Is a Short Backswing the Teacher?

I don't agree with the short backstroke theory ( unless the cueball is frozen or almost frozen on the rail or soft shots ).

A long smooth back stroke in line with the stroking line is a powerful tool.
 
The short backstroke has its place. If you 2 balls to be played in consecutive order in close proximity to each other requiring minimal movement of the rock between shots it's necessary, a full stroke there will hurt you, I see players make this mistake all the time. It comes up very often in 14-1 & 1 pocket where your position play is often in close quarters.
 
Mitchxout said:
First of all I'm sorry to hear about the Beard's passing. RIP.

Lately, I've been getting beat by "ball jabbers." Since practicing a little with a shorter backswing, my accuracy, especially with centerball has improved.

The world is upside down,
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I experimented with so many strokes in practice and in money games; All boils down to the tip not hitting the intended contact point at CB, and causes squirt/swerve; with LD shaft and long bridge you somewhat protected, but CB might not have the intended action, but at least it is heading in the intended direction. Elbow hand muscles during active warm up motion are usually straight back and forth, the problem is when you pause, there is some time, it varies between players, before muscles reset, 1 sec, 2..etc, if you pause too long, your backward swing tends to tuck toward your body as you pull it, as a result, tip hits CB off center at forward stroke and cause a squirt; this where you want to have shorter stroke, it helps minimize the tucking, or your thumb getting stuck in your pocket at forward motion!! IMO, changing your stance helps the stroke, rather than changing the stroke; although, some long thin cuts , key shots, might require more accuracy than others, short stroke could be needed, since potting would be the only objective for such shots.
 
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The short backstroke is good for shots where you need to be dead accurate, but has the tradeoff of being more difficult to reach higher speeds and being quite different timing wise. I tend to use a short stroke on very soft shots and shots that are jacked up and it helps a lot.
 
Masayoshi said:
The short backstroke is good for shots where you need to be dead accurate, but has the tradeoff of being more difficult to reach higher speeds and being quite different timing wise. I tend to use a short stroke on very soft shots and shots that are jacked up and it helps a lot.
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I've seen players generate plenty of power with compact strokes. Shannon the Cannon, if you take notice, barely takes the cue back. Shannon is smoother than some other short jabbers, like Grady for instance, Short, nonetheless.
 
Mitchxout said:
I've seen players generate plenty of power with compact strokes. Shannon the Cannon, if you take notice, barely takes the cue back. Shannon is smoother than some other short jabbers, like Grady for instance, Short, nonetheless.
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Tommy Kennedy, too. When I see Tommy Kennedy or Allen Hopkins shoot, I can't for the life of me figure out how they can get any power out of that stroke...but they do.
 
West Point 1987 said:
Tommy Kennedy, too. When I see Tommy Kennedy or Allen Hopkins shoot, I can't for the life of me figure out how they can get any power out of that stroke...but they do.
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Grady Matthews as well. Almost no practice strokes and very small or nonexistent backstroke.

-dj
 
Jab Stroke

A local that I get to play some on occasion and a jabby little preshot routine that he uses, its like jab, jab, jab,,,,pause jab, jab jab....then he finds where he wants to be then this stroke that is always the same with a beautiful follow through. Its awesome and he is so on the money with it.

He uses the jab to test his forward trajectory then releases it on you perfectly and gets awesome shape.
 
A long bridge and stroke look pretty
A shorter bridge and stroke may not look as pretty, but is easier to control.

With a short stroke it's all in the delivery, as is a long stroke, you have to be smooth. A jab stroke is another story.

I use a medium to long bridge with most times a shorter delivery stroke (Not a Jab, not pulling back too far) delivering smooth.
I can do anything with the cue ball; control all speeds from zero to 100, with accuracy.

It's not difficult to do at all, like anything else it takes practice.

Think about this, you have an 11 inch bridge and want to move the cue ball 3 inches with follow.
You pull back far and have to control mass to the cue ball for a 3 inch roll on the cue ball, seems like overkill to me. Just shorten the bridge, pull back 3 inches and you come out like a champ.

Smooth delivery is the key to all strokes.

Not everyone can jab them like Alan, not everyone can long stroke them like Shane or the Pinoys. That is the way they learned and they have perfected it.

If you are in the learning stage or experimenting to get better, I would definitely try and shorten up and be smooth as smooth can be.

