IPT Players Uniting!?

It's happening!! If this gets something off the ground in the way of a players association (I hate the term union:D) It will be great. I hope it's not just a temporary thing and something with more of a foundation for the future.

Out of everything bad something good always happens.

I hope I had something to do with it:D But I'm sure it's mostly due to the IPT failing and the payment for the last tournament;)
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=45119
 
SlimShafty said:
It's happening!! If this gets something off the ground in the way of a players association (I hate the term union:D) It will be great. I hope it's not just a temporary thing and something with more of a foundation for the future.

Out of everything bad something good always happens.

I hope I had something to do with it:D But I'm sure it's mostly due to the IPT failing and the payment for the last tournament;)
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=45119
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I think the IPT was just the catalyst, Blackjack has been trying to put together a Pro Pool Players Organization for the past 4 years. I do not think that what is happening now with the IPT's partial payment of promised monies would be happening had there already been such an organization in place. Then again, KT likely would have never even formed the IPT had such an organization existed...it's much easier to prey on an individual than a collective group.

I, for one, am saddened to see it all go the way it did...there was just so much hope for this tour to work.

Lisa
 
Good lord - one thing is certain - if there's action anywhere on Earth then there are people who know how to find the players to play it. AZ Billiards - this is YOUR TIME TO SHINE.

Please post a notice with information about who needs to be contacted and EACH AND EVERY ONE OF US needs to make sure that the people we know gets the information.

Print out 30 copies and take several to every pool room where an IPT pro might be. Let's make sure that the players are inundated with the right info so that they can unite. Let's help this group to assemble everyone's information and make sure it's backed up.

This much we can do.

Let us NOT allow any IPT player to flounder alone without the counsel of his or her peers. Someone please put the relevant information that is needed on this forum so that it's here to be referenced and disseminated. Surely that can be done.

Give me a phone number - an email address, a postal address, whatever and I will make sure the players I know get that information. If they get it from other sources then great - lets have 30 layers of redundancy when it comes to getting the correct information out to where it needs to be in the quickest possible amount of time.
 
as far as the qualifiers go the list is on ipt web site and players can call the pool room owners and let them know whats going on so the players there will think twice before putting up 2000 . i will let the folks around here know whats happened so far .

the players should definatlely not settle for a penny less . because if they do there is now way the tour will go on . not that it will anyway but if they stick to there guns and can aford to wait then justice will be served in time . if after court costs and lawyers they only get 1/9 of what they erned at least it will go to the lawyers and not kt. then justice will be served and he will be exposed and his life disrupted because it will take years . and there is a chance the top 100 will also get to sue for 100,000 and come out way ahead .

if they settle then they lose more than just money and justice is not served :( mark tadd
 
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Roadie said:
Good lord - one thing is certain - if there's action anywhere on Earth then there are people who know how to find the players to play it. AZ Billiards - this is YOUR TIME TO SHINE.

Please post a notice with information about who needs to be contacted and EACH AND EVERY ONE OF US needs to make sure that the people we know gets the information.

Print out 30 copies and take several to every pool room where an IPT pro might be. Let's make sure that the players are inundated with the right info so that they can unite. Let's help this group to assemble everyone's information and make sure it's backed up.

This much we can do.

Let us NOT allow any IPT player to flounder alone without the counsel of his or her peers. Someone please put the relevant information that is needed on this forum so that it's here to be referenced and disseminated. Surely that can be done.

Give me a phone number - an email address, a postal address, whatever and I will make sure the players I know get that information. If they get it from other sources then great - lets have 30 layers of redundancy when it comes to getting the correct information out to where it needs to be in the quickest possible amount of time.
Click to expand...

Perfect! That is what is needed at this stage.
 
Roadie said:
Good lord - one thing is certain - if there's action anywhere on Earth then there are people who know how to find the players to play it. AZ Billiards - this is YOUR TIME TO SHINE.

Please post a notice with information about who needs to be contacted and EACH AND EVERY ONE OF US needs to make sure that the people we know gets the information.

Print out 30 copies and take several to every pool room where an IPT pro might be. Let's make sure that the players are inundated with the right info so that they can unite. Let's help this group to assemble everyone's information and make sure it's backed up.

