Here is what will happen....

corvette1340

www.EpawnMarket.com
Silver Member
Are all of you people reading the same letters that I am? KT has said exactly NOTHING in any of these letters. The sole purpose for these is to stall for more time. The fact is that there is going to be a letter in the next few weeks that says the "Ho" deal is dead for some reason that he will make up. I doubt that there ever was a deal to begin with. He believes that all of this stalling while he says the deal is being negotiated buys him some credibility and will defer the blame to Ho when he says that the tour is dead. He came to the realization months ago that his qualifier structure wasnt going to fund the tour and that a pool tour on this scale will not make him any money. This little 2 month scenario of unpaid checks and negotiation talks is another little scam that he likes to use to defer blame from himself. The only thing that he has been finalizing in the last month are the bankruptcy papers for the tour and the avenues that he needs to take to be protected personally. The bottom line is that KT is a cold hearted, calculated, con man. He tried to start a tour with the hopes that it would become mainstream and make millions. He doesn't give a sh*t about the players, backers, employees, or anyone else. As soon as he found out this wasn't going to happen , he made up some brilliant lie that he could shape and spin as time goes on and make the final outcome as easy as possible for the players to accept. If you will follow the letters closely, he puts a positive spin on everything without saying anything, but subtly introduces a new negative part of the negotiations in each letter. The fact that nobody sees this is testament to how gullible people are that are owed money and how good KT is at manipulating people. I hope I'm wrong about all this, but I will get a big " I told you so " when it comes to fruition.
 
This is 100% CORECTO-MUNDO!!!! If you look at his past business adventures, they follow the same steps as he is taking with the IPT. I hope the players get every dime they are owed for the Reno tourney....and then do not take a chance with the IPT IF there is a Chicago tourney.

Southpaw
 
Just curious, if a player pays to enter a tourney...is accepted into and wins...is it a contract?

What can a player do within the law to claim his prize?
 
I don't believe the business model was ever to have the whole enchilada funded via qualifiers and players payments. The context was larger, but deeply, deeply flawed. I believe KT had much more in mind with respect to sponsorships, and intended to pull off a quick hype-n-flip from the very beginning. There was no long term plan -- EVER.

If you look at Professional Bullriding (now, there's a mainstream "sport"), they land sponsors like FORD MOTOR COMPANY. Who did the IPT land? Naturalcures.com? Hmmmm. What other company was willing to say "The International Pool Tour --- brought to by XXXXXX, Inc" (we know it would never be "American Express"...tee hee hee).

The fatal flaw in all of it was KT himself. He mistakenly thinks he is a mainstream legitimate "marketing genius", but outside the little circle inscribed around his deluded customers, the rest of the world thinks he's a scam artist. Sorry, but mainstream corporations won't tie their names to his -- no way, no how.

KT's name wouldn't improve the image of a Port-o-let, much less a respectable business advertiser. Game over, right there.
 
Mr. Wilson said:
Just curious, if a player pays to enter a tourney...is accepted into and wins...is it a contract?

What can a player do within the law to claim his prize?

I believe it depends on the state that the tourney was held in. Although pool tournies are considered "skilled" events (unlike a poker tournies....which law considers this to be "luck"), and are legal to have, I think the issue of taxing the payouts and all that come into effect. Now with a sanctioned pro event like the IPT, did the players have to sign any kind of contract or anything when they entered? If so, there should be some legal steps that they can take to get their money.

Southpaw
 
the new letter made my brain hurt. i clearly think it's fuzzy! on one hand, we are getting paid, on the other, we will be paid in 2013,on the other ho and kevin made the deal, on the other the funds are lower than expected,on the other hand, chicago is on, on the other hand bush dissaproves of it. i really can't make heads or tails out of this mess,maybe that was his plan? confuse us until we all walk away shakin?
 
