How to improve when you're already a great player

[Flip_dat_Quarta]

How do you improve once you become a great pool player?

I think this is a problem that every pool player faces and the main reason that most players reach their final plateau.

In the beginning years of playing pool the information highway seems endless and you are constantly learning new things, whether it's fundamentals, strategy, physics, consistency, shot pictures, etc. you are always improving.

Then you reach the intermediate stage where you first hit a major plateau. You understand most aspects of the game but you just don't have the consistency or experience to take you to the next level. Eventually, with enough practice you'll naturally move up.

So now you're a pretty solid player. You're a favorite to pocket most shots and you usually get out when you should. Running a rack here and there is expected. But you're stuck and don't seem to be improving anymore.

So now what? How do you keep pushing forward? You can gamble and play tournaments but is that really improving your game very fast? You can try practicing alone but playing without any pressure makes you lazy and develop bad habits. You don't like trying drills either. So what do you do?

Ever wonder what top players have done to stay on the fast track? It can't just be natural ability can it? So what did they do? Why are they different than you? Did they just want it more? Are they better at evaluating their game and improving on weaknesses? Do they practice more or better than you? Do they have the focus that you couldn't devote to the game? What is it? What are you missing?

 

[philly]

They never vary their PSR. They usually go through it without even thinking. If they are off it is because of their PSR not being automatic. My opinion only.

 

[Flip_dat_Quarta]

They never vary their PSR. They usually go through it without even thinking. If they are off it is because of their PSR not being automatic. My opinion only.

Who are "they"? The questions in my post are directed toward you!

O wait, I think I understand. You are saying that top players are great because they have a consistent pre-shot routine? Hahahaha, come on now...you think someone is a master at pool because of how they setup their shot? Not the actual execution of the shot? lol

That's like saying a baseball player is great because of how he lines up in the batter's box...

 

[Flip_dat_Quarta]

I dunno, man. Efren says he just plays 15 ball rotation. Try that, I guess.

Well, Efren stopped improving a long time ago so maybe that's not the best solution...

 

[dardusm]

I think that you have to play as much competition as possible. One of the reasons that I feel that the Americans lag behind the Europeans in the Mosconi Cup is the lack of pressure competition on the 9 foot tables. You can practice all you want but getting in the tournament grease gains the needed experience. And gambling doesn't help enough because it's a different type of pressure.

The difference in the pro's games is small. They all pocket balls well, move the cue ball well, etc or they wouldn't be pro's. It's the small things that can determine different fates such as a better break, learning to kick better, etc. In other words, keep learning and evolving to improve.

 

[michael4]

1) play (try to master) other games, 14.1 etc, which will force you to improve in other areas....

2) compete more, at a higher level.....

 

[GideonF]

Who are "they"? The questions in my post are directed toward you!

O wait, I think I understand. You are saying that top players are great because they have a consistent pre-shot routine? Hahahaha, come on now...you think someone is a master at pool because of how they setup their shot? Not the actual execution of the shot? lol

That's like saying a baseball player is great because of how he lines up in the batter's box...

There are many jumps along the way, and many different reasons people jump a skill level, like improving fundamentals and pocketing skills to learning advanced shots and strategy.

However, to the extent that I am able to tell (as a hack watching good players), the difference between the great players and the almost great players (say pro vs A players) is mainly consistency, especially under pressure. The A players can make every shot the pros can make and make great outs. But they miss shots, or shape, when they shouldn't. One possible reason for the difference might be pre-shot routine, or perhaps it is the ability to stay focused, or better fundamentals that don't falter under pressure.

And regarding the baseball player analogy, all great hitters seem to have consistent pre-hit routines, and they have hitting coaches that spend a lot of time watching their mechanics.

 

[Flip_dat_Quarta]

I think that you have to play as much competition as possible. One of the reasons that I feel that the Americans lag behind the Europeans in the Mosconi Cup is the lack of pressure competition on the 9 foot tables. You can practice all you want but getting in the tournament grease gains the needed experience. And gambling doesn't help enough because it's a different type of pressure.

