IPT Check arrived Today

[memikey]

Memi

I do not think it is sugary gushing.
I think the players were owed most of the money and still are the majority of the money owed. First things first.
How many people paid 2000. after Reno? I bet it was not many.

You guys jump into any thread that develops viewers and proceed with the negative. It drives people away as they have heard it before. Why don't you write on threads that are hurting for readers such as IPT on Chicago News and leave the popular threads alone?

I think that if some guy you don't know started mailing you checks you would be a happy camper also. I take it that is not happening to you!

Bozo, let's get one thing straight. I am not a tunnel-visioned knocker. I vocally supported the IPT from the beginning in these and other forums and supported it in more tangible ways by entering events and with hard cash backing others entries. I wholly support the need for all players to be paid what they are entitled to and those card holders who I know personally still receive every encouragement from me in that respect. Without any reservations whatsoever I am absolutely delighted that players are being paid and I certainly agree that IPT deserve some credit for continuing to try to meet their obligations.

However, there did come a point where I felt that original support had been misplaced. I am not usually prone to being so stupid as to mistake a dog turd for a chocolate eclair and if the truth be told I guess I'm more angry with myself than with IPT.

If you want a forum where all anyone does is pat each other on the back, agree that KT is a decent guy who just loves pool and in which some of the posted content (albeit no doubt unintentionally) sneers at all those people who have not been paid by IPT, then start a forum that makes it crystal clear it's for those views only or for IPT card holders only. I'd certainly abide by the request not to post in such a clearly defined forum. Until that happens I will decide where and when I post, not you.

There are indeed many who had $2k intentionally and premeditatively stolen from them after Reno and there are hundreds who did not receive various commissions stretching back to the very first tournament. I totally disagree with the foundation of your crass ('first things first') implication that the remaining outstanding prize money due to card holders is more important than all those 2k entry fees etc except in the sense that of course it is more important to IPT for obvious reasons.

You are right that no checks will ever be mailed to me. I long ago told them to shove the small amount of money they were owe me where the sun don't shine.

You are also right that a happy campers forum should remain happy. So have fun and I'm sorry if any views offended

 

[Bozo]

Memi

I liked your last post much better!

First things first = The people at Reno had an older debt then the post Reno applicants.

Also One group does not get paid and another group is ready to pay 2K and jump in there in some cases replacing down the road the ones who refuse to play without being paid. Who should I root for to get paid first?

 

[memikey]

If IPT have a set amount of money available each month or every second month (currently totalling 11% of the Reno prize money) then it would surely be more equitable if they divided those funds amongst all their creditors in proportion to the amounts owed

Seems we will just have to disagree on elements of this aspect. Absolutely no question it is good news that payments are continuing to card holders and would just express the hope that card holders will support in due course the need for reimbursement of others

 

[sde]

If IPT have a set amount of money available each month or every second month (currently totalling 11% of the Reno prize money) then it would surely be more equitable if they divided those funds amongst all their creditors in proportion to the amounts owed

Seems we will just have to disagree on elements of this aspect. Absolutely no question it is good news that payments are continuing to card holders and would just express the hope that card holders will support in due course the need for reimbursement of others

Is it a fact that creditors, other then the players, have not received any payment? I have not seen anything one way or the other from the vendors or qualifiers regarding payment. Have I missed something?

Steve

 

[nineballpaul]

Many from Vegas Tourney Still Owed

I had 10 % of Sam Monday in the Vegas Tournament. Signed contract with IPT. Hosted a qualifier for Vegas. They took the 10% from Sam's check but never paid me. They still owe me 1000 from Vegas tourney. Those folks that had sponsors to get to Vegas got their money but the sponsors still nothing. I'm ecstatic the players are getting some of their money owed. They deserve it but no more that those poolroom owners and sponsors who helped get them there. Without poolrooms there would be no pool tournaments.

 

[memikey]

Is it a fact that creditors, other then the players, have not received any payment? I have not seen anything one way or the other from the vendors or qualifiers regarding payment. Have I missed something?

Steve

Yes Steve you do seem to be missing quite a lot

Though they might or might not have some outstandings the posts concerned in this thread certainly didn't mention or refer to vendors or tour venues etc for the precise reason that they were not speculation and were only referring to the type of creditors we can be absolutely sure about. Nineballpaul has given you one example of the large number of people still in the position that most sponsor/referral creditors have been in (since Vegas, not Reno).

