I've Got a Secret - Frozen Pair on the Spot

3kushn said:
... Can anyone tell me how it goes without transfer?
...
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Transfer helps but it's not required. You can show this by putting the cue ball where it would be just before contact and then shoot it hard against the two spotted balls with a fourth ball -- you have no draw or follow on the cue ball with this setup. The front spotted ball will not go straight to the side. There is complicated physics behind this which I won't go into right now. It also does not require the balls to be inelastic (dead) at all -- theory says it should work with perfectly elastic balls.

Wade Crane illustrated the shot years ago in a pool magazine playing the shot with follow. That makes it touchier than with draw, but it can be done.
 
jay helfert said:
There is a better way! And that's all I have to say. I will bet even money I can make the second ball straight in. Any takers?
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Tell us, or maybe just tell me. I will practice it and maybe I'll take you up on your challange.
 
wayne said:
Not to rain on Fred's parade but he is probably using the same type balls on the same type table each time he does this.
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I guarantee that would be impossible. Consider what I wrote in the thread, when I talked about JoeyA (who also replied), that was at DCC on tables that are completely unlike any table I ever spend time on.

Fred
 
Funny

Cornerman said:
I guarantee that would be impossible. Consider what I wrote in the thread, when I talked about JoeyA (who also replied), that was at DCC on tables that are completely unlike any table I ever spend time on.

Fred
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that this is even posted here. I just got back home from Dayton and went to Airways last night. This particular shot I had only made once in my life on a 4x8 steepleton. I was talking to Joe Brown last night and he had the infamous George Rood showed me some shots and this very one I asked about in particular. George set the shot up and told me how to make it. I made it the first try on a 4.5x9 diamond. George is full of great shots! He showed me probably about 20 different shots that were nothing short of amazing. And the best part about all these shots is they are useful shots. They come up in games all the time.


Gary
 
shotmaker said:
Keep working on it, I had a Pro show me this shot, and then he showed me how the 2 goes two rails in the corner at the same end of the table.

I can make the head ball in the corner 3 out of 5 most easily, but banking the second ball the two rails is a different shot altogether, but i can make it, but don't see the point of it, with the exception of 9 ball

He also showed me a couple of other shots using the same principle, that proved to be valuable in eight and nine ball, he called it pushing thru the ball.
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I bank the second ball a lot more than I go for the head ball. I am very consistent with banking the second ball two rails as I have practiced this shot plenty.

In one pocket this is a good shot in the right situation. Very handy. I like to draw the cueball back up table and make sure that both balls are gathered at my pocket. If one happens to go then so much the better. Thanks Fred!!!

John
 
jay helfert said:
Now kiddies, who knows how to make the second ball straight in the corner pocket, with ball in hand? I DO! And so does Buddy Hall since I showed him years ago.

But I won't tell you on here. I've won a buck or two on this shot.
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Jay, isn't this shot in Byrne's Standard book of pool and billiards? I dont have the time to fiddle with the Flash Cuetable but isnt it basically you place the cueball as close to the ball on the spot as you can without touching the two balls, with the cueball directly to the side of the ball on the spot as you view it from a racking position and on the opposite side of which corner you wish to make the second ball. You jack up like a masse and fire , aiming like in between the two frozen balls. The ball on the spot move a hair to side before the cueball hits the second ball, which goes straight into the corner. I hope I described the shot clearly enough. I do remember that this specific shot was one of the first shots in the Byrne book that I took to the pool room in the 1980s and was fascinated that it worked. Plus it won me a few sodas from the locals.
 
uwate said:
Jay, isn't this shot in Byrne's Standard book of pool and billiards? I dont have the time to fiddle with the Flash Cuetable but isnt it basically you place the cueball as close to the ball on the spot as you can without touching the two balls, with the cueball directly to the side of the ball on the spot as you view it from a racking position and on the opposite side of which corner you wish to make the second ball. You jack up like a masse and fire , aiming like in between the two frozen balls. The ball on the spot move a hair to side before the cueball hits the second ball, which goes straight into the corner. I hope I described the shot clearly enough. I do remember that this specific shot was one of the first shots in the Byrne book that I took to the pool room in the 1980s and was fascinated that it worked. Plus it won me a few sodas from the locals.
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I'll have to try this, but it sure sounds like a foul to me. Do you place the cue ball very close to both spotted balls?
 
