Issues Blowing Up At The Tornado Open

Pool never stopped being great

It needed time to get rid of the frauds and fakes

JAM said:
Maybe a better approach is to come with a list of suggestions to improve the event. A promoter, especially since this is the first time out of the gate for this event, just may welcome constructive criticism on how to improve next year.

To rip the tournament apart in shreds doesn't help anyone. Come with ways to improve it next time around. I'm sure Vivian herself recognizes areas that need improvement.

Let's make pool great again! :cool:
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John Disque said:
Wow! Is this satire or sarcasm?
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I don't believe it's satire, at least for some players.

In a TAR podcast, Corey spoke about how he had been broke sometimes as a pool player, but he loved the lifestyle. He was happy that he had never had a day job in his life.

Grady Mathews spoke may times about blowing money. He only half jokingly said he and some other players were not comfortable until they had blown their money.

Even Justin Collett has spoken about this. During the commentary of TAR 20 he said he was pretty much broke at the time, but he enjoyed traveling and meeting so many interesting people. He liked it more than the previous factory job he had for years.

None of this is putting pool players down; it's just a lifestyle choice some make.
 
Your still around the site. Keep the health going.



JAM said:
Another pool player knocker. Some things never change. :)

For every pool player who is demeaned and ridiculed on AzBilliards, there is at least a hundred knockers who are, in reality, wannabe pro players. It's must more fun to bash the pros behind a computer monitor.
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I wish those tar guys stuck around they were really popular


jeffj2h said:
I don't believe it's satire, at least for some players.

In a TAR podcast, Corey spoke about how he had been broke sometimes as a pool player, but he loved the lifestyle. He was happy that he had never had a day job in his life.

Grady Mathews spoke may times about blowing money. He only half jokingly said he and some other players were not comfortable until they had blown their money.

Even Justin Collett has spoken about this. During the commentary of TAR 20 he said he was pretty much broke at the time, but he enjoyed traveling and meeting so many interesting people. He liked it more than the previous factory job he had for years.

None of this is putting pool players down; it's just a lifestyle choice some make.
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John Disque said:
It's almost hilarious how, when Shane started bringing up this subject people like you said he was not a pro so he had no say in it. THEN - when he won an amateur event the same people screamed that he WAS a pro and didn't qualify to enter.

Which one is it?
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Awesome...way to ignore the point!

You will.fit right in here.
 
The WPBA used to have a policy where if you paid your entry fee and had to cancel, they would refund your entry if they were able to fill the spot. If not, you wouldn't get your money back and your name would remain on the chart. I think that's the most fair way to do things. Nobody would question that type of policy.
 
John Disque said:
It's to the point that it doesn't matter to me anymore.

If the players are going to waffle on their thoughts, run scared and cater to "the way things have been" why should anyone care?

If standing up and being a voice for professional pool means "being attacked by a bunch of kiss-ass league bangers who know nothing about the current state of the sport" why should anyone be their whipping boy with no hope for a better day?

I was inspired to see the players finally standing up and I was even more inspired when the threads were not a relentless attack on their characters. Then it was all deleted.

Months ago Shane Winters posted his concerns about the streams making money off the backs of the players and giving little-to-nothing back to the sport.... He too was relentlessly attacked until he was silenced.

Hundreds of players and fans have said it's time to unite the players and keep them and the sport protected from the countless people continuing to rip them and the sport off.

Then - when it's time to unite they go back to the shadows and participate in the same, boring, dead-end grind.
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Maybe j should not post my opinion since I am one of those kick ass league players that people on here love to denigrate when my opinion does not mirror theirs.

But what the heck...i am.gonna give my opinion anyway.

Having read both posts by Tony it seems to me his first post was typed in the heat of the moment. After speaking to Vivian he later deleted that post and made a second post not quite so negative..


People do it all the time so I dont see why you are brow beating Tony and others for recanting some of their remarks when their tempera have cooled off a little.

