How to Force follow like Strickland

MacManLtd

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I have no problem drawing the ball, but for some reason I cannot get much top spin.

The shot I'm trying to work on, is one I see Strickland do quite a bit. He is shooting the object ball in the corner, and he puts a lot of top spin on the cue ball and has it hit both rails in the corner after making the object ball. The shot is almost dead straight.

What are some common mistakes causin the cue ball not to follow much.
 
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I have no problem drawing the ball, but for some reason I cannot get much top spin.

The shot I'm trying to work on, is one I see Strickland do quite a bit. He is shooting the object ball in the corner, and he puts a lot of top spin on the cue ball and has it hit both rails in the corner after making the object ball. The shot is almost dead straight.

What are some common mistakes causin the cue ball not to follow much.

If i may.......

Are you sure you are hitting the CB high? through my lesson with Mark Wilson i was surprised at where i was hitting the CB. I was close, but not exact. Are you hitting it with, say, two tips above center or are you just thinking that is where you are hitting it?

And Earl is ever so slightly cheating the pocket (putting the OB into one side of the pocket or the other), that is how he can get the CB to go off the rails on a straight in shot.

Also, if you punch at the ball, or have an elevated cue, you might actually be imparting stun rather than follow. a nice smooth stroke with high english, good follow through, and you should be there.

Just my $.02.

Mike
 
Mike...When did you become an instructor? This is the "Ask The Instructor" forum. The main forum is where you can put in your $.02. The OP (as well as you) doesn't realize that Earl's super power stroke shot is hit on the horizontal axis. It is way more sidespin than topspin. We call it gyroscopic precession, and we teach it in pool school.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

If i may.......

Are you sure you are hitting the CB high? through my lesson with Mark Wilson i was surprised at where i was hitting the CB. I was close, but not exact. Are you hitting it with, say, two tips above center or are you just thinking that is where you are hitting it?

And Earl is ever so slightly cheating the pocket (putting the OB into one side of the pocket or the other), that is how he can get the CB to go off the rails on a straight in shot.

Also, if you punch at the ball, or have an elevated cue, you might actually be imparting stun rather than follow. a nice smooth stroke with high english, good follow through, and you should be there.

Just my $.02.

Mike
 
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I have no problem drawing the ball, but for some reason I cannot get much top spin.

The shot I'm trying to work on, is one I see Strickland do quite a bit. He is shooting the object ball in the corner, and he puts a lot of top spin on the cue ball and has it hit both rails in the corner after making the object ball. The shot is almost dead straight.

What are some common mistakes causin the cue ball not to follow much.



First thing you have to do is change your tip to an Elkmaster or another similar Soft Tip, and while I know that some will laugh at this statement, you can't get that kind of action with a hard tip.

Both Earl and Efren have used Pressed Elkmaster tips for many years, and any player that effective spins their ball knows that most of that action is not possible without a Soft tip.

JIMO
 
Mike...When did you become an instructor? This is the "Ask The Instructor" forum. The main forum is where you can put in your $.02. The OP (as well as you) doesn't realize that Earl's super power stroke shot is hit on the horizontal axis. It is way more sidespin than topspin. We call it gyroscopic procession, and we teach it in pool school.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

LOL Scott, I stayed at a Holiday in once, does that count? It bears repeating -- It is way more side spin than top spin!!! Trying to use a lot of top spin on Earls shot is a futile effort! Side English carries the c/b around the table. I like that that gyroscopic part.

Rod
 
combination of two things.....

smooth delivery of your stroke and WHERE to hit on the cue ball. Try of course practicing the shot at short distances and with a slower stroke...then progress your speed as well as how high on the cb you hit. Experimentation.....just test it out and you will eventually figure it out.
 
Mike...When did you become an instructor? This is the "Ask The Instructor" forum. The main forum is where you can put in your $.02. The OP (as well as you) doesn't realize that Earl's super power stroke shot is hit on the horizontal axis. It is way more sidespin than topspin. We call it gyroscopic procession, and we teach it in pool school.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Woah, remind me to only read and never actually post a response in this section again ...since I'm not a certified teacher there is no way I could ever add anything of any value to this forum! I'm only hoping that your response was just as much of a jest as mine was, Scott. :)
 
I have a very hard LePro tip (can't dent it with a fingernail), and I have no problem getting a lot of spin. It's all in the stroke, buddy!

Very hard LePro? That wouldn't happen to be one of the black ones would it? I have 1 lying around here somewhere.....super super hard tip, havent seen another in years.

Are you guys talking about a straight in shot into the corner and making the CB hit long rail, short rail (or vice versa depending on angle) and travel back down table?