Yes as close as you can make it. You can do this shot without fouling imo. You end up jacked up like all the way in the air and shoot the shot with almost a downward stroke.
 
Bob Jewett:
I'll have to try this, but it sure sounds like a foul to me. Do you place the cue ball very close to both spotted balls?
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Bob, would the "ten times fuller" shot work here (freeze the cue ball to the first spotted ball and aim as if to pocket the cue ball in the target corner pocket by aiming 1/5 diamond down the rail from the second diamond)?

CueTable Help



pj
chgo
 
jay helfert said:
Now kiddies, who knows how to make the second ball straight in the corner pocket, with ball in hand? .
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JH,
This is the way I was shown. Elevate the butt of the cue slightly, lots of low right English, struck at medium to slow speed to maximize throw.

I'm not sure why it works (I'm uncertain if maybe the cue ball hits a sliver of the 1-ball or not; but the 2 goes most of the time).

CueTable Help

 
Patrick Johnson said:
Bob, would the "ten times fuller" shot work here (freeze the cue ball to the first spotted ball and aim as if to pocket the cue ball in the target corner pocket by aiming 1/5 diamond down the rail from the second diamond)? ...
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In this case, you would want the "two times fuller" system which applies when the cue ball is frozen to an object ball. I'm not sure exactly where the stick would be pointed -- a little geometry or a couple of tries are needed.

But with cue ball in hand, it is illegal to freeze the cue ball to an object ball.
 
Bob:
But with cue ball in hand, it is illegal to freeze the cue ball to an object ball.
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That's too bad, because this shot is just about 100 percent when you know the aim (two times fuller with my balls).

pj
chgo

CueTable Help

 
I've Got a Secret

Cornerman said:
I've been holding onto this secret, if it really is a secret, for several months or even years now. Not because I don't want to share, but because it doesn't come up often enough in my play to take advantage.

. . .

I show this shot to my teammates and other people, and I'm near 100% on this shot. I'd like to say 100% since I don't recall ever missing with this system, but I'm sure I'll miss sometime soon. And, I dont' just show this as a spot shot.

Try it and report your findings.

Fred <~~~ thanks to Bob Jewett and Dr. Dave
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Are you Killroy? :D
 
Bob Jewett said:
I'll have to try this, but it sure sounds like a foul to me. Do you place the cue ball very close to both spotted balls?
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Well, according to the BCA rules, all you have to do is freeze the cue ball to the object ball, and now you can't foul. HA HA HA HA HA.

So that's the way I will shoot it from now on. I will still take even money on this shot next time I see you Bob. :)
 
Jay:
Well, according to the BCA rules, all you have to do is freeze the cue ball to the object ball, and now you can't foul. HA HA HA HA HA.

So that's the way I will shoot it from now on. I will still take even money on this shot next time I see you Bob.
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Be careful about the stroke, though. If you follow through too far (more than 1 inch, say) you'll double hit the cue ball as it's stopped by the 2. If the cue ball doesn't stop (continues forward) you fouled it.

pj
chgo
 
Cornerman said:
Problem is, most one pocket players can't make even one ball consistently. Hence, the system.

I've never seen anyone make both on the same shot. I've seen both gathered by the hole, and of course making the head ball, but nowhere near on the second.

Fred
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I was playing LOW DOWN EDDIE BROWN some one pocket tonight and had this shot and made the front ball like it had EYES. :p :D
JoeyA
 
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