Is the Object Ball just a "Mirrored Reflection" of the Cue Ball

[CJ Wiley]

Banks are a mirror reflection of straight in, or cut shots

Like you, JB wasn't showing disrespect. He's said openly on here (paraphrasing one of his recent post about BHE) "I don't know what you're talking about, I just play pool". Many pros don't know/can't explain how/why, etc. This was very evident on one of the prematch TAR podcast with Bustamante. Was anything PJ wrote not accurate?

Banking, like ball pocketing requires a system to increase the margin of error. I use TOI and/or TOO (spin) to do this on regular shots, John "holds" the banks to achieve the same outcome.

It's really about the "approach angle," like in golf they use "draw and fade" to create the same increased margin of error. In tennis they use over-spin, under-spin, and some side-spin on serves.

Both ways requires is to over-cut the shots slightly, then force it into the center of the pocket. Ask John and I'm sure he'll tell you that he favors a side of the pocket, although, he's going to to favor the opposite side for banks than I do for regular shots. Banks are a mirror reflection of straight in, or cut shots, so this does fit in nicely with the theme of this thread.

 

[John Brumback]

Sorry CJ

I didn't mean to change the theme of your thread. I actually learned a little something from some of your insight a few posts back. Carry on sir. John B.

 

[duckie]

Fair enough.All I'm saying is that I have never in my life seen where all that science mumbo jumbo has ever helped one person become a top pool player, have you? If you have I wish you would name him or her please.

IMO most would be way better off to just play and do what the top pool players do and be done with it.

It just seems to me that you would rather argue with what top pool players say than to improve your own game. Am I right or wrong? I've been wrong before. John B.

And what if what they say is just wrong? Like oh lets see......like increasing the margin of error of a shot. Impossible to do, yet its still gets banter about, even after showing proof of it being impossible. This is just not wanting to learn.

Do you want people to just blindly follow what you say?

Just because you have never experienced someone that from knowing "what is going on under the hood" ,so to speak, has helped to become a top player does not mean those player do not exist. It is your limited experience in life that is limiting you to believe this way. It is also very arrogant to make fun of those that do.

Your thinking is.....It does me no good, I see no value in it, therefore it is useless.

Oh, and don't go pulling that "does not want to spend the time working on my game" bullshit with me, cause you'd be wrong, very, very wrong.

 

[Neil]

Fair enough.All I'm saying is that I have never in my life seen where all that science mumbo jumbo has ever helped one person become a top pool player, have you? If you have I wish you would name him or her please.

IMO most would be way better off to just play and do what the top pool players do and be done with it.

It just seems to me that you would rather argue with what top pool players say than to improve your own game. Am I right or wrong? I've been wrong before. John B.

John, a lot of the info wasn't even available when today's top players learned the game. Ever wonder why there are so many really good players today than ever before in the history of the game? It's because knowledge flows much freer.

That said, not everyone learns the same way, and not everyone wants to be a top player, but just be better than they currently are. And, not everyone has the time to hit a million balls. Some people on here can take the how's and why's and extrapolate from that and come up with something they couldn't do before. Knowledge has many paths, and one shouldn't knock other methods of learning just because they don't know them or never needed them. But, knowledge given should be factual information. Because if it's not, help isn't given, but hindrance instead.

 

[John Brumback]

And what if what they say is just wrong? Like oh lets see......like increasing the margin of error of a shot. Impossible to do, yet its still gets banter about, even after showing proof of it being impossible. This is just not wanting to learn.

Do you want people to just blindly follow what you say?

Just because you have never experienced someone that from knowing "what is going on under the hood" ,so to speak, has helped to become a top player does not mean those player do not exist. It is your limited experience in life that is limiting you to believe this way. It is also very arrogant to make fun of those that do.

Your thinking is.....It does me no good, I see no value in it, therefore it is useless.

Oh, and don't go pulling that "does not want to spend the time working on my game" bullshit with me, cause you'd be wrong, very, very wrong.

Nah,it's just that I have never seen a top "science type " player. Believe me,I have been looking for years. Sorry to have ruffled your feathers.I see your little pic thing with all them lines and stuff.Are you a top player? Just wondering.If you are I would probably know your name,but I aint never heard of a player named ducky. John B.

 

[DTL]

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[John Brumback]

The Americans dominated pool forever up until the 90's. Its because of the above attitude that they, except for a few, are now considered 2nd rate by the pool world today. Little did they know that beginning in the early 80's the Europeans started training with all that mumbo, jumbo science crap that produced the players that are now spanking us Americans these days..........Souquet, Hohmann, Appleton, Feijen, Boyes, Shaw, and many others (Chinese). Ask Alex Lely and Ralf Eckert what they think about the science stuff. Yeah, the pattern is very clear indeed.