I have seen a few references about players being treated rudely yet no one has given examples of how they were treated. I am curious at to why those remarks were made.
 
FranCrimi said:
The WPBA used to have a policy where if you paid your entry fee and had to cancel, they would refund your entry if they were able to fill the spot. If not, you wouldn't get your money back and your name would remain on the chart. I think that's the most fair way to do things. Nobody would question that type of policy.
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I agree and offered this solution.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
 
Only fair way it would seem.. anything less without given advanced notice of should be considered theft.
 
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lorider said:
Maybe j should not post my opinion since I am one of those kick ass league players that people on here love to denigrate when my opinion does not mirror theirs.

But what the heck...i am.gonna give my opinion anyway.

Having read both posts by Tony it seems to me his first post was typed in the heat of the moment. After speaking to Vivian he later deleted that post and made a second post not quite so negative..


People do it all the time so I dont see why you are brow beating Tony and others for recanting some of their remarks when their tempera have cooled off a little.

I have seen a few references about players being treated rudely yet no one has given examples of how they were treated. I am curious at to why those remarks were made.
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--- I am not brow-beating Tony. I have the utmost respect for him and his talent and his guts to speak out about the injustice in this sport.

This thread was created BEFORE he deleted the post. -- there was a 3rd one, which he wound up deleting. You OBVIOUSLY didn't read it. /// It was commented on by more a dozen players who were actually there at the tornado open. -- Many of them didn't know if they had cashed and couldn't get an answer from the director.
 
In-fact tony-himself didn't know if he cashed and he said that Vivian said, "If he did cash it would be a very small amount of money and she would send it to him."
 
JAM said:
Maybe a better approach is to come with a list of suggestions to improve the event. A promoter, especially since this is the first time out of the gate for this event, just may welcome constructive criticism on how to improve next year.

To rip the tournament apart in shreds doesn't help anyone. Come with ways to improve it next time around. I'm sure Vivian herself recognizes areas that need improvement.

Let's make pool great again! :cool:
Click to expand...


This is the 3rd time she's had the "Tornado Open," and having been to the last two, I gotta agree that she has no business running or promoting a tournament

The last two were some of the most poorly run tourneys i've ever been to and it's true that she shows favoritism, and is rude to a lot of the players

The two tournament directors she's had were jokes, they knew nothing about pool, not how to run a tourney nor the rules to the games, they were just cheap labor

I also know for a fact that Vivian has been told about the areas that need to be improved, but she doesn't care, she thinks it's a personal attack on her or jealousy or something, looks like she'll milk out this "Tornado Open" until no one shows up anymore

And i heard many pros say they wouldn't show up for the next one when i went to the one in San Antonio, but it's hard to pass up "100k added" when your job is pool playing

I'm glad this farce is finally being called what it is, only took 3 different events in 3 different cities for the pros and pool fans to wake up

And matter of fact, looks like it's gotten worse, now she took this guy's $550 and left him out of the bracket, I don't even have words for that, not polite enough for the forums at least

but maybe next year she'll add 200k and they'll flock over again

I, for one, didn't enjoy the last 2 and would never go to any tournament she put on ever again
 
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Here's what Happened...

Lots of players had questions about the pay-out for the men's event. (Which was stated to have $25k of the $100k added to it).

On the Tornado website it said the $25,000-guaranteed was based on a full field of 128 players BUT..... on much of the literature, pool-news articles and fliers it didn't say a damn thing about the GUARANTEED money being based on 128 players and most of them were going by that - not the website which they never visited.

When the tournament was winding down and players were getting knocked out they had questions.... like "What's the payout and am I in the money?"

Their questions were not being answered and many were reporting that they were being treated badly for even asking.

Other people had other questions such as: "Why is the women's $25k based on 64 players and the men's $25k based on 128 players?"

Then it was snowballing - There was no arguing - just a bunch of pro players and up-and-coming players showing their concern and frustration.

BTW - They wound up adding $13,600 to the men's pro event.
 
