Industry Supporting Industry

[JAM]

The never-ending debate about why professional pool has one tire in the mud continues to plague American pool. There is no so-called professional tour for the men. Sorry, ABP, but you don't rank, IMO, since you have no legitimate tour. The ladies pro tour, I just don't read much about them anymore like I used to. Instead of things staying the same or treading water, professional pool is sinking deeper in a hole, so to speak.

I look at the BCA and its industry members, and there is one school of thought that since they represent industry members, they are not obligated to provide or sponsor or help or aid professional pool in the United States. After all, the BCA today is an industry member organization, yet they are the governing body of professional pool to the WPA. I just don't get it.

When I see tournaments and exhibitions in pool today, the industry member who is producing the event is being sponsored by another industry member(s), i.e., industry supporting industry.

Like Lou Butera once said, Brunswick, Simonis, Aramith, Diamond, Olhausen, and all the others big industry members should be putting on their own tournaments for professional pool players. Instead, these industry members support other industry members and don't really seem interested in professional pool whatsoever.

The pool industry will be successful because of leagues and recreational pool, and unless and until pro players come with a product to sell, this trend will continue.

I saw a golf bio on TV about a young golfer named Rickie Fowler. This kid has a following, and the Rickie Fowler Fan Club is growing. Pool needs a Rickie Fowler; in other words, a personality.

Otherwise, industry will support other industry members, while the pro players remain on the outside looking in, hoping to pick up a few crumbs the industry members throw their way. The industry members get fat and continue to grow, and the pro players become extinct.

 

[JAM]

This kid, Rickie Fowler, used to ride dirt bikes and decided to take a shot at golf.

Because of his personality, the young kids are taken aback by him. He's selling product up the ying-yang. Puma is gaining popularity with the younger generation, thanks to Rickie.

 

[JAM]

Pool needs a Rickie Fowler for the younger generation to aspire to. Pool industry would welcome a Rickie Fowler, I'd imagine, if they got fans like this attending pool happenings.

 

[jimmyg]

It's really very simple JAM. :smile:

It always comes down to the people involved in the industry, and the people not involved in the industry. Mostly the people not involved in the industry are not involved because of the people who are involved in the industry.

voilà!

J.

 

[JAM]

It's really very simple JAM. :smile:

It always comes down to the people involved in the industry, and the people not involved in the industry. Mostly the people not involved in the industry are not involved because of the people that are involved in the industry.

voilà!

J.

LOL! Could you please elaborate? I'm not sure I am following correctly.

 

[Maniac]

Instead, these industry members support other industry members and don't really seem interested in professional pool whatsoever.

The pool industry will be successful because of leagues and recreational pool, and unless and until pro players come with a product to sell, this trend will continue.

Jen, the industry members don't seem interested in professional pool whatsoever because, except for the die-hard members of pool forums such as this one, nobody else is interested in it either.

I agree wholeheartedly with the second part I quoted above. This is also what the pool industry members are putting their faith in also. They are going to make their money from league/recreational players and not professional players who generate very little money (if any) for them.

Let's face it. America is literally saturated with sports. The big four (football, baseball, basketball, and hockey) get most of the interest from the American public. NASCAR is huge in many states (and ALL of the southern states!) Because of the shift in cultural demographics, soccer is quickly rising in many states. Golf is real big in America. Tennis, bowling, volleyball, all these minor sports have been around for ages, and there are more I could list. Except for NASCAR all the above mentioned sports have programs in our high-schools, thus spawing interest in both the participants and their parents at an early age. What does pool have? How is there even room in Americans lives for it with all the other more 'established" sports we already have? We've already got more sports in this country than we can "shake a stick at".

My feeling is that pool is going to stay a league/recreational game for quite a few more years. At least until they (professionals) can come up with a plan that is vastly different than what has been tried in the past. Getting involved with our youth would be wise also. If they could cease with their money-grabbing ways long enough to get their feet in-the-door with the American public, it would be a sacrifice by them that could benefit others down the road.

As I usually do, I will "hope for the best but expect the worst".

Maniac

 

[ShootingArts]

no reason for pro pool to exist

The never-ending debate about why professional pool has one tire in the mud continues to plague American pool. There is no so-called professional tour for the men. Sorry, ABP, but you don't rank, IMO, since you have no legitimate tour. The ladies pro tour, I just don't read much about them anymore like I used to. Instead of things staying the same or treading water, professional pool is sinking deeper in a hole, so to speak.

I look at the BCA and its industry members, and there is one school of thought that since they represent industry members, they are not obligated to provide or sponsor or help or aid professional pool in the United States. After all, the BCA today is an industry member organization, yet they are the governing body of professional pool to the WPA. I just don't get it.