PS: oh, and don't forget about the snooker players (they all just play by feel, right? lol).

PS#2: the worst thing you can do is to come on here and talk down to us "non players" or to those that "can't play" (gave you the benefit of the doubt earlier).

Sorry but I'm not buying that reasoning about them vs us. I'm trying to help all I can become better pool players.Thanks for the lecture though. John B.

PS: Does ("anyone") of them guys want to try to spank me playin some banks? Some on your list have bought my dvds too:thumbup:

PS# 2 I think that you are a very good player,even top player or close to it.

 

[DTL]

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[Patrick Johnson]

I have never seen a top "science type " player.

Don't beat yourself up about it. Being a top pool player means devoting your life to it, usually from an early age - there's no time for book learnin'.

pj <- not sure what a "science type" player looks like
chgo

 

[John Brumback]

As SJD said, bank pool is for players who can't make 'em straight-in :grin-square:.....just kidding.

Not many people gambling at bank pool these days and only one real big tournament a year so if you want to sell more of them DVDs you need to be nice on here...wink, wink, hint, hint. Ya know them fishing lures are expensive!

I quit fishin for them green carp, I get my own bait with a cast net

Aint it funny how there's alot of pool players from KY that can bank better than they can shoot a ball straight in.

Knowing how and the best way to bank sure helps alot when playing one pocket, John B.

 

[John Brumback]

Don't beat yourself up about it. Being a top pool player means devoting your life to it, usually from an early age - there's no time for book learnin'.

pj <- not sure what a "science type" player looks like
chgo

Good come back and well played PJ:thumbup: John B.

 

[BeiberLvr]

Sorry but I'm not buying that reasoning about them vs us. I'm trying to help all I can become better pool players.Thanks for the lecture though. John B.

PS: Does ("anyone") of them guys want to try to spank me playin some banks? Some on your list have bought my dvds too:thumbup:

PS# 2 I think that you are a very good player,even top player or close to it.

Banks isn't popular outside of America, and considering there's really only one major banks tournament, I'd say it's hardly popular here.

 

[Mikjary]

Banks isn't popular outside of America, and considering there's really only one major banks tournament, I'd say it's hardly popular here.

I grew up in Chicago. We played a lot of banks. Some guys that needed a spot in 9 ball could run out on you playing banks.

I lived in Florida for a few years and can't remember ever matching up playing banks.

Best,
Mike

 

[Patrick Johnson]

I grew up in Chicago. We played a lot of banks. Some guys that needed a spot in 9 ball could run out on you playing banks.

I lived in Florida for a few years and can't remember ever matching up playing banks.

Best,
Mike

There are regular banks tournaments here - some of the guys have played before. I've even played, just to donate of course.

pj
chgo

 

[Mikjary]

There are regular banks tournaments here - some of the guys have played before. I've even played, just to donate of course.

pj
chgo

We used to play short rack banks ring games, 5 or more handed. Every 3 banks was a payday. High score was another for $5 and $10. B&R was worth $25 a man. Saw it done more than once.

Best,
Mike

 

[Patrick Johnson]

We used to play short rack banks ring games, 5 or more handed. Every 3 banks was a payday. High score was another for $5 and $10. B&R was worth $25 a man. Saw it done more than once.

Best,
Mike

In my pool room there's a bunch of bankers who play nothing else and don't invite anybody else to play, so they think they're the only ones in the room who bank. We had a small shortrack tourney and the first one of them I came up against I ran out on him from the break (I don't do that very often). He wasn't amused.

Another guy from the banker group came in second, but Tommy Karabatsos heard about our little get-together, came scavenging and took it off.

pj
chgo

 

[BeiberLvr]

I grew up in Chicago. We played a lot of banks. Some guys that needed a spot in 9 ball could run out on you playing banks.

I lived in Florida for a few years and can't remember ever matching up playing banks.

Best,
Mike

There's a few players down here that play strong banks.

 

[Mikjary]

...Tommy Karabatsos heard about our little get-together, came scavenging and took it off...

Oh, no! You didn't feed him, did you? LOL There's a name from the past. It was always drama matching up with him. Good player, but the sharking and whining was tough to fade. If you were up at all, you kept hearing this nasally, whiny voice, barely audible in the background about how this couldn't be happening.

Best,
Mike

 

[Mikjary]

There's a few players down here that play strong banks.

No doubt. I just never matched up with anybody playing banks. I enjoy the game and would've liked to meet a few of them. Played a lot of bank the 8, though.

Best,
Mike

 

[DTL]

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