The difference in the pro's games is small. They all pocket balls well, move the cue ball well, etc or they wouldn't be pro's. It's the small things that can determine different fates such as a better break, learning to kick better, etc. In other words, keep learning and evolving to improve.

Interesting answer but I think you missed the question. I didn't ask you to evaluate the differences between top pros. I wanted you to evaluate your own game and tell me why you haven't broken through to the next level.

For example, let's take your level of play. We'll call it B+. At some point or another, a top player such as SVB played at the B+ level. So what did he do to break through to the next level? And why haven't you done it yet?

 

[measureman]

I think once a player has reached the limits of physical ability the only way to play better is to play smarter.
I don't play as good as I once did due to age and not playing as much so I try to make up for it by playing smarter.

 

[ps611846]

Interesting answer but I think you missed the question. I didn't ask you to evaluate the differences between top pros. I wanted you to evaluate your own game and tell me why you haven't broken through to the next level.

For example, let's take your level of play. We'll call it B+. At some point or another, a top player such as SVB played at the B+ level. So what did he do to break through to the next level? And why haven't you done it yet?

May I ask what have you done to break through to the next level...... of trolling ????? :grin-square:

 

[Tramp Steamer]

Well, Efren stopped improving a long time ago so maybe that's not the best solution...

One way to look at it is that Efren, for instance, got to as high a level as he could. From that point on all he had to do was to maintain that level.
Maintenance became his goal. :smile:

 

[lee brett]

They never vary their PSR. They usually go through it without even thinking. If they are off it is because of their PSR not being automatic. My opinion only.

Who are "they"? The questions in my post are directed toward you!

O wait, I think I understand. You are saying that top players are great because they have a consistent pre-shot routine? Hahahaha, come on now...you think someone is a master at pool because of how they setup their shot? Not the actual execution of the shot? lol

That's like saying a baseball player is great because of how he lines up in the batter's box...

Flip a pre shot routine from what Philly is referring to is the whole shot, not just 1 & 2 of the PRS.

Here is the Pre Shot Routine i teach players. 1,2,3,4,5.

1- Sighting/Aiming
2- Stance/Alignment
3- Bridge Hand/Arm
4- Backstroke/Pause
5- Follow-Through/Finish


Hope this clarifies things.

Lee

 

[alphadog]

OP the way your post reads,it would be imposible to improve. That being said if one wants to get better thay need to be honest with themselves and identify their weaknesses. Practice their weakness until it is better.
Play other players,play other games,keep a open mind. Efren says he learns watching lesser players(of course most players are lesser then Efren). Players have differant ways of doing things. Watch and you may see a better way.

 

[bdorman]

Who are "they"? The questions in my post are directed toward you!

O wait, I think I understand. You are saying that top players are great because they have a consistent pre-shot routine? Hahahaha, come on now...you think someone is a master at pool because of how they setup their shot? Not the actual execution of the shot? lol

That's like saying a baseball player is great because of how he lines up in the batter's box...

Well, Efren stopped improving a long time ago so maybe that's not the best solution...

Interesting answer but I think you missed the question. I didn't ask you to evaluate the differences between top pros. I wanted you to evaluate your own game and tell me why you haven't broken through to the next level.

For example, let's take your level of play. We'll call it B+. At some point or another, a top player such as SVB played at the B+ level. So what did he do to break through to the next level? And why haven't you done it yet?

Great. We have another one of the "Ask-a-question-and-then-deride-the-responders" posters.

Go back to Trollville.

 

[Mrdodd72]

Interesting answer but I think you missed the question. I didn't ask you to evaluate the differences between top pros. I wanted you to evaluate your own game and tell me why you haven't broken through to the next level.

For example, let's take your level of play. We'll call it B+. At some point or another, a top player such as SVB played at the B+ level. So what did he do to break through to the next level? And why haven't you done it yet?

I think this may be somewhat of a loaded question. If most of us, truly knew, the reasons why we haven't broken through to the next level, then we would make the adjustments to do just that.

We all have speculations as to why we haven't improved, i.e. lack of practice, lack of competition, lack of time, anger issues, and generally, life getting in the way. But if we understood exactly what the missing piece was, w'ed correct it.