When I see tournaments and exhibitions in pool today, the industry member who is producing the event is being sponsored by another industry member(s), i.e., industry supporting industry.

Like Lou Butera once said, Brunswick, Simonis, Aramith, Diamond, Olhausen, and all the others big industry members should be putting on their own tournaments for professional pool players. Instead, these industry members support other industry members and don't really seem interested in professional pool whatsoever.

The pool industry will be successful because of leagues and recreational pool, and unless and until pro players come with a product to sell, this trend will continue.

I saw a golf bio on TV about a young golfer named Rickie Fowler. This kid has a following, and the Rickie Fowler Fan Club is growing. Pool needs a Rickie Fowler; in other words, a personality.

Otherwise, industry will support other industry members, while the pro players remain on the outside looking in, hoping to pick up a few crumbs the industry members throw their way. The industry members get fat and continue to grow, and the pro players become extinct.

Unfortunately for all that aspire to play pool as a career, there is no reason for pro pool to exist. Amateurs don't watch pro pool in significant numbers in the US. Because people don't watch it pool is used largely as occasional filler since it is free to the network to run it over and over. No promotion to speak of, no consistent scheduling, and often not actually shown when it is on the schedule because something else runs longer than expected and pool was put in there as a sacrificial lamb if they needed to chop up programing.

Were I a major player in the pool industry I wouldn't advertise during a pool competition or support one as advertising. Why? The few people watching pool on TV are the hardcore pool addicts, I already have their support. I need to appeal to new customers so I need to market to other people.

The ugly truth is that any support the pool industry gives to pro pool in the US these days is just crumbs tossed to the pigeons, charity or kindness. What do the industry members get from supporting pro pool in the US? They get good will, they get halo effect, they get all kinds of things we can't quantify. What can be quantified is real increases in sales against money paid out and that doesn't happen.

The BCA is 100% right in what they do. They are an industry group working for the industry. Like you I think it is ridiculous that they are the representative for pro pool in the US though. Their interest in pro pool would fit on your thumbnail with plenty of room left over.

There are a few industry players that support pro pool because they want to. It isn't for what they get in return. Thank goodness for these few people because they are giving more than they are receiving!

I wish there was a different song to sing. I think you are right what we really need is a US Jennifer Chen, a pop star that plays professional pool. That just might make pool cool for a little while. I doubt it would last though, pool seems to be destined to always be on the cold outer edges of sports or activities.

Hu

 

[CocoboloCowboy]

It's really very simple JAM. :smile:

It always comes down to the people involved in the industry, and the people not involved in the industry. Mostly the people not involved in the industry are not involved because of the people who are involved in the industry.

voilà!

J.

Are you saying Pool has a BAD IMAGE? IMHO it does.

 

[poolguy4u]

What is a professional pool player? I see tournaments advertised every month that pay cash.



There is money to be made out there, you just need to go out and get it. Don't be lazy and stay away from drugs and alcohol.


Big manufacturers of pool supplies might have a good reason why they don't sponsor tournaments for a Pro. They are a sponsor of lots of amateur leagues across America though.


We could ask...why don't more professional players sponsor professional pool...like Allen Hopkins and Dawn. I'm sure there are many more, but it is a huge job to do this.

 

[SouthernDraw]

A Productive Topic

I think this is one of the most interesting topics and possibly could be one of the most productive topics here in a while.

And I believe that you are refering to American Pool as USA or North American. Either way, between two great ponds.

About RFowler
Our single best player is now unarguably SVB. Although there are more non-continental players living here that could arguably compete with him. Shane is the one that can relate with N Americans best.

Shane doesn't show the outgoing personality that attracts attention (the IT factor). So you understand me, ...for pool, I don't think that anyone has to have this IT factor to inspire young people to enjoy our Great Sport. I think the best analogy I could come up with is he's not a "Fats", but more of a "Mosconi". And Mosconi inspired generations of players. More so...Shane has a ton of personality that we don't usually see...the TAR podcast with Shane was terrific much because we got to see his personality. During tournaments and match play, Shane is focused and doesn't engage people in talk. This is his competition style. He practices non-stop. This is a style and one I can appreciate. TAR did well in getting him face time...I'd just like to see more of it.

That said, I think promoters of our sport could do a better job of promoting our players as people. Possibly, autograph sessions after the day's competition or just chatting sessions between players and fans after people have been eliminated. Quick streaming interviews after a match. But, not anything that would break a players focus on future matches for that day. It's more balancing between player's focus and interaction with fans.

I think TAR and other promoters often bring in players to talk about matches being played. That's really good to put a personality with the player. Even past players talking about their experiences on the road. The past Hard Times stream JayH had RobinD and she was talking about going on the road for the first time (w/KeithM). Really, interesting stuff. So all's not bad, there's just more promoting that would help.