Not sure exactly what you mean about "not seen anything about Qualifiers regarding payment" but the position there is crystal clear. In the course of setting out how they will pay their creditors IPT issued a promise that if the scheduled 2007 tour does not take place they will refund everyone who paid $2k to enter the pre-qualifying tournaments trying to win a place in the 2007 tour card qualifying event originally due to take place in December 2006. At this time there can be no doubt that the 2007 tour will not take place as the 2006 tour isn't even completed, although we shouldn't put it past the IPT spin doctors to eventually come out with some bollocks about the 2007 tour being now scheduled to take place in 2008 in order to attempt a body swerve.

In fairness all of these existing creditors should have been already getting a share of available funds, otherwise it will, amongst other things, simply lead to speculation that IPT are attempting to pay only tour card holders for purely selfish reasons regarding IPT future intentions and that they are using all the other money put into the pot by others to pay only tour card holders. They cannot believably blame any administrative difficulty that would be involved as they had absolutely no problem in their capability to instantly process entry fees.

In his "first things first" chronological line of argument Bozo takes the view that it is right that Reno prize money should be paid first as that came before qualifier entry fees. Quite apart from the fact that many qualifier fees were actually paid before the Reno problem developed the other sponsor etc debts are from way back to Vegas etc so are much older and if Bozo's own line of argument is followed (am not suggesting it should be) those creditors should be paid before Reno prize winners.

Don't know why but there seems to be many on these boards who assume that you have to be either totally for or totally against the original IPT or any prospect of a rejunevated IPT and that everything posted is automatically geared to one of those entrenched predetermined positions. It isn't so. It's quite possible to be able to see the good and the bad, the pluses and the minuses, the veracity and the spin.

 

[sde]

Yes Steve you do seem to be missing quite a lot

Though they might or might not have some outstandings the posts concerned in this thread certainly didn't mention or refer to vendors or tour venues etc for the precise reason that they were not speculation and were only referring to the type of creditors we can be absolutely sure about. Nineballpaul has given you one example of the large number of people still in the position that most sponsor/referral creditors have been in (since Vegas, not Reno).

Not sure exactly what you mean about "not seen anything about Qualifiers regarding payment" but the position there is crystal clear. In the course of setting out how they will pay their creditors IPT issued a promise that if the scheduled 2007 tour does not take place they will refund everyone who paid $2k to enter the pre-qualifying tournaments trying to win a place in the 2007 tour card qualifying event originally due to take place in December 2006. At this time there can be no doubt that the 2007 tour will not take place as the 2006 tour isn't even completed, although we shouldn't put it past the IPT spin doctors to eventually come out with some bollocks about the 2007 tour being now scheduled to take place in 2008 in order to attempt a body swerve.

In fairness all of these existing creditors should have been already getting a share of available funds, otherwise it will, amongst other things, simply lead to speculation that IPT are attempting to pay only tour card holders for purely selfish reasons regarding IPT future intentions and that they are using all the other money put into the pot by others to pay only tour card holders. They cannot believably blame any administrative difficulty that would be involved as they had absolutely no problem in their capability to instantly process entry fees.

In his "first things first" chronological line of argument Bozo takes the view that it is right that Reno prize money should be paid first as that came before qualifier entry fees. Quite apart from the fact that many qualifier fees were actually paid before the Reno problem developed the other sponsor etc debts are from way back to Vegas etc so are much older and if Bozo's own line of argument is followed (am not suggesting it should be) those creditors should be paid before Reno prize winners.

Don't know why but there seems to be many on these boards who assume that you have to be either totally for or totally against the original IPT or any prospect of a rejunevated IPT and that everything posted is automatically geared to one of those entrenched predetermined positions. It isn't so. It's quite possible to be able to see the good and the bad, the pluses and the minuses, the veracity and the spin.

Thanks for refreshing my memory regarding the non-payment of the qualifiers for the qualifier.

Perhaps you misspoke when you stated

to pay only tour card holders

and you meant to include the 50 players who qualified to play in Reno.

I personally know one player (not a card holder) who qualified to play in Reno who has been payed 55% of the money owed to him.