Physiologically, I can always improve my consistency by improving my PSR. Mentally I need to improve on letting my mistakes go, and maintaining a consistent aggressive attitude (not folding when behind, and going for the jugular when ahead).

 

[book collector]

The ones that keep improving , keep practicing.
The ones that don't improve , have forgotten that you have to keep playing to keep the feel, especially speed.
Jay Helfert has already said that whenever any of the pinoys stay at his house , they play each other for 8 or 10 hours a day.
Then you watch another player, that used to beat everyone, and he comes in the poolroom, and sits around for an hour, and leaves, and never hit a ball.
Who do you think wins, when they next play?
If your practice turns into lazy habits and wasted time , you probably aren't practicing correctly.

 

[Tramp Steamer]

I don't believe that a pool player (any pool player) has infinite levels of skill that he can attain.
We have spoken before about reaching plateaus. It is my contention that a player will eventually reach his or her last plateau and go no further.
Staying on that plateau (or level) requires constant play and practice in order to offset the ravages of advancing age, poor eyesight, loss of muscle memory and coordination, etc.
If the progress of a pool player's skill was a continuum, and his age was of no consideration, then at some point he would be able to walk up to the table and simply will the balls into the pockets. If this were possible then tomorrow's headline might read: Efren Reyes, 175 year old professional pool player defeats 214 year old Luther Lassiter, by expertly willing in the nine-ball in the final game of their much publicized match.
Mr. Lassiter, as you all know, was exhumed and revitalized only last year. In a recent interview he (Mr. Lassiter) said, "I'm a little stiff, but it feels good to be playing again."


I couldn't help it. Screw that serious shit. :smile:

 

[BasementDweller]

If you always view your game as a work in progress you will continue to improve. At least that mindset has worked for me. I think too often players conclude that the work on their stroke, or their stance, or their pattern play, etc is complete and now all they need to do is compete and they will get better. These players get stuck.

 

[Skratch]

I don't believe that a pool player (any pool player) has infinite levels of skill that he can attain.
We have spoken before about reaching plateaus. It is my contention that a player will eventually reach his or her last plateau and go no further.
Staying on that plateau (or level) requires constant play and practice in order to offset the ravages of advancing age, poor eyesight, loss of muscle memory and coordination, etc.
If the progress of a pool player's skill was a continuum, and his age was of no consideration, then at some point he would be able to walk up to the table and simply will the balls into the pockets. If this were possible then tomorrow's headline might read: Efren Reyes, 175 year old professional pool player defeats 214 year old Luther Lassiter, by expertly willing in the nine-ball in the final game of their much publicized match.
Mr. Lassiter, as you all know, was exhumed and revitalized only last year. In a recent interview he (Mr. Lassiter) said, "I'm a little stiff, but it feels good to be playing again."


I couldn't help it. Screw that serious shit. :smile:

HAHAHA!

"If you had one Super Power, what would it be?" I would say Telekinesis!! Now I can WILL the balls in!! :thumbup:

Did you see that sick table roll?!

 

[StuartTKelley]

I think there are a lot of good points being made here and a lot of common sense here too. I do believe there are fundamentals that can be improved by coaching and a solid PSR can help consistency as well but after all of those things are in line then improving comes down to playing a lot with better players and watching better players in my opinion. And like someone else said, learning all games. I still believe that most people are only going to get so good and that's it without utter dedication and training and even with that..just so good. If all players could get to SVB level with dedication then we'd all be world beaters if we knew that's all there was to it. Who wouldn't make the sacrifice if it was that easy.

Pro's do work hard and their life is playing but they didn't get to that level on that alone. I really think there are natural abilities and incredible aptitude in all of these top players and most people don't have it in them. It's intangible and hard to prove I suppose and some egos refuse to swallow that pill but that's my opinion. Explain to me for example why a 12 year old kid has a monster stroke and can break and run out racks like it's his job......he didn't get that by simply training and coaching...the kid has it in him or ..the talent is there to be molded into something greater but it didn't get there simply because they got bored with playstation and decided to play a little pool on Daddy's table.....Right?