This much we can do.

Let us NOT allow any IPT player to flounder alone without the counsel of his or her peers. Someone please put the relevant information that is needed on this forum so that it's here to be referenced and disseminated. Surely that can be done.

Give me a phone number - an email address, a postal address, whatever and I will make sure the players I know get that information. If they get it from other sources then great - lets have 30 layers of redundancy when it comes to getting the correct information out to where it needs to be in the quickest possible amount of time.
Click to expand...

Hey Roadie,

Thanks, we are going to take you up on that offer!

I have several things that I hope you all can help me with.

1. I still need current email addresses for these players:


Chris Bartram
George Breedlove
Charlie Bryant
Alejandro Carvajal
Kim Davenport
Buddy Hall


If you know them, please have them email me at rackmsuckr@aol.com with the correct email address and phone numbers.

2. The list of qualifiers that competed in the WO that won money that I compiled somehow comes out to 54 instead of 50. Anybody know why? I know Rempe and Hall had substitutes, but not sure where the other ones came from.

Akikumo Toshikawa x
Antonio Lining x
Ben Davies x
Ben Nunan x

Chia-Ching Wu x
Chris Melling x
Cliff Joyner x
Danny Harriman x
David Alcoberro x
David Broxson x
David Matlock
Davide Pascasi x
Dmitri Jungo x
Frankie Hernandez x
Furuta Kazuo x
Garrett Schaar x

Goh Takami x
Hiroshi Takenaka x
Hsia Hui-Kai x
Hung Ming Chu x

James Walden x
Jasmin Ouschan x
Jason Kirkwood x
Jayson Shaw x
Jeff Beckley x
Jeff Melton x
Joern Kaplan x
Jon Kucharo x

Kevin Becker x
Larry Nevel x
Lee Heuwagen x
Marco Marquez x
Michael Schmidt
Oezer Bulunmaz x
Rafael Martinez x
Ramil Gallego x

Rodolfo Luat
Roman Hybler x
Ronnie Alcano x
Ronnie Wiseman x
Sandor Tot x
Santos Sambajon x
Steve Moore x
Takeshi Okumura x
Tang Hoa x
Teddy Garrahan x
Thomas Engert x
Toni Judet x



5. Please help me get these qualifiers' email addresses and phone numbers. If you know them or know how to get in touch with them, please have them email me.

Thanks in advance, everyone!!
 
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Johnnyt said:
I wouldn't be surprised if Gerda Hofstatter was a big part of this. Smart lady. Johnnyt
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I don't follow women's pool and have only been under the same roof at the same time as Gerda twice to my knowledge. Because of this, I'm only finding out what it seems most in the pool world already knew.... Those players that Deno said was his best friends.... he was talking about Gerda. From what I've learned today, they're very good friends to the point that he went to her graduation last yr or whenever it was that she graduated from College.

This being said, I highly doubt Gerda will be involved in the player union. At this point, I only have the names of some of the people that are in it, I haven't heard of the folks not in it yet. I would venture a guess that Gerda will not be in it which also leads me to believe that Allison will not partake. Again, this is simply my opinion and I could be wrong. When the list is made, don't be surprised if Gerda, Allison, and anyone that they might be able to persuade, are not on the list.


Roadie said:
Please post a notice with information about who needs to be contacted and EACH AND EVERY ONE OF US needs to make sure that the people we know gets the information.
Click to expand...
It is my understanding that a list will be coming out in the near future that contains the following... Those in the union, those not in the union, and those that they have not been able to contact yet because they do not have the contact info.
 
Linda, from the qualifier list I've been in contact with Steve Moore who will be calling me back. (he was playing at the time) I should also be hearing from Larry Nevel, and can contact Danny Harriman.
 
I was involved in a class action reverse discrimination suit in Chicago that dragged on and on for about 6 years. We all paid our attorney $125 up front (this was back in 1985 I believe). And every now and then she would ask for another check for $125. Eventually it went to trial and we lost. To add insult to injury we had to pay the State's Attorneys fees or costs to the tune of $250 each. Of course a settlement would have given each of us a couple hundred thousand. For $5,000 it just is not worth the aggravation to me. Take the offer.