Or are you all trying to describe something similar to a follow kill shot? Where the CB's overspin takes it back to the rail after rebound? Leaving it on the same end as you made the OB?

diagrams are always cool by the way lol....

-Grey Ghost-
 
Mike...When did you become an instructor? This is the "Ask The Instructor" forum. The main forum is where you can put in your $.02. The OP (as well as you) doesn't realize that Earl's super power stroke shot is hit on the horizontal axis. It is way more sidespin than topspin. We call it gyroscopic procession, and we teach it in pool school.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

1) Yep, you are right, this is the instructors forum. what was i thinking? heck, i should be given some waterboarding for doing this.
2) Just wondering.....all the other people that post their thoughts on here, are you going to jump down their throats too? i doubt it.
3) The OP last question was NOT "How do i do what Earl does?" but rather to ask about common mistakes that cause the CB not to follow much. i thought i would try and offer some help.

So, MacManLtd, forgive me for trying to help. I apologize to you if i have misled you in any way. Just remember that my thoughts are what i have been told by instructors on this forum.

Mike
 
Woah, remind me to only read and never actually post a response in this section again ...since I'm not a certified teacher there is no way I could ever add anything of any value to this forum! I'm only hoping that your response was just as much of a jest as mine was, Scott. :)

No, for some reason i dont think it was done in jest. for some reason, since i dont 100% agree with all the instructors on here they (one in particular) have decided to bash me.

Mike
 
Level cue two tips above center cue ball an stroke and don't poke. That's what I've been told. An keep your head down. I pray alot. :wink:
 
PaulieB...Yeah it was mostly in jest. There are many knowledgable posters who contribute plenty of good info. It's more about posting accurate information, imo...and that's supposedly why people come on this part of the forum.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Woah, remind me to only read and never actually post a response in this section again ...since I'm not a certified teacher there is no way I could ever add anything of any value to this forum! I'm only hoping that your response was just as much of a jest as mine was, Scott. :)
 
I have no problem drawing the ball, but for some reason I cannot get much top spin.

The shot I'm trying to work on, is one I see Strickland do quite a bit. He is shooting the object ball in the corner, and he puts a lot of top spin on the cue ball and has it hit both rails in the corner after making the object ball. The shot is almost dead straight.

What are some common mistakes causin the cue ball not to follow much.

Watch some of the shots I do in this video -

Stroke Shots

Its all off the center axis of the ball, the core... I spin-stroke from the center outward... combine that with proper stroke mechanics, different and creative shot angles, and A LOT of practice, you get what you see.

Watch the action of my cue on all of the shots - pay extra special attention to three things -

how and where the tip contacts the cue ball -
how far the shaft goes forward on the follow through
how I stay down on the shot

It all has to be one fluid movement, and takes pin point accuracy on the cue ball, object ball and the back of the pocket. If you have any other questions, get with me and I'll get you some better video and walk you through the shots.
 
I have no problem drawing the ball, but for some reason I cannot get much top spin.

The shot I'm trying to work on, is one I see Strickland do quite a bit. He is shooting the object ball in the corner, and he puts a lot of top spin on the cue ball and has it hit both rails in the corner after making the object ball. The shot is almost dead straight.

What are some common mistakes causing the cue ball not to follow much.
You need a lot of side spin and enough follow to take the cue ball forward to the first cushion. The nearly-straight-in power shot must be shot with a mix of maybe 1/3 follow and 2/3 side spin.

The shot will not work well on nearly new cloth or cloth that's slippery for some other reason. That's because the side spin will not grab well on the cushions and the cue ball will not "snap" out of the corner.

Most players don't hit the ball far enough from center. How long can you make the cue ball spin in place by shooting a stun shot with maximum side straight into an object ball? 30 seconds shows you have an adequate amount of spin for most power spin shots.

Most players have a very hard time dealing with squirt on shots like this. You just have to get used to aiming way off-angle when you use a lot of side spin and power. The stun-to-spin-in-place shot above will help you with your aiming compensation.
 
You need a lot of side spin and enough follow to take the cue ball forward to the first cushion. The nearly-straight-in power shot must be shot with a mix of maybe 1/3 follow and 2/3 side spin.

The shot will not work well on nearly new cloth or cloth that's slippery for some other reason. That's because the side spin will not grab well on the cushions and the cue ball will not "snap" out of the corner.

Most players don't hit the ball far enough from center. How long can you make the cue ball spin in place by shooting a stun shot with maximum side straight into an object ball? 30 seconds shows you have an adequate amount of spin for most power spin shots.

