Well don't leave me hangin'. Shoot me down. LOL
gunsmith lathe
- Thread starter D-Rock
- Start date
Well don't leave me hangin'. Shoot me down. LOL
While I wait, here is some useful info from the gunsmithing site I talked about:
Quote:
Originally Posted by CLARKMAG
Grizzly lathes are built from the same Chinese parts as other Chinese lathes.
It is just like Chinese riflescopes.
You want your own brand of Chinese lathes?
You fly to China.
You meet with these people:
http://www.made-in-china.com/manufac...t/Lathe-1.html
You pick the features from the catalog.
You make up some model numbers.
You pick some colors.
You tell them the name of your brand.
You hire a local QA man in China to represent you.
You fly back to the US.
You set up here in the USA, a sales, receiving & inspection, and customer service facility where you install DRO or other add ons.
Here are some names already taken in China: Jet, BSA, Grizzly, Mueller, Birmingham, Burris, GMC, Millet, Precision Matthews, Sightron, Sharp, Redfield, Enco, Bushnell, Turn-Pro, Simmons, Clausing, Pentax, South Bend, Weaver, etc.
Any name you pick, it will still have parts interchangeable with a Grizzly lathe.
I was not going to say anything this time but I wanted to respond to your reply, I have found what you are saying to be exactly the case! I had a few things to say about HF lathes (the 14x40" in particular) and basically that several of these brands are the same machine except for color and price. First I owned a POS Jet 9x20 which was EXACTLY the same machine as the Grizzly, Enco, HF and a number of other brands, I know from "hands-on" experience with both the Jet and HF that they are indeed the very same. I paid nearly twice as much for the Jet as the HF machine cost because everybody said HF machines were just rejects and complete junk, that may be so but the Jet was junk also! There was not any difference between the two in quality or anything else except color and price and I am finding that the same is apparently true for the larger 14x40 machines. I have the HF 14x40 and have access to an Enco 14x40, they are the same stinkin thing!! The Enco cost a heck of a lot more than the HF but after a year around both machines I KNOW that one is no better than the other which was exactly the same experience I had with the little 9x20, this time however I didn't fall for the "name" and saved a bunch of money. I posted links to pics of the HF 14x40, the Enco 14x40 and the Birmingham YCL14x40 and outwardly they all appear to be exactly the same, I have only gotten to look at the Birmingham without running it but I am sure the parts are interchangeable with my HF and maybe I am wrong but they damn sure don't look to be any better quality. Some may argue that Grizzly or Enco has a lot better service than HF and that may be true but HF does offer parts replacement and the thousands a person will save by buying form them will sure ease the frustration of lesser service if it is required. Others have told me that HF machines are just rejects that other companies turn away but I have seen no evidence of that and the people who told me were talking only from hear-say or opinion and had no proof of any kind. I joined a Yahoo group of HF lathe owners and those guys convinced me to buy from HF, it did not take much convincing after the Jet 9x20 fiasco! These guys are owners of these machines and they too are convinced that the HF lathes are the same as some other more expensive brands, are we wrong about that? Maybe but then maybe not and after over a year of searching for a good used "name brand" lathe and researching the ChiCom selections I honestly see no reason to spend the extra money for a supposedly better name if a person is going to buy Chinese. Certainly a good used American or European machine is going to be a lot better but if buying Chinese don't expect a brand name to be synonymous with quality, you could very well be paying a lot more money for a catchy paint job. I have been running my HF 14x40 for over a year now and I couldn't be happier with it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CLARKMAG
Grizzly lathes are built from the same Chinese parts as other Chinese lathes.
It is just like Chinese riflescopes.
You want your own brand of Chinese lathes?
You fly to China.
You meet with these people:
http://www.made-in-china.com/manufac...t/Lathe-1.html
You pick the features from the catalog.
You make up some model numbers.
You pick some colors.
You tell them the name of your brand.
You hire a local QA man in China to represent you.
You fly back to the US.
You set up here in the USA, a sales, receiving & inspection, and customer service facility where you install DRO or other add ons.
Here are some names already taken in China: Jet, BSA, Grizzly, Mueller, Birmingham, Burris, GMC, Millet, Precision Matthews, Sightron, Sharp, Redfield, Enco, Bushnell, Turn-Pro, Simmons, Clausing, Pentax, South Bend, Weaver, etc.