Every other reverse discrimination suit I have heard of has won. We must have had one dumb attorney.

Anyway, with that in mind I say take the money and run.

Also keep in mind that as of now I really don't think that KT and the IPT have done anything legally wrong. So far it is just a late payment of wages/prizes. 55 days is pretty late but still it is only late. Nothing is cancelled, just postponed. Same can be said about the prize money, you are not cheated out of it, just owed it.

I imagine all the players have sent the IPT notice that they do expect payment.

Good luck with your attorneys and if any of you need that $500 retainer fee for the attorneys I am sure that Timberly will provide it for you.

Did I say that I would take the money and run? Remember, that is what I would do, the players involved should do what is best for themselves.

Also, I would think that if you are down at the bottom and only owed $5,000 then you can handle that yourself in small claims court. Of course the problem then becomes, what court? In which State?

Jake
 
idea that may work

I can within the hour finishe the registration and hosting of

www.professionalpoolplayersassociation.com

post there a password page that will allow the players to go there and update contact information through a form that can then be emailed to someone that is helping head this charge and can also be used to update everyone.........

If you feel this is a good idea say so and it shall be done.....
 
Timberly said:
I don't follow women's pool and have only been under the same roof at the same time as Gerda twice to my knowledge. Because of this, I'm only finding out what it seems most in the pool world already knew.... Those players that Deno said was his best friends.... he was talking about Gerda. From what I've learned today, they're very good friends to the point that he went to her graduation last yr or whenever it was that she graduated from College.

This being said, I highly doubt Gerda will be involved in the player union. At this point, I only have the names of some of the people that are in it, I haven't heard of the folks not in it yet. I would venture a guess that Gerda will not be in it which also leads me to believe that Allison will not partake. Again, this is simply my opinion and I could be wrong. When the list is made, don't be surprised if Gerda, Allison, and anyone that they might be able to persuade, are not on the list.



It is my understanding that a list will be coming out in the near future that contains the following... Those in the union, those not in the union, and those that they have not been able to contact yet because they do not have the contact info.
Click to expand...


Ha Ha Ha Ha

Do you really believe that some of the IPT players have not been paid for Reno?

With the stipulation to keep quiet.

One of them may have even become a mole. It is always nice to have someone on the inside.
 
It's not about taking the offer for the short term gain. This should be about putting the players in a postion that this issue never comes up again. Whatever is decided about the single issue of the money owed, let it be collectively decided. Then let the players have the unity to collectively bargain with ANYONE who wishes to have use of their talents for their entertainment and commercial purposes. Let's be totally honest here. Promoters who stage large events with ticket sales and television coverage are doing so in hopes of turning a profit. This organization should make sure that it is in cooperation and not at the expense of the very people on whom the event is built.
 
goget'um said:
I can within the hour finishe the registration and hosting of

www.professionalpoolplayersassociation.com

post there a password page that will allow the players to go there and update contact information through a form that can then be emailed to someone that is helping head this charge and can also be used to update everyone.........

If you feel this is a good idea say so and it shall be done.....
Click to expand...

Thanks for the help, but we don't really need that much. If they can contact me, all I have to do is update the database. Thanks again.
 
The new MIA list - please see if you can help track down email addresses and phone numbers for these IPT players. Thank you!

Chris Bartram
George Breedlove
Alejandro Carvajal
Kim Davenport
Buddy Hall

Akikumo Toshikawa x
Antonio Lining x
Ben Davies x
Ben Nunan x
Chia-Ching Wu x
Chris Melling x
Cliff Joyner x
David Broxson x
David Matlock
Frankie Hernandez x
Furuta Kazuo x
Garrett Schaar x
Goh Takami x
Hiroshi Takenaka x
Hsia Hui-Kai x
Hung Ming Chu x
James Walden x
Jason Kirkwood x
Jayson Shaw x
Jeff Beckley x
Jeff Melton x
Jon Kucharo x
Larry Nevel x
Lee Heuwagen x
Marco Marquez x
Oezer Bulunmaz x
Rafael Martinez x
Ramil Gallego x
Rodolfo Luat
Ronnie Alcano x
Ronnie Wiseman x
Santos Sambajon x
Steve Moore x
Takeshi Okumura x
Tang Hoa x
Teddy Garrahan x
Toni Judet x
 
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<<His belief, as is mine, is that KT has it but doesn't want to pay it, even though he stated that he would fund the tour with his own money for 2 years. We believe KT has the money, he just doesn't want to part with it.>>

Hi Timberly...First let me again compliment you on your relentless efforts on behalf of the players. There is no question but that you have acted as a catalyst for aggressive action. You go girl.

