Gripping the cue

cheeseroller

Registered
Does it matter where one grips the cue? I am a tall guy with long arms, so I tend to grip the cue on normal shots about an inch from the end of the butt.

I have tried to grip farther up the butt of the cue, but it feels unnatural and my stroke feels confined.

Are there any others out there who like to grip the cue near the end?
 
gripping the cue

Where the grip is best depends on a lot of factors, including the balance point of the cue. The most important point being the arm must be hanging down (or slightly forward of perpendicular when the cue tip is touching the ball. That allows the maximum stroke and follow through without also pushing your elbow through the stroke. Whether you're tall or short doesn't mean as much as how much you bend over the cue at address of the shot.
 
I think most better players do not grip the Cue tight, they let in float in their grip hand kind of loose.
 
Where you grip is directly propontional to your arms span. The taller you are the further back you will grip to keep your back arm vertical. Bridge lenght also effcts where you grip.
Mark
 
I'm curious about this as well, except I'm a fairly short guy. I grip about an inch and half away from the butt of the cue, but I suspect it has more to do with my long bridge.
 
grip

It doesnt matter. Look at Jermey Jones, he holds the end of the cue and plays lights out. There are so many styles and so many of those diferent styles having success, it does not matter. Its all about feel.., do what feels right.
 
The shot should dictate your grip to some degree. I think it was Byrne that said in his book choke up and use a short bridge on shots that require more accuracy and use a longer bridge and grip father back for power shots.


Note, I'm no instructor though so take my advice with a grain of salt.
 
Well here's my 2 cents. Out of all the people I have worked with,I have never ever had anyone hold the cue to far forward.To me,most are always back to far.I can name a bunch of champions that In my opinion hold the cue to far back.And yes they are champions but I always wonder how good they could have been If they would have moved up on the cue a liitle.If you get back to far It will make you have a sort of shovel stroke.That Is the cue will be going up and down during the same stroke.
Different strokes for different folks,though. To me,I like Nick Varner and Ray Martins grip.Yeah I know,their small guys,but watch their stroke and where they grip the cue though.I can't stand that ole shovel stroke where the cue goes up and down.And I'm not talking about the pump handle stroke like the pinos.JBKY
 
You should try a longer cue. People are all a little different, but with my old cue(58") with forward balance I always felt like I was pushing the cue with my stroke.

With my new 60" cue, the weight/balance is closer to my hand and my stroke is more effortless, pendulum like, and consistent. It really brings to mind the advice of letting the cue do the work.
 
I learned to grip the cue wherever you need to to end up with your lower arm 90 degrees perpendicular to the ground. Thus your hand position for your bridge will be the main determining factor in where your back hand will end up on the cue.
 
Does it matter where one grips the cue? I am a tall guy with long arms, so I tend to grip the cue on normal shots about an inch from the end of the butt.

I have tried to grip farther up the butt of the cue, but it feels unnatural and my stroke feels confined.

Are there any others out there who like to grip the cue near the end?

I think you should watch some old Buddy Hall videos......
...you won't feel so bad about holding the cue long.
 
It's already been mentioned, but I will reiterate. Put your bridge hand down on the table where you are comfortable, away from the CB (if you do this 10 times, and measure with a ruler every time, you will likely find one distance that is more consistent...this is your "natural" bridge length). With the tip touching the CB, in your natural bridge, hold the cue where your back hand falls directly under your elbow. This is the proper place to hold the cue for most shots. It has nothing to do with the balance point. Cues today have different balance points. Grip position is generally based on height and wingspan (and certainly bridge length plays a role in this too). It is very common that a tall person will likely hold the cue at the back end. :D

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
 
I think most better players do not grip the Cue tight, they let in float in their grip hand kind of loose.

Thats not what he was asking, Gear Box. But considering that you seldom read the initial post and throw your opinion in just to up your post count, we will forgive you, once again.
 
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You should try a longer cue. People are all a little different, but with my old cue(58") with forward balance I always felt like I was pushing the cue with my stroke.

With my new 60" cue, the weight/balance is closer to my hand and my stroke is more effortless, pendulum like, and consistent. It really brings to mind the advice of letting the cue do the work.

What he said. Over the years I've played with 58", 59" and now I shoot with a 60" cue. Standard 58" inch cue is okay, but I always felt constrained, even when I hold it at the butt sleeve. Now I feel I have more options on length of bridge and I can finally hold it on the wrap with comfort. You should try one out, it might feel better--but balance point and stiffness (or lack of stiffness) might make you stick with a 58".
 
The way I teach it, of course as with all these matters, this is no more and no less than the ideal one tries to approach, the lower arm should be perpendicular to the floor. Now, what this really means is that the forearm should be dangling/hanging from the elbow down - if this what it feels like, i.e. there is no muscular tension and one can tell there's none, it doesn't matter what one's arm looks like from someone else's perspective, nor on video, nor on pics. No need to go into detail, but for physiological reasons, a human forearm that's perfectly dangling doesn't quite look like it does (usually looks lightly askew). It's not easy to feel "looseness" there as a billiards stance isn't particularly natural, nor the looseness of one's wrist that's part of all this (whereas grip, i.e. palm and fingers, is another matter), but the effort of learning to get a feel for this aspect of "stance" alone tends to make most I teach better players. Getting a feel for things is infinitely preferable to taking a set stance that is the result of a rationally conceived check list of "what one needs to do."