8-ball bernie said:
the new letter made my brain hurt. i clearly think it's fuzzy! on one hand, we are getting paid, on the other, we will be paid in 2013,on the other ho and kevin made the deal, on the other the funds are lower than expected,on the other hand, chicago is on, on the other hand bush dissaproves of it. i really can't make heads or tails out of this mess,maybe that was his plan? confuse us until we all walk away shakin?


lol, if its one thing he HAS done its confuse people and made them shaky!
 
I think that this will happen:

The players will get paid from Reno, but not all in once. Maybe over the next months/year.

The Chicago-tournament and KOTH and TC Qualifier will be played, but with less pricemoney.

The 100 000 $ guarantee will be much lower.

Guess that they on the players meeting in Chicago will talk about the 2007 schedule, and the future, and tell them that this is the deal or else there is no deal at all.

The players, and fans like me, will buy it and actually be happy about it. After all, it's better with a tour with for example guaranteed 30 000 $ income for all tour members than no tour at all...

But hopefully, the show will go on with 100 K, full payout during the next month, no cut in pricemoney and lots of major sponsors and tv-broadcasting.

Hope for that but wouldn't be surprised if it will be as I mention first. None of those options are that bad, are they?
 
Mr. Wilson said:
Just curious, if a player pays to enter a tourney...is accepted into and wins...is it a contract?

What can a player do within the law to claim his prize?

If it is written, it is a written contract: If spoken, an oral contract; and if created by the actions of the parties, then it is an implied contract.

Jimmy
 
Just Curious

jimmyg said:
If it is written, it is a written contract: If spoken, an oral contract; and if created by the actions of the parties, then it is an implied contract.
Jimmy



What about if it was EATEN ?
Doug
 
No "major sponsor" will touch a KT-tainted IPT with a 10-foot pole. Ain't gonna happen. No way. No how.....
 
Mr. Wilson said:
Just curious, if a player pays to enter a tourney...is accepted into and wins...is it a contract?

What can a player do within the law to claim his prize?

Seems to me that it would have to be or at least the government would want it to be. If not, how would the government get it's money. Kind of hard to tax someone on something they were promised, but never recieved. The government would care less about the individual owed, but, they surely want their cut.
 
cuetique said:
I don't believe the business model was ever to have the whole enchilada funded via qualifiers and players payments. The context was larger, but deeply, deeply flawed. I believe KT had much more in mind with respect to sponsorships, and intended to pull off a quick hype-n-flip from the very beginning. There was no long term plan -- EVER.

If you look at Professional Bullriding (now, there's a mainstream "sport"), they land sponsors like FORD MOTOR COMPANY. Who did the IPT land? Naturalcures.com? Hmmmm. What other company was willing to say "The International Pool Tour --- brought to by XXXXXX, Inc" (we know it would never be "American Express"...tee hee hee).


.


With Natural Cures being the whole sponsor that could explain where the original money came from.

KT takes money from his Natural Cures company and starts the IPT with it. That money is advertising for Natural Cures and as such is a write off for taxes that would have gone to the Government.

So KT takes that money and has a ball playing Founder of the IPT. When the money runs out he just closes shop. KT really is not out any money because if he did not spend it on the IPT he would have had to give it to the Government in the form of taxes from Natural Cures.

Of course that is just conjecture and KT would never plan anything so diabolical.

Maybe other millionaires can start investing in pool as a tax shelter. I seem to remember a lot of them buying into the windmill schemes a while back.

Jake
 
Smorgass Bored said:
What about if it was EATEN ?
Doug

Not sure Smorg, but if executed late in the evening, in a dark alley and money exchanges hands --- I wouldn't worry, it's probably illegal anyway.
 
Mr. Wilson said:
Just curious, if a player pays to enter a tourney...is accepted into and wins...is it a contract?

What can a player do within the law to claim his prize?

You know, if this thing was put before a judge, it would be hard for them to say there was some kind of fraud or scam. No more then if someone pulls up stakes moves across the country and takes a job, then the company goes under. The best people like that have is getting in line to take a shot at what ever assets are left over and divided up to the creditors. I think the players may become little more then creditors to a company with no assets.