As for KT's PERSONAL finances there are two issues..

1. Does he have the money and
2. Can the players access it.

As far as having it, I am a little surprised that anyone other than KT's closest advisers would have any clue about his wealth...or lack thereof. Even my closest friend have no idea what my net worth is and I think that it true in most cases.

But what is known for a FACT is that just a few years ago, the Federal Trade Commission busted KT for false advertising and he consented to a settlement wherein the FTC took his California home and his "luxury automobile" in lieu of cash to settle a $2 million fine. (don't hold me to the exact sum).

Logically, people don't give up their homes to pay such a debt if they have the cash. But the real eye opener was taking his CAR along with the house. It suggests that he had NO cash whatsoever...because if he did they wouldn't have taken his car!

But the other issue is getting at his personal finances. I have commented on that before so won't do so again but getting at corporate executives personally by "piercing the corporate veil is NOT easy.

Finally, I guess I'm a little disappointed that the player you refer to dismissed my post with a "so what." But oh well...people have to learn their own lessons in life...and anyone who thinks that suing a man like KT is going to be a cake walk...or anything less than a multi-YEAR saga, has a lesson yet to learn.

Regards,
Jim
 
av84 said:
I am a little surprised that anyone other than KT's closest advisers would have any clue about his wealth...or lack thereof. Even my closest friend have no idea what my net worth is and I think that it true in most cases.


Finally, I guess I'm a little disappointed that the player you refer to dismissed my post with a "so what." But oh well...people have to learn their own lessons in life...and anyone who thinks that suing a man like KT is going to be a cake walk...or anything less than a multi-YEAR saga, has a lesson yet to learn.

Regards,
Jim
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You're correct, none of us know his wealth or lack thereof. It's simply speculation based on the money he has paid to date as far as the IPT is concerned, and the fact that sadly the natural cures book sold so well.

The "so what" comment wasn't in the context of shrugging his shoulders and saying that. It was more of a "my response is... so what" and then he went on with a barrage of reasons and examples to counter the post you made.

I can't convey the tone of his voice over the computer to get it to come across the way it was said. ;)
 
Timberly...<<Again, this is simply my opinion and I could be wrong. When the list is made, don't be surprised if Gerda, Allison, and anyone that they might be able to persuade, are not on the list.>>

I happen to know AF, GH and Deno. I am not going to speak for anyone because it is not my place to do so but I don't think there is any chance whatsoever, that AF/GF would go on any sort of campaign to dissuade other players from organizing for their own protection and benefit.

Nor do I think that they would fail to participate in an attack against the IPT IF THEY FELT THE IPT DESERVED BEING ATTACKED...simply because of their friendship with Deno. DENO does NOT owe anyone any money.

He may well be deserving of criticism for his role in perpetuating false excuses but he doesn't owe the money...the IPT and/or KT do.

But as I have suggested in other posts, you have to keep in mind that there are DRAMATIC differences between players who are owed HUGE sums of money and those who are owed small sums.

AF/GH are in the later category and their zeal to become involved in what is going to be a VERY long...VERY bitter...VERY emotional...VERY devisive process may be quite a bit less than others who are owed vastly greater sums.

Again, I don't speak for them...have not initiated ANY discussions with them on this subject. But they know I have decades (too many) of experience along these lines and that I am here for them whenever they might want to have a chat.

I doubt that you intended it but your post sort of suggested an "enemy within" theme and IMHO there is ZERO chance that is the case.

If they don't want to play...they may sit this one out...I have no idea one way or the other....but they are NOT going to try to sabotage any efforts among the IPT players to unify......POSSIBLY they may take the position that settling rather than suing has some merit and should be VERY seriously considered...maybe they have read my posts on that subject and have not said..."So what."


Regards,
Jim
 
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