Follow through is more important for the beginning of the stroke not the end,
 
The cue ball does not know or care what you did on your back swing. Take a look at the top 50 players and you will see 50 different ways to get pool balls in holes. JB
 
acceleration and accuracy......a positive "side-effect"

Ironically it's the other way around. Trying to create a long, extended follow through causes deceleration. Creating a shorter follow through (when done correctly) causes acceleration and accuracy......a positive "side-effect" - 'The Game is the Teacher'



one stroke said:
Really I always have been of the mind set if you try shortening your follow through it leads to decelerating stroke or jab stroke ,, some guys in darts including me don't take it back far at all but have a full follow thru ,, kinda like a quarter back throwing from the ear

1
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DTL said:
Very true. Nobody's ever made a ball with a practice stroke either. It's from the moment of the beginning of the final forward stroke up until tip contact with the CB that determines the outcome.
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Well.... you just said it better than I did.:thumbup: JB
 
John Brumback said:
The cue ball does not know or care what you did on your back swing. Take a look at the top 50 players and you will see 50 different ways to get pool balls in holes. JB
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It's ok to pull off line then , then go back to the right line ?
 
this may be disguised at times (I'll explain this at another time)

When we were in London I shared an apartment with Johnny Archer - we spent every night talking about the next day's strategy AND professional pool techniques. We share many of the same philosophies about competition, such as lowering expectations and raising preparation....also it was his physical knowledge of the game that impressed me and provided me proven insight from one of the all time greats.

I ask him what he did to prepare his stroke for a tournament and he said "I practice what's necessary to make sure I'm completing my backswing".... I immediately could relate, one of my first mentors, "Omaha John" would take the cue back almost out of his fingers....and many of the greatest players I've seen make the tip disappear at the transition point of their backswing.

Playing pool at the highest levels has many exceptions to what's commonly taught. One of these "commonly taught words of wisdumb" is to extend your follow through and limit your backswing..... many champions do is the opposite, they extend their backswing and limit their follow through although this may be disguised at times (I'll explain this at another time). 'The Game is the Teacher'

"in pocket billiards, if it feels right, it's probably wrong" - The Game is the Teacher'
 
CJ Wiley said:
When we were in London I shared an apartment with Johnny Archer - we spent every night talking about the next day's strategy AND professional pool techniques. We share many of the same philosophies about competition, such as lowering expectations and raising preparation....also it was his physical knowledge of the game that impressed me and provided me proven insight from one of the all time greats.

I ask him what he did to prepare his stroke for a tournament and he said "I practice what's necessary to make sure I'm completing my backswing".... I immediately could relate, one of my first mentors, "Omaha John" would take the cue back almost out of his fingers....and many of the greatest players I've seen make the tip disappear at the transition point of their backswing.

Playing pool at the highest levels has many exceptions to what's commonly taught. One of these "commonly taught words of wisdumb" is to extend your follow through and limit your backswing..... many champions do is the opposite, they extend their backswing and limit their follow through although this may be disguised at times (I'll explain this at another time). 'The Game is the Teacher'

"in pocket billiards, if it feels right, it's probably wrong" - The Game is the Teacher'
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Care to back up that statement? I don't know of any instructors that teach that. So who are you referring to as teaching that?
 
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CJ Wiley said:
When we were in London I shared an apartment with Johnny Archer - we spent every night talking about the next day's strategy AND professional pool techniques. We share many of the same philosophies about competition, such as lowering expectations and raising preparation....also it was his physical knowledge of the game that impressed me and provided me proven insight from one of the all time greats.

I ask him what he did to prepare his stroke for a tournament and he said "I practice what's necessary to make sure I'm completing my backswing".... I immediately could relate, one of my first mentors, "Omaha John" would take the cue back almost out of his fingers....and many of the greatest players I've seen make the tip disappear at the transition point of their backswing.

Playing pool at the highest levels has many exceptions to what's commonly taught. One of these "commonly taught words of wisdumb" is to extend your follow through and limit your backswing..... many champions do is the opposite, they extend their backswing and limit their follow through although this may be disguised at times (I'll explain this at another time). 'The Game is the Teacher'

"in pocket billiards, if it feels right, it's probably wrong" - The Game is the Teacher'
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Many have extended prelim strokes then shorten up on delivery.
Just watch Alex Pagulayan , majority of the time, short delivery.
There is no disguise, it is clear to see
 
Mitchxout said:
I've seen players generate plenty of power with compact strokes. Shannon the Cannon, if you take notice, barely takes the cue back. Shannon is smoother than some other short jabbers, like Grady for instance, Short, nonetheless.
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I didn't say it was impossible, just more difficult.
 
Neil said:
Care to back up that statement? I don't know of any instructors that teach that. So who are you referring to as teaching that?
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Not sure why CJ stated that, i will wait to see what his answer would be, i hope he retract his statement.
 
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