 bucks a rack playing one-pocket.
 
BasementDweller said:
@sjm
Measurimg someone's conceptualization abilities just by watching them may be misleading, especially if you're talking about the top female players. It's really not possible to know if they are shooting a shot incorrectly due to a conceptualization error or simply because of competence. You really need to talk to them about their decisions. Listening to Allison Fischer in the booth tells me she's pretty sharp. I will often shoot a shot different than a high level pro because I'm more likely to miss it if I shoot it "correctly". I'm sure this plays a part in the female game. Another factor is the top females know what it takes to compete at the rotation games -- so that's what they focus on. Not too many of them spend their off hours banging out 20 bucks a rack playing one-pocket.
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I have discussed shot conceptualization with many of the women who are in the BCA Hall of Fame, Allison Fisher included, and some of the top women players of all time are counted among my closest friends. I have played hours and hours of pool with many of them, Allison Fisher included, and I have socialized with many of them on a regular basis. I am not speculating. I have also attended about 100 WPBA events in my life.

Still, competence is relevant if you mean competence in the ability to determine the percentages and, thereby, design the right shot for the right occasion. Yes, it can be argued that this might be deemed a competence gap.

Cueing competence, however, is not relevant here. If a man and a woman are equally competent in shot execution, the man, with very rare exception, will be the better player because of his edge in decision making and shot design. I am hard pressed to think of even three exceptions I have ever seen at a pro level of play.
 
Likely similar reasons there are few female chess grandmasters. On average, women excel at ‘multitasking’, while men ‘focus’ better.
 
Seeing a flush of top women players married or dating top players, I wonder how or if it will influence how they play or conceptualize runouts. Pia Filler, Kristina Tkach, Margarita Fefilova Styer ...

You would think they would see how their significant others runout tables and would apply some of that knowledge. Yet sjm says it isn't or hasn't happened.

There are obviously many factors that separate men and women, some of which go back to the genesis our species and are perhaps lost to time. But I admit that now and then I am quite puzzled by choices that women make relative to men.

One other thing I have noticed: Woman use draw far less than men. I see this professionally and in pool halls.

I don't know how many times I've seen a woman go forward on a ball and come off a short rail, while a man would draw and come off a long rail. The ball would travel less for the man, but require different levels of power and dexterity to pull off.
 
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sjm said:
I have discussed shot conceptualization with many of the women who are in the BCA Hall of Fame, Allison Fisher included, and some of the top women players of all time are counted among my closest friends. I have played hours and hours of pool with many of them, Allison Fisher included, and I have socialized with many of them on a regular basis. I am not speculating. I have also attended about 100 WPBA events in my life.
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I'm curious about what you mean by shot conceptualization when referring to gender differences in pool. Would be nice to see some examples...
 
Badpenguin said:
I'm curious about what you mean by shot conceptualization when referring to gender differences in pool. Would be nice to see some examples...
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Pool is just like chess….the right move is the winning move. I feel women aren’t that mean…..that’s why I love them.
 
Badpenguin said:
I'm curious about what you mean by shot conceptualization when referring to gender differences in pool. Would be nice to see some examples...
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Two examples of where there is a big difference in conceptualization are in a) defensive shot selection and b) downside management.

Defensive Shot Selection
There is a big gap in defensive shot selection between men and women. Men are more attentive to where the blockers are and play better angles behind those blockers. They are consistently more creative in building complex defensive strategies. They also use defense to open clusters more often than women.

Downside Management
Men do much more than women to manage their downside. Not only do they find many more two-way shots than women, but they ae much more attentive to speed control in managing the downside while they play offense. In addition, men are much more careful with their object ball when they play cue-ball-oriented safeties.
 
pt109 said:
Pool is just like chess….the right move is the winning move. I feel women aren’t that mean…..that’s why I love them.
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I once heard a railbird ask a stake horse what he looked for in the players he staked. The horse replied, “to a man, all great players I’ve ever seen have a certain mean streak to them”.
 
dr_dave said:
I recently served as an expert witness in a legal trial dealing with transgender women participation in female billiards events. Check out all the details in the following article, excerpts of which appear in this month's issue of Billiards Digest magazine:


And for more info on this topic, see:

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A transgender woman is a male who identifies as a woman who often has surgery to become a woman.....TOTAL LIE!!! There is no surgery that makes a man BECOME a woman, the surgery only makes the man LOOK like a woman, the surgery is nothing more than an expensive costume, the man still has xy chromosomes and ALWAYS will, Truth can only set you free if you desire objective truth, any other kind of truth is a lie.
 
Yeah self pity notwithstanding, the consensus among those so inclined is their 'soul' is the other sex. Crazy world this is it's possible that individuals might go get the ultimate tattoo to just fit their environment - actually the more I try to understand this, the less I comprehend or care...
 
In case it hasn’t been mentioned: the ratio of male to female players in the FargoRate system is about 6:1.

Here’s what AI says about it:
This gender imbalance is due to a combination of factors, including fewer opportunities for women, less encouragement, and a sometimes unwelcoming environment in pool halls, rather than any inherent inability for women to excel at the game.
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pj
chgo
 
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I think women should be able to play every bit as good as a man, especially when you eliminate the break shot that is tilted toward men due to their generally physical strength advantage. Aside from that and perhaps a height and arm reach advantage on a 9’ table, a woman can play every bit as good as a man in 14.1. Jean Balukas back in the late 60’s
emerged and became so dominant during the 70’s & 80’s, men pool players avoided playing her in exhibition matches.

A woman is as intelligent as any man, possesses the same skills as a man aside from physical strength or anatomical differences that can include height and arm reach and likely has just as much competitive drive and understanding of
the pool games. I really can’t see why there isn’t just open play where men and women compete against one another.

It might be because men tend to have more fragile egos than women if they lose to a woman whereas a woman just
views it as a loss if they lost to a man. Men tend to be more insecure about some things and losing to another gender
in pool, darts, archery, golf, ping pong, bowling, shooting or pretty much any athletic endeavor highlights our fragility.

Women are just as capable at mastering the game of pool as any male. It is just that pool halls have historically been a male dominated environment and this dates back to the late 1800’s you see in western movies with billiard rooms that extended right through the Twentieth Century. Lots of men have a difficult time acknowledging women are our equals or even superiors.
 
billiards_watch said:
Height isn't an issue since I believe shorter people have the advantage on a pool table. The best players at my pool hall are mostly short. It's easier for them to shoot since they don't have to bend down as far. They can lower field of vision just by merely spreading their legs more.
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That might be true with overweight and out of shape men but bending isn’t a physically demanding act to perform.
The truth is a lot of male pool players are not in good physical condition, are largely overweight and often by a lot.

Go into any pool hall and watch the different attendees from the afternoon to the evening right up until closing. Being short is never an advantage in pool unless you are playing on the little tables but on a 9’, heaven forbid a 10’, table it’s a huge disadvantage. The bridge or an extension is needed more often than with a tall player and even your stroke motion changes a little when your are stretching for any shot. A taller player has the advantage over a short player because they can reach shots a shorter person can’t and use the same stroking motion and arm position for a distant cue ball position as if the cue ball was only 2’ off the side rail. Men pool players, except younger ones, tend more to be overweight which is a manifestation of our population, eating habits and lack of physical exercise. That’s just America’s demographics, re: men’s bulging waistlines.
 
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