I agree that all creditors should be receiving payments along with the players but I believe that the fact that the players are being paid (however slowly) is to be taken as a good sign.

Steve

 

[sde]

I had 10 % of Sam Monday in the Vegas Tournament. Signed contract with IPT. Hosted a qualifier for Vegas. They took the 10% from Sam's check but never paid me. They still owe me 1000 from Vegas tourney. Those folks that had sponsors to get to Vegas got their money but the sponsors still nothing. I'm ecstatic the players are getting some of their money owed. They deserve it but no more that those poolroom owners and sponsors who helped get them there. Without poolrooms there would be no pool tournaments.

Thanks for the clarification. I was aware of this several months ago but I do not like to assume, with out updates, that there has been no change to the situation.

FWIW I believe that what is happening to you is wrong, just plain wrong.

Steve

 

[memikey]

Thanks for refreshing my memory regarding the non-payment of the qualifiers for the qualifier.

Perhaps you misspoke when you statedand you meant to include the 50 players who qualified to play in Reno.

I personally know one player (not a card holder) who qualified to play in Reno who has been payed 55% of the money owed to him.

I agree that all creditors should be receiving payments along with the players but I believe that the fact that the players are being paid (however slowly) is to be taken as a good sign.

Steve

Yes Steve I meant to include all the prize money winners from Reno and didn't make that clear. Fully agree with your last para.

By the way I didn't remind you of the non payment of the "qualifiers for the qualifier", I reminded you of the promise to pay "all the entrants for the pre-qualifiers for the qualifier", a much larger group of players than the "qualifiers for the qualifier".

 

[Blackjack]

So... Kevin's money was great while it lasted, it's great receiving a check every so often, at least he's making an effort, etc, etc, and so on.

FWIW, alot of the IPT players have sponsors and backers that would NOT sponsor OR support them if they decided to play for Kevin Trudeau again. That is a fact, and it speaks volumes for the future of the IPT and Kevin Turdeau. I compare the effectiveness of the IPT to stomping the gas pedal while your car is in neutral. It wasted a lot of people's time and energy taking them absolutely nowhere.

There were many players and fans that were loyal to Camel (RJ Reynolds) after that tour sunk, so I am not suprised to hear people in support of Kevin and his efforts at this time. The reality is that in both situations there were obvious warning signs early on that it would not /could not last and that the player's best interests in the long term were ignored in the planning stages. The player's need stability and assurance to go with the big money.

The IPT was not stable, nor did anybody have any idea how long (or how short) it would last. That alone should have alerted everyone to proceed with caution, but then again people like myself were labeled naysayers for recommending the utilization of common sense at the time.

In the end there is no explanation for the mess that was left behind. There is no explanation for the smoke screen/BS diversionary tactic he used by tossing around Stanley Ho's name. There are no $100K salaries coming to any of the players for 2007 and KT is "conveniently" not contractually obligated to payout those promised salaries either. I have personally talked to many players that almost quit playing due to the failure of the IPT. Some of the older players will probably never return due to the fact that they are getting tired of outcomes such as this.

That's reality.

It's not about whether you would do it all over again if given the chance, its about breaking this cycle of failure that professional pool is stuck in. There is a alot of misused and misdirected energy along with excuses as to why the IPT failed - combined with people excusing KT for his actions. Instead we need to motivate ourselves to advance the sport without the help of people like Kevin Truedeau. To the players that still support Kevin: If you keep doing what you always do, you will keep getting what you have always gotten.

Too many people, when they make a mistake, just keep stubbornly plowing ahead and end up repeating those same mistakes. I believe in the motto, "try and try again." But the way I read it, it says, "Try, then stop and think. Then try again. - William Dean Singleton

Wise words to live by.

 

[Irish634]

To the players that still support Kevin: If you keep doing what you always do, you will keep getting what you have always gotten.

Too many people, when they make a mistake, just keep stubbornly plowing ahead and end up repeating those same mistakes. I believe in the motto, "try and try again." But the way I read it, it says, "Try, then stop and think. Then try again. - William Dean Singleton

Wise words to live by.

I'll add to that..... The definition of insanity... doing the same thing over and over, expecting a different result...