Any name you pick, it will still have parts interchangeable with a Grizzly lathe.
I was not going to say anything this time but I wanted to respond to your reply, I have found what you are saying to be exactly the case! I had a few things to say about HF lathes (the 14x40" in particular) and basically that several of these brands are the same machine except for color and price. First I owned a POS Jet 9x20 which was EXACTLY the same machine as the Grizzly, Enco, HF and a number of other brands, I know from "hands-on" experience with both the Jet and HF that they are indeed the very same. I paid nearly twice as much for the Jet as the HF machine cost because everybody said HF machines were just rejects and complete junk, that may be so but the Jet was junk also! There was not any difference between the two in quality or anything else except color and price and I am finding that the same is apparently true for the larger 14x40 machines. I have the HF 14x40 and have access to an Enco 14x40, they are the same stinkin thing!! The Enco cost a heck of a lot more than the HF but after a year around both machines I KNOW that one is no better than the other which was exactly the same experience I had with the little 9x20, this time however I didn't fall for the "name" and saved a bunch of money. I posted links to pics of the HF 14x40, the Enco 14x40 and the Birmingham YCL14x40 and outwardly they all appear to be exactly the same, I have only gotten to look at the Birmingham without running it but I am sure the parts are interchangeable with my HF and maybe I am wrong but they damn sure don't look to be any better quality. Some may argue that Grizzly or Enco has a lot better service than HF and that may be true but HF does offer parts replacement and the thousands a person will save by buying form them will sure ease the frustration of lesser service if it is required. Others have told me that HF machines are just rejects that other companies turn away but I have seen no evidence of that and the people who told me were talking only from hear-say or opinion and had no proof of any kind. I joined a Yahoo group of HF lathe owners and those guys convinced me to buy from HF, it did not take much convincing after the Jet 9x20 fiasco! These guys are owners of these machines and they too are convinced that the HF lathes are the same as some other more expensive brands, are we wrong about that? Maybe but then maybe not and after over a year of searching for a good used "name brand" lathe and researching the ChiCom selections I honestly see no reason to spend the extra money for a supposedly better name if a person is going to buy Chinese. Certainly a good used American or European machine is going to be a lot better but if buying Chinese don't expect a brand name to be synonymous with quality, you could very well be paying a lot more money for a catchy paint job. I have been running my HF 14x40 for over a year now and I couldn't be happier with it.
If your gonna go Chinese, why pay more than you have too?
Now I have a question and let me throw more wood into the fire....
Are there any metal lathes with adjustable taper bars?
Are there any metal lathes with adjustable taper bars?
http://www.harborfreight.com/12-inc...ecision-gap-bed-metalworking-lathe-65044.html
I guess that would be the HB's version of Grizzly's.
I guess that would be the HB's version of Grizzly's.
i'm kinda partial to this one myself.....
http://www.grizzly.com/products/12-x-36-Metal-Lathe-w-Milling-Head/G0492
http://www.grizzly.com/products/12-x-36-Metal-Lathe-w-Milling-Head/G0492
Wow! What's amazing is you probably honestly believe what you're saying. LOL
lmao, you must be dissappointed atleast every five minutes or so that you check the thread to see if your fire is still going. Anyway, i have a HF 1440, its a terd...does the job but its a terd. Maybe your right and there all the same...in that case you will not convince me that there not all pcs of s..t.....
The Taiwanese lathes are alot better made than Chinese.
But when you are buying cheap,it is cheap as they put the minimum effort to produce what looks to be an OK product.
I saw some chinese made ball bearings made to order and to a specification.
About 2 out of 3 are in the that will work and useable, and about 1 in 10 meets the intened specification.
Wib from swizterland are maybe 1 in 100 that is out of spec, but is still usable.
But when you are buying cheap,it is cheap as they put the minimum effort to produce what looks to be an OK product.
I saw some chinese made ball bearings made to order and to a specification.
About 2 out of 3 are in the that will work and useable, and about 1 in 10 meets the intened specification.
Wib from swizterland are maybe 1 in 100 that is out of spec, but is still usable.
be careful! Mr. Cashy-poo will be all over you for not being on the chinese bandwagon
Dude, the thread was about Chinese lathes, specifically a Grizzly gunsmith lathe. Our shop has 12 lathes, none of them Chinese. We have Hardinge, Clausing, Logan, Atlas/Rockwell and even a Japanese lathe. I admit to not having first hand experience like you with a Chinese lathe. The point I made was that they are basically the same, so why pay more for a name, that's all.
your right, thats why i originally posted my opinion...thats all it was. Hopefully the op learned something from our debate
I am sure he learned when one can't debate the facts they often resort to gratuitous verbal abuse and argumentum ad hominem.