In fact, KT can make a pretty good case since he is the biggest loser, in the millions possibly, he would probably get some sympathy especially since he did pay in good faith in the past. I believe in the beginning he did it because he thought there was a possibility to do something like poker with pool. I also don't think he loves money as much as people think, he piss's it away like it's nothing. He is now having to go into a survival mode, but I really believe if he had the money he would pay the players and may in the future if he gets back on his feet.

The failing of his book business is what triggered all this since that was what was really funding it. I know he didn't think the cure book would go on forever, but I don't think he anticipated it going bad so fast and to the extent it did. Sales now appear to be little or nothing. No body could dislike KT more then I do and the idea of a tour that based solely on someone's personal funding would have to be short lived but I do not believe that at any time was it ever meant to be a scam, just a REAL bad business idea. After all some high paid genius hired Katie Couric to anchor the CBS news.
It can be amazing how bad an idea you thought would work can turn out to be once put into practice. There is not an executive on the planet who hasn't said, "WTF was I thinking"

That has always been my main problem with the IPT. Instead of copying proven formulas that work, they chose to do virtually everything in an experimental way from the game they played to the format, player stable system, equipment and so on. In what was at best a high risk venture, they didn't even give themselves a fighting chance with their decisions. At this point only one of two things can be done.

One, shut it down for good, or two, shut it down and fix everything that is wrong from top to bottom and there is plenty. Unless someone else want's to do it, I think KT is out of here. He can't possibly have any future interest in this fiasco.
 
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Im going to keep bumping this up until the players are paid and the IPT does indeed go on. That way, when all of what I said comes true, then all of you peeps can give me my props! :D
 
corvette1340 said:
Im going to keep bumping this up until the players are paid and the IPT does indeed go on. That way, when all of what I said comes true, then all of you peeps can give me my props! :D


I suggest that you wait for the players to get paid in full and the IPT goes on & on & on and then bump it up ONE TIME. Consistantly bumping this up will just piss everyone off...... imo
Doug
 
Mr. Wilson...<<Just curious, if a player pays to enter a tourney...is accepted into and wins...is it a contract?>>

Yes, there would be an oral contract...and there would be no requirement that that player paid any money to get in...although, if he/she did, then the damages would be that much greater.

For there to be a contract...oral or otherwise...there has to be "consideration" which is a legal term generally meaning that something of value must be "posted" be the parties. But PROMISES are widely accepted as a form of "consideration"...especially when the promise involves the payment of money.

In the IPT matter, the IPT promised to hold a tournament and to pay ALL the players their specified sums. The players promised to play (and the Qualifiers paid to get in). Those are the essential elements of the oral contract...i.e. the promise to pay on the one hand (IPT) and the promise to play (on the part of the players).

Oral contracts are JUST as enforceable as written ones with the only issue being that it can be more difficult to prove the existence of an oral contract vs. a written one. There are two major exceptions. A) No oral contracts are recognized with respect to the transfer of real estate and B) in most states, the performance of oral contracts cannot be enforced beyond a 1 year period under what is generally known as the Statute of Frauds.

IMHO, there is ZERO doubt that a contract exists between the IPT and the players and there is ZERO doubt that the essential elements of the contract can be PROVEN based on the "preponderance of evidence"...which means that the judge/jury only has to believe that there is a 51% chance of "X" being true...whereas in criminal cases, the standard is "beyond a realsonable doubt."

My GUESS is that due to the efforts of NYC Dude...who I believe is deadly serious in his comments on this forum...that suit will be filed within the next 60 days and more likely within the next 30 days.

Further, it is more than a 50/50 bet that either the IPT files for bankruptcy fairly soon or two or more creditors will file a petition for involuntary bankruptcy.

All just IMHO.

Jim
 
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