Nice post Blackjack

 

[jay helfert]

Bozo, let's get one thing straight. I am not a tunnel-visioned knocker. I vocally supported the IPT from the beginning in these and other forums and supported it in more tangible ways by entering events and with hard cash backing others entries. I wholly support the need for all players to be paid what they are entitled to and those card holders who I know personally still receive every encouragement from me in that respect. Without any reservations whatsoever I am absolutely delighted that players are being paid and I certainly agree that IPT deserve some credit for continuing to try to meet their obligations.

However, there did come a point where I felt that support had been misplaced. I am not prone to being so stupid as to mistake a dog turd for a chocolate eclair and if the truth be told I guess I'm angry with myself not with IPT.

If you want a forum where all anyone does is pat each other on the back, agree that KT is a decent guy who just loves pool and in which some of the posted content (albeit no doubt unintentionally) sneers at all those people who have not been paid by IPT, then start a forum that makes it crystal clear it's for those views only or for IPT card holders only. I'd certainly abide by the request not to post in such a clearly defined forum. Until that happens I will decide where and when I post, not you.

There are indeed many who had $2k intentionally and premeditatively stolen from them after Reno and there are hundreds who did not receive various commissions stretching back to the very first tournament. I totally disagree with the foundation of your crass ('first things first') implication that the remaining outstanding prize money due to card holders is more important than all those 2k entry fees etc except in the sense that of course it is more important to IPT for obvious reasons.

You are right that no checks will ever be mailed to me. I long ago told them to shove the small amount of money they were owe me where the sun don't shine.

You are also right that a happy campers forum should remain happy. So have fun and I'm sorry if any views offended

Tap Tap Tap

 

[!Smorgass Bored]

If He Does It Again,Is It "TOO BAD II "

I am a firm believer that if the legislation for online gambling (and i know its not the gaming of it,its the way people pay for it)DID'NT come in when it did there still might be an I.P.T.
As much as a scumbag K.T. is at least he tried to build something that the pool world has never seen.
ITS JUST TOO BAD.

Well, Barney Fife, I mean Barney Frank is currently attempting to rectify that gambling bill and have online gambling re-instated. Please notify KT to get in touch with Stanely Ho and print out the IPO shares and arrange for some of the promised 2007 IPT tournaments.....
Doug
( patiently waiting for Neteller to come back to it's customers )

 

[Schon-desi]

Any news on June checks?

 

[!Smorgass Bored]

Last Payment Was MAY 21st ?

Any news on June checks?

Or July checks.
Doug
( August is right around the corner ) 7/27/07

 

[Blackjack]

Or July checks.
Doug
( August is right around the corner ) 7/27/07

From what I have heard from many people, it has been a while since any checks have been sent out to any of the players. Kevin is busy promoting his weight loss book - which is selling well - so there is money to pay the players. I think its possible that KT will be attending Tammy Faye's funeral this week. So much for his Natural Cures.

 

[!Smorgass Bored]

When The Roll Is Called Up Yonder I'll Be ABSENT

From what I have heard from many people, it has been a while since any checks have been sent out to any of the players. Kevin is busy promoting his weight loss book - which is selling well - so there is money to pay the players.
I think its possible that KT will be attending Tammy Faye's funeral this week. So much for his Natural Cures.

Poor Tammy Faye. When asked if she feared her impending death, she replied, " I don't have any Expiration Date stamped on me."
I say, "even if you don't have an Expiration Date, you should rotate the stock occasionally. That brown stuff in my refridgerator used to be green stuff."
Doug
( poor Tammy Faye.......... at least she never lost her looks.... imo )

 

[Roy Steffensen]

Maybe FedEx screwed up with the July checks?

 

[Str8PoolPlayer]

I Hope this a Good Sign for IPT and the Players ....

I have attended many, many large Tournaments on the West Coast (mostly Las Vegas) and thoroughly enjoyed the IPT Tournament in Reno last year ... The field of players was awesome and the overall decorum of the Match was second-to-none ... Anytime you see Tony Chohan in a Suit Coat, you KNOW it is a Classy Gig ... Even Rafael Martinez, replete with a new suit, "Returned from the Dead" for the IPT in Reno ...
My sincere hope is that all the players receive all their money and the IPT can be securely funded for future matches ... That will be some feat in itself, but MAY be a possibility ...

 

[Tim5000]

Maybe FedEx screwed up with the July checks?

Roy, is that KT's x-ray?