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John Disque said:
Lots of players had questions about the pay-out for the men's event. (Which was stated to have $25k of the $100k added to it).

On the Tornado website it said the $25,000-guaranteed was based on a full field of 128 players BUT..... on much of the literature, pool-news articles and fliers it didn't say a damn thing about the GUARANTEED money being based on 128 players and most of them were going by that - not the website which they never visited.

When the tournament was winding down and players were getting knocked out they had questions.... like "What's the payout and am I in the money?"

Their questions were not being answered and many were reporting that they were being treated badly for even asking.

Other people had other questions such as: "Why is the women's $25k based on 64 players and the men's $25k based on 128 players?"



Then it was snowballing - There was no arguing - just a bunch of pro players and up-and-coming players showing their concern and frustration.

BTW - They wound up adding $13,600 to the men's pro event.
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Do you know how many men entered?
 
eddie8842 said:
The two tournament directors she's had were jokes, they knew nothing about pool, not how to run a tourney nor the rules to the games, they were just cheap labor

I also know for a fact that Vivian has been told about the areas that need to be improved, but she doesn't care, she thinks it's a personal attack on her or jealousy or something, looks like she'll milk out this "Tornado Open" until no one shows up anymore
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Not being able to do something about it, is not the same as not caring.

It doesn't matter if they care, if there is no money or support to get something done, its not going to happen.

I hate bringing up old news, but the IPT was a situation where nothing could be done, lots of people cared.

If the fans want a better experience Vivs better off making a stream event, as oppose to hassling with the atmosphere and setup.

Less is more.
 
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eddie8842 said:
This is the 3rd time she's had the "Tornado Open," and having been to the last two, I gotta agree that she has no business running or promoting a tournament

The last two were some of the most poorly run tourneys i've ever been to and it's true that she shows favoritism, and is rude to a lot of the players

The two tournament directors she's had were jokes, they knew nothing about pool, not how to run a tourney nor the rules to the games, they were just cheap labor

I also know for a fact that Vivian has been told about the areas that need to be improved, but she doesn't care, she thinks it's a personal attack on her or jealousy or something, looks like she'll milk out this "Tornado Open" until no one shows up anymore

And i heard many pros say they wouldn't show up for the next one when i went to the one in San Antonio, but it's hard to pass up "100k added" when your job is pool playing

I'm glad this farce is finally being called what it is, only took 3 different events in 3 different cities for the pros and pool fans to wake up

And matter of fact, looks like it's gotten worse, now she took this guy's $550 and left him out of the bracket, I don't even have words for that, not polite enough for the forums at least

but maybe next year she'll add 200k and they'll flock over again

I, for one, didn't enjoy the last 2 and would never go to any tournament she put on ever again
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FINALLY - Someone has the guts to post the truth!

It is what it is folks and it isn't pretty!
 
JAM said:
Another pool player knocker. Some things never change. :)

For every pool player who is demeaned and ridiculed on AzBilliards, there is at least a hundred knockers who are, in reality, wannabe pro players. It's must more fun to bash the pros behind a computer monitor.
Click to expand...


I have zero aspirations to be a pro pool player.

And yet, I find a lot of truth in what Cowboy said, based upon decades observing "Pro pool players" in their element, in money matches and tournaments all over the country. I've watched some of them dump off thousands to the casinos, usually after a good score. So what in particular about his post did you have a problem with, mom?

Lou Figueroa
 
justnum said:
Pool never stopped being great

It needed time to get rid of the frauds and fakes
Click to expand...


Unfortunamente, pool has a long sad history of ill prepared promoters who do not know how to run a big event, then get into trouble and screw it up. AND THAT explanation is giving them the benefit of the doubt in spite of what often looks like ill intent.

IMO, if a promoter is going to come here and promote their event, then they should also be prepared to pull on their big girl panties (no-sexism there, I would have used the same for a male promoter) and come here and address post-tournament issues. You can't just have it one way.

Lou Figueroa
 
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