I've heard people say, you can walk up to most any player and talk to them. Their very friendly and understand that fans are their lifeline. But for most fans, they just aren't going to do this. I think a more formal venue for this would be more efficient and productive. Autograph sessions, press-type conferences (with Q&A's from fans), streaming interviews...anything to get players personalities out.

 

[JAM]

Some good content in this thread that I had not thought of perviously. I hope others chime in.

It's true about pool needing the "it" factor to resonate with the fans. I've been sweating golf lately since my other half watches it nonstop, and I could not help but notice Tiger Woods' beautiful striped red shirt yesterday by Nike. I must get my BF one. I love it. This is what industry sponsors could benefit from, people like me, the fans who spend money.

This picture doesn't do the shirt justice, but check out Tiger's physique. What a tiny waste.

[typo intended]

 

[JAM]

One question that comes to mind is this. Do industry members benefit financially from sponsoring other industry members, or is it more of name-brand recognition that benefits the sponsoring industry member more so? Getting their name out there, IOW.

When I see pool the rare times it's on TV, I see the same names: Brunswick, Diamond, Olhausen, Simonis, and Aramith. Sometimes a pool chalk company will have their name thrown in the mix. This name-brand recognition is what helps an industry member sell their product. People will be more inclined to purchase, say, a Diamond, Brunswick, or Olhausen table. These industry members have name-brand recognition.

In pool, though, is the ROI (return on investment) really that great?

 

[vasilios]

It is Saturday - the weather is nice - I have a 20 dollar bill - 2 choices to spend it

1: go to the poolroom and watch a tournament that packs out with 300 people including the players.might end at midnight.

2: go to the golf tournament with 40,000 people and room for more that will finish by diner time.


bill

 

[JAM]

It is Saturday - the weather is nice - I have a 20 dollar bill - 2 choices to spend it

1: go to the poolroom and watch a tournament that packs out with 300 people including the players.might end at midnight.

2: go to the golf tournament with 40,000 people and room for more that will finish by diner time.


bill

LOL! Me, I'm a professional railbird, and I prefer sitting down as opposed to walking MILES and MILES uphill like a mountain goat out in the heat. I'll take the pool tournament! :thumbup:

 

[DaveK]

Ricky Fowler is popular because golf is big and he gets lots of exposure as a result. Golf is big with or without Ricky.

Dave

 

[jimmyg]

Originally Posted by jimmyg View Post
It's really very simple JAM.

It always comes down to the people involved in the industry, and the people not involved in the industry. Mostly the people not involved in the industry are not involved because of the people who are involved in the industry.

voilà! J. ]

Are you saying Pool has a BAD IMAGE? IMHO it does.

If you were Donald Trump, George Steinbrenner, or Magic Johnson, would you invest in golf, baseball, tennis, or pool? Which environment would prefer spending your life in? Rhetorical questions.

J.

 

[tuda]

i think your right to a point, about there not being a "flashy" player that can attract the masses, but i also think its partly due to the fact that the pro players make it look so easy, that its just boring to the normal person not that interested in pool, i mean they see these pro's running out like well water, and staying in perfect line, very little real "fire power" is displayed and in my opinion, its just boring to watch if your not a pool fanatic.

What the game needs is another Keith Mcready... a young kid, fearless, taking on all comers, walking around with his old "the worlds got the 8" shirt, chatting it up, and pumping new blood into the game...

Shane is a great champion, and one of the best rotation players i have seen recently, but the spark, the charisma just isn't there now... and not just him, but when was the last time you saw a champion, on the TV table, playing to the crowd? to the pro's, its a business (and understandably so, its how they make a living) but in order to attract the new people, i think we need a player that can bring them in.

 

[poolguy4u]

Back in the 1980's I had pool shooting shoes. Both the eight ball and nine ball. I don't know who made them but they were okay to wear.


They were advertised in the pool magazines way back then.

Shoot better pool with pool shooting shoes.

Wish I had bought 10 pair now.:smile:

 

[SLIM]

lol! Me, i'm a professional railbird, and i prefer sitting down as opposed to walking miles and miles uphill like a mountain goat out in the heat. I'll take the pool tournament! :thumbup:

you & me both.

Unfortunatly there just are not enough of us.

SLIM

 

[macguy]

This kid, Rickie Fowler, used to ride dirt bikes and decided to take a shot at golf.

Because of his personality, the young kids are taken aback by him. He's selling product up the ying-yang. Puma is gaining popularity with the younger generation, thanks to Rickie.

Not so much because of his personality, but because they know he exists. It is a constant catch-22 with pool.