inlays "pop" out over time?

ddadams

ddadams

Absolutely love this cue.
Silver Member
I don't want to stir up anything about "quality issues" but on every cue that's been played with that I've felt with rings like my Josey the rings have "popped" out a bit, you can feel them through the finish.


I've read and seen that this is basically expected and I'm ok with it, but now I'm second guessing ordering a cue with malachite inlays fearing the same might happen over those inlays.

Do stone inlays pop out the same way at all?
 
This is a very common misconception. Your rings, inlays and whatever you feel are not popping out.
Rings are incapable of 'growing' and inlays very, very, very rarely become un-bonded.
What you're actually feeling is the finish getting smaller or tighter on the surface.
It's called 'pinch-down'. The finish is contracting. It's common with most all auto-clear coats.
It's not a quality issue, it's a time issue.
Ideally, if a CM were given the time, he'd let the finished cue hang for 6 mos. after his last coat.
Then, wet sand it again (very lightly) using say 400 grit and shoot it again. You won't feel the rings.

But alas, the client wants his cue ASAP so the 6 mo. hang time is generally by-passed.
Would you wait an additional 6 mos. knowing your cue was done and just hanging???
Not many buyers will.

Another method to avoid the 'popping' is to use an epoxy or UV substrate and shoot the clear over that.
Epoxies are another Donahue all together.

Don't worry about it. This issue will be addressed when the cue is refinished.

KJ
 
KJ Cues said:
This is a very common misconception. Your rings, inlays and whatever you feel are not popping out.
Rings are incapable of 'growing' and inlays very, very, very rarely become un-bonded.
What you're actually feeling is the finish getting smaller or tighter on the surface.
It's called 'pinch-down'. The finish is contracting. It's common with most all auto-clear coats.
It's not a quality issue, it's a time issue.
Ideally, if a CM were given the time, he'd let the finished cue hang for 6 mos. after his last coat.
Then, wet sand it again (very lightly) using say 400 grit and shoot it again. You won't feel the rings.

But alas, the client wants his cue ASAP so the 6 mo. hang time is generally by-passed.
Would you wait an additional 6 mos. knowing your cue was done and just hanging???
Not many buyers will.

Another method to avoid the 'popping' is to use an epoxy or UV substrate and shoot the clear over that.
Epoxies are another Donahue all together.

Don't worry about it. This issue will be addressed when the cue is refinished.

KJ
Click to expand...


Oh I couldn't give a damn less about the rings on my cue. I love everything about it and after getting this cue I've gotten so much better and I attribute some of it to the cue.

Surely me practicing 3x as much and getting some small lessons didn't help. Gotta be this cue :)


Hence why I want another of Keith's, but a bit more fancy with some green in it. I just get slightly distracted between shots when I feel the parts by the rings in my fingers.


I don't want the other parts to feel like that.


And to be honest with some of the waiting lists I'm on with the money I'll be forking out, I'd gladly wait 6 months more for things done the best way possible.


But i understand why most wouldn't.
 
KJ Cues said:
This is a very common misconception. Your rings, inlays and whatever you feel are not popping out.
Rings are incapable of 'growing' and inlays very, very, very rarely become un-bonded.
What you're actually feeling is the finish getting smaller or tighter on the surface.
It's called 'pinch-down'. The finish is contracting. It's common with most all auto-clear coats.
It's not a quality issue, it's a time issue.
Ideally, if a CM were given the time, he'd let the finished cue hang for 6 mos. after his last coat.
Then, wet sand it again (very lightly) using say 400 grit and shoot it again. You won't feel the rings.

But alas, the client wants his cue ASAP so the 6 mo. hang time is generally by-passed.
Would you wait an additional 6 mos. knowing your cue was done and just hanging???
Not many buyers will.

Another method to avoid the 'popping' is to use an epoxy or UV substrate and shoot the clear over that.
Epoxies are another Donahue all together.

Don't worry about it. This issue will be addressed when the cue is refinished.

KJ
Click to expand...

Just curious to know,,,,,,,is this only an issue with autoclear finishes, or do other finishes, waterbourne for example, eventually "pinch" as well?
 
For the most part yes, just auto-clears though I have been able to feel rings through some UV finishes though it's rare.
Consider also that UV is laid-on pretty thick compared to A/C.
A/C is solvent heavy. Over time those trapped solvents escape causing the finish to pinch-down.
I'm not familiar enough with the other finishes that CMs use so I'm not comfortable talking about them.

KJ
 
ddadams said:
I don't want to stir up anything about "quality issues" but on every cue that's been played with that I've felt with rings like my Josey the rings have "popped" out a bit, you can feel them through the finish.


I've read and seen that this is basically expected and I'm ok with it, but now I'm second guessing ordering a cue with malachite inlays fearing the same might happen over those inlays.

Do stone inlays pop out the same way at all?
Click to expand...

DD,

Most inlay material that you refer to as stone is actually a reconstitute material, not actual stone per se. It just looks like stone.

JMO,

Rick
 
scdiveteam said:
DD,

Most inlay material that you refer to as stone is actually a reconstitute material, not actual stone per se. It just looks like stone.

JMO,

Rick
Click to expand...

Ah

Interesting. I always wondered about that actually. Cool enough, so it should be way way fine then.
 
I have used epoxy and water borne finishes. Every once in a while I get 1 fiber ring or a joint between two different woods to "pop" a little.

I am not sure what to blame for it. It's frustrating.

The only thing that eases the frustration is that I can feel the rings on most other cues too. Then again, there are some cues that remain smooth forever..... go figure...

Kim
 
Sometimes the rings can be felt because the wood itself has shrunk and the adjacent plastic, metal, or other wood hasn't shrunk. Tulip wood often behaves this way even after years of ageing. KJ is right on the money about 6 month finishing jobs, they do come out better.
 
Paul Dayton said:
Sometimes the rings can be felt because the wood itself has shrunk and the adjacent plastic, metal, or other wood hasn't shrunk. Tulip wood often behaves this way even after years of ageing. KJ is right on the money about 6 month finishing jobs, they do come out better.
Click to expand...

Once again, a "senior contributor:wink:" nails it.
 
Finish shrinks, wood shrinks, some metal, plastic and fiber rings expand when a lot of heat gets to them. This is one reason I rarely use metal washer type of rings in my cues. I also discontinued using the older fiber rings or the softer plastic rings. Both of those would swell the most of any materials I ever used. So to be honest with you, yes you might be able to feel your inlays one day. It depends on the wood they are laid into. That manufactured malachite should not shrink or expand. And it is anyones guess on the wood. If I wanted malachite inlays in a cue I would go for it. You can always refinish the cue a few years down the road if something moves a little. Cues should be enjoyed and not worried about. They are kind of like furniture or other articles that get used, they need some upkeep at times.
 
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