I couldn't resist
I found this in the Main Forum and I finally decided that it applied to this thread:grin:
I found this in the Main Forum and I finally decided that it applied to this thread:grin:
mrknowitall
mrknowitall
China made machinery
Listen fellows anyone that buys a china made machine doesnt know much about machinery 2 or just cant afford a real machine
and has to settle for second best, i say that but the truth of the matter most of the time its the operator, i haveseen magic done on a jet lathe and enco lathe from a 80 year old friend, i think part is they just are no good in my book but a good toolmaker can make some good stuff on any machine it might take alittle long thats my 2cents worth
Listen fellows anyone that buys a china made machine doesnt know much about machinery 2 or just cant afford a real machine
and has to settle for second best, i say that but the truth of the matter most of the time its the operator, i haveseen magic done on a jet lathe and enco lathe from a 80 year old friend, i think part is they just are no good in my book but a good toolmaker can make some good stuff on any machine it might take alittle long thats my 2cents worth
Cue makers don't need tool room accuracy.
If you dial in a buck chuck on a Grizzly you can build cues to a high tolerance for cue making.
JMO
Rick
If you dial in a buck chuck on a Grizzly you can build cues to a high tolerance for cue making.
JMO
Rick
mrknowitall
mrknowitall
buck chuck
on the same token then a china made buck chuck knock off would be good enough for accuracy ?
on the same token then a china made buck chuck knock off would be good enough for accuracy ?
Cue makers don't need tool room accuracy. If you dial in a buck chuck on a Grizzly y
QUOTE "Cue makers don't need tool room accuracy.
If you dial in a buck chuck on a Grizzly you can build cues to a high tolerance for cue making."
I really don't believe I just read this.
Maybe we should all buy Asian machinery, and then we might as well buy Asian cues, cars, clothes, eat sushi, and move there also. Hey, we should mail order a woman from there too.
With all the small American companies going under from just this very train of thought, there are a glut of quality machines available at near give away prices.
Usually these can be had nicely tooled up, for a song. After you purchase all the goodies for your twinkle de dum lathe, it won't be so cheap.
I myself, would rather have the option of turning some quality parts on my own machinery, if given a choice.
I know two people that purchased this junk in the last couple years, and they both told me after 6 months of fiddling, and adjusting their new lathes, they almost hold tolerance now.
In the last 3 years I bought a Hardinge with all the goodies, and a South bend with the same, each costing me less than an ASIAN Predator Sneaky Pete.
If your not sure of the condition, or value., ask around. Someone can steer you to a machinist, or retired machinist that could look them over, even if you need to put an ad on Craigslist, and offer them a few bucks for their time.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Rudie
QUOTE "Cue makers don't need tool room accuracy.
If you dial in a buck chuck on a Grizzly you can build cues to a high tolerance for cue making."
I really don't believe I just read this.
Maybe we should all buy Asian machinery, and then we might as well buy Asian cues, cars, clothes, eat sushi, and move there also. Hey, we should mail order a woman from there too.
With all the small American companies going under from just this very train of thought, there are a glut of quality machines available at near give away prices.
Usually these can be had nicely tooled up, for a song. After you purchase all the goodies for your twinkle de dum lathe, it won't be so cheap.
I myself, would rather have the option of turning some quality parts on my own machinery, if given a choice.
I know two people that purchased this junk in the last couple years, and they both told me after 6 months of fiddling, and adjusting their new lathes, they almost hold tolerance now.
In the last 3 years I bought a Hardinge with all the goodies, and a South bend with the same, each costing me less than an ASIAN Predator Sneaky Pete.
If your not sure of the condition, or value., ask around. Someone can steer you to a machinist, or retired machinist that could look them over, even if you need to put an ad on Craigslist, and offer them a few bucks for their time.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Rudie
Hi,
Very nice equipment you have there. What is the spindle bore on that Hardinge and what cue machining operations do you do with it?
Rick
Very nice equipment you have there. What is the spindle bore on that Hardinge and what cue machining operations do you do with it?
Rick
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