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
 
The way I teach it, of course as with all these matters, this is no more and no less than the ideal one tries to approach, the lower arm should be perpendicular to the floor. Now, what this really means is that the forearm should be dangling/hanging from the elbow down - if this what it feels like, i.e. there is no muscular tension and one can tell there's none, it doesn't matter what one's arm looks like from someone else's perspective, nor on video, nor on pics. No need to go into detail, but for physiological reasons, a human forearm that's perfectly dangling doesn't quite look like it does (usually looks lightly askew). It's not easy to feel "looseness" there as a billiards stance isn't particularly natural, nor the looseness of one's wrist that's part of all this (whereas grip, i.e. palm and fingers, is another matter), but the effort of learning to get a feel for this aspect of "stance" alone tends to make most I teach better players. Getting a feel for things is infinitely preferable to taking a set stance that is the result of a rationally conceived check list of "what one needs to do."

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti

90% to the floor?
With all due respect, this issue has been dealt with many times before. Unless your CUE is PARALLEL to the floor (table surface), 90% to the floor doesn't work very well. There are very few shots where you can place the cue parallel to the floor, - rails or object balls usually prevent it. Extreme examples are when you're shooting over a ball or jacked up with the CB close to a rail. If you try to position your forearm at 90% to the floor you will have to grip the cue too far forward, giving you a very limited stroke. Forearm position is best described as 90% to the cue for almost all shots.
In response to the post about "never" seeing anyone grip the cue too far forward, I've seen this many times. I have a friend who is 5'2" and grips the cue at the forward end of the wrap and sometimes even farther. By doing this he's actually increasing the disadvantage of being short. He's so close to the balance point that he HAS to use a closed bridge or the shaft will sometimes come up from his bridge hand like a see-saw (grip hand being the fulcrum). Bringing his grip hand back just an inch or so (and adjusting his bridge length and/or bridge arm position accordingly) would likely improve his game, but he's stubborn. I've suggested slightly shorter cues for very short people, but most think that a short cue is not "manly" enough. As I've asked in previous posts: Why do players ranging in height from 4'10" to 6'10" think that a 58" cue is the only option for them?
Donny L
BCA/ACS Instructor
Gainesville, Fl
 
90% to the floor?
With all due respect, this issue has been dealt with many times before. Unless your CUE is PARALLEL to the floor (table surface), 90% to the floor doesn't work very well. There are very few shots where you can place the cue parallel to the floor, - rails or object balls usually prevent it. Extreme examples are when you're shooting over a ball or jacked up with the CB close to a rail. If you try to position your forearm at 90% to the floor you will have to grip the cue too far forward, giving you a very limited stroke. Forearm position is best described as 90% to the cue for almost all shots.
In response to the post about "never" seeing anyone grip the cue too far forward, I've seen this many times. I have a friend who is 5'2" and grips the cue at the forward end of the wrap and sometimes even farther. By doing this he's actually increasing the disadvantage of being short. He's so close to the balance point that he HAS to use a closed bridge or the shaft will sometimes come up from his bridge hand like a see-saw (grip hand being the fulcrum). Bringing his grip hand back just an inch or so (and adjusting his bridge length and/or bridge arm position accordingly) would likely improve his game, but he's stubborn. I've suggested slightly shorter cues for very short people, but most think that a short cue is not "manly" enough. As I've asked in previous posts: Why do players ranging in height from 4'10" to 6'10" think that a 58" cue is the only option for them?
Donny L
BCA/ACS Instructor
Gainesville, Fl

I'm assuming you mean 90° as in degrees, and not % as in percent. I do not remember saying anything about the cue having to be parallel to the floor/the table bed - it would be hard to even think of an example situation. The matter is one of recognizing muscular tension, as same as in any swing, acceleration and thus cue ball action reaches a maximum if the tip contact is at the lowest point during the stroke (be that a pendulum swing or followed by elbow drop - if in the correct order, no difference). I agree there are many shots one can't possibly execute that way (I'm short myself, tell me about it…). That won't change physics and what one may want to at least try to grasp as a concept and try to accomplish on the average unimpeded shot (= the better one plays position, the more of those one will earn). Now, what you say about intentionally moving one's grip hand forward or backward can be put to use on a variety of shots, e.g. accelerating faster on a stun or draw shot where the cue ball is close to an object ball, that is along with shortening one's bridge versus gripping farther back in order to get more follow (instead of draw) with less swerve or unintentional jump shooting downwards e.g. over a ball or from a cushion. All these techniques are best put to use by those who have developed a feel for a loosely dangling forearm, and don't have to turn their head to see where their grip hand is positioned. The best player is one who has the freedom to choose from a variety of solutions, I always say, because he or she masters everything equally well. To learn and understand intuitively if one's forearm and wrist is dangling/hanging and thus free of muscular tension is a good start, I believe.

As to cue lengths, ask cue makers who've done comparison tests: most tell me that technically speaking shorter cues play better, but of course that anyone should play with what works best for them.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
 
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Didn't the old straight-poolers teach a forward grip?

About cue length, I'm 5'-8" and always felt more comfortable with a 57'" cue. In fact, that was the standard when I started and most house cues are still 57".

The OP should experiment with longer cues, they've become very prevalent.
 
Didn't the old straight-poolers teach a forward grip?

Makes sense given the cloths were woollier and slower (easier to accelerate into the stroke/impact at contact point). One can see it on many older photograph of legendary players. As to cue lengths, there are short players who like long cues because they can reach more, too. I'm short and personally prefer a shorter to standard length cue with a screw-in extension. When it comes to cues I say to each his or her own.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
 
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