Most players have a very hard time dealing with squirt on shots like this. You just have to get used to aiming way off-angle when you use a lot of side spin and power. The stun-to-spin-in-place shot above will help you with your aiming compensation.

Brian Jones showed me a drill to work on that I guess about 5/6 years ago.

You use just the striped balls, place two inline about 3-5 foot apart depending on how hard the drill is for you. Hit the horizontal plane on the "CB" and use at least a good couple tips of side left or side right.

If you do it right the "CB" will hit the OB and pocket it, and the "CB" will stay in place (horizontal plane w/speed is just a stop shot) and SPIN its butt off either left or right depending on the side you put on it.

Now quickly b/f the spin fades put another stripe in place for your "CB" and stroke the shot with the OPPOSITE Side english you just shot the first shot with.

Perfect would be 7/7 with the 9-15 balls. If the "CB" that became the OB stops spinning b/f you shoot at it then you have to start over. If you miss thats ok too, just as long as the "CB" kills and stays in its place for the next shot and maintains its spin.

VERY TOUGH & DEMANDING DRILL.....

its not for beginners, and intermediate level players will def have a super tough time with it......advanced level players only basically.

If your a beginner or intermediate player and you don't feel like torturing yourself then just shoot the shot 1 at a time. Just set it up, and try and pocket the ball and see how well you can keep the "CB" spinning in place after contact.

Like Bob said 30sec would be basically a maximum to retain spin......If you can do this and keep it spinning for more than 12-15 sec your doing well with it. But to do the actual drill your going to need to consistently maintain a 20 sec or more average spin time as it takes you about 10sec to get the ball in place for the next shot and then another 10sec to shoot.

Like I said this is a VERY TOUGH DRILL, don't let it get the best of you....b/c it will if you let it aggravate you.

Stay focused and take it one step at a time, and no matter how bad you do find at least one good thing that you did well/correctly. Don't ever finish a practice session all beat up, even if you are look on the bright side and find at least one positive note in regards to the session. Its practice, you will make mistakes, but better to make them there than in a live match or tournament.

best wishes,
-Grey Ghost-
 
Mike...When did you become an instructor? This is the "Ask The Instructor" forum. The main forum is where you can put in your $.02. The OP (as well as you) doesn't realize that Earl's super power stroke shot is hit on the horizontal axis. It is way more sidespin than topspin. We call it gyroscopic procession, and we teach it in pool school.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com


GEE WHIZ Scott, DrCue'sProtege was trying to help, and I do not think you need a BCA's Instructor Certificate to help people.

As I understand all you need anyway to be a BCA Instructors anyway is the COURSE FEE, and the TIME TO TAKE THE CLASS. Then you get your SHEEP SKIN and the real work begins.

Learning to communicate with people so they can practice what you preach is a skill that take years to develop.

I know one GENTLEMAN here in Arizona who took said BCA CLASS, and still can't teach because he don't understand the principle of FLEXIBILITY, or COMMUNICATION. There is only one way in his mind be you 5”0”, or 6’ 4” Tall, he don’t have the flex ability to understand when you hit mid life your body don’t flex like a 18 y/o’s.

Heck John Barton did a couple of U-Tube on C.T.E Basic, and the material was so good. I was able to pick up his concepts, and work with the ideas until C.T.E. was as easy as 1, 2, 3.

BTW I do not believe John is or holds any Teaching Certifications from an Billiards Group, or Organization.

He is like Little Joe V. a guy who just got his information right on his (2) Instructional DVD's. I can not wait for Joe's next D.V.D. it should be a winner like the last two. IMHO.

Want to learn to Kick, or Control the Cue Balls Joe V’s DVD's are top of the pile.

I just finished reading Willie Mosconi's Autobiography, Willie never took a Pool Lesson, but sure played well.:eek: Wonder how that happened?



BTW Scott is you and DrCue'sProtege have a little feud going maybe a Pm's back and forth would work thing out! JMHO
 
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Sorry Manwon, but you are wrong. I have a very hard LePro tip (can't dent it with a fingernail), and I have no problem getting a lot of spin. It's all in the stroke, buddy!


I agree that with a good stroke you can accomplish this type of shot using any hardness of tip. But for a player who is not able to stroke the ball as well as you can a softer tip will give them better result's when applying any form of spin to the cue ball.

Neal, I have seen this work on a number of occasions for players that are learning the game, in most cases as their stroke improves through practice they go to a harder tip. But not all players do, why do you think that Earl and Efren use soft tips, both are very accomplished players in any ranking throughout the world so why have they continued to use soft tip's?

Have a great night
 
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