Jack Cooney

[The Saw]

I wonder who the best undercover guy is now?

With cell phones, cell phone cameras, streaming video, text messaging, pix messaging, the internet and all the pool detectives that are on the job these days I don't think any true undercover guys are left. Or at least any that have a chance of making very much money.... The IPT outed the best undercover guy that was left in the business and the 2 or 3 other good undercover guys that were left.... Thanks IPT!

 

[JB Cases]

With cell phones, cell phone cameras, streaming video, text messaging, pix messaging, the internet and all the pool detectives that are on the job these days I don't think any true undercover guys are left. Or at least any that have a chance of making very much money.... The IPT outed the best undercover guy that was left in the business and the 2 or 3 other good undercover guys that were left.... Thanks IPT!

How did the IPT "out" them? They weren't under any obligation to play in the IPT or try to.

I think that there are probably several running around who are top notchers and manage to stay pretty well under the radar. Probably none as dedicated as Jack seems to have been but still making a decent living.

I know just in Xiamen that I could make good money off of the ex-pats if I cared to lemon and lay down the spread. I don't have that kind of patience or discipline.

 

[The Saw]

How did the IPT "out" them? They weren't under any obligation to play in the IPT or try to.

I think that there are probably several running around who are top notchers and manage to stay pretty well under the radar. Probably none as dedicated as Jack seems to have been but still making a decent living.

I put it wrong... They outed themselves chasing the dream of what the IPT proposed.

My point is that Jack could not earn undercover in todays environment because of the technology. His ace in the hole was that very few knew what he looked like. Today, someone would be posting his pic here and asking who he was and he would be outed forever.

 

[SJDinPHX]

I put it wrong... They outed themselves chasing the dream of what the IPT proposed.

My point is that Jack could not earn undercover in todays environment because of the technology. His ace in the hole was that very few knew what he looked like. Today, someone would be posting his pic here and asking who he was and he would be outed forever.

Most of you guy's think Jack was a recluse type "mystery man". That was not the case at all. He played in tournaments and matched up all over the country, almost since day one of his career.
All the top players knew him, and knew his game. Many of his lemon acts or undercover scores, were in out of the way places and were a result of Jack's demeanor and the fact that he looked more like a bank executive, than a pool hustler. And he used that to his best advantage. He made scores in places where almost no other player could get in the door. He didn't brag about things, and except for Barbara, was always a bit of a loner. Worthwhile undercover pool scores are a thing of the past.
Thanks to the two big pool movies, and our now almost cashless society, that well has been dry for quite some time now as far as pool is concerned.

Dick

 

[gunzby]

the previous 4 or 5 posts were the most ridiculous things i've read on this site.

Not sure if one of those 4 or 5 posts were mine, but oh well. I have heard his name from young and old men hustlers alike. Those names include: Lil Tony, Scottie Wilhelm (who used to run around on the road with Earl), Fat Cliff Bustle, Jose Sandoval in NC. Joe Parma (never knew his real name), Tulio Antonelli and Mike Farmer (didn't know his real name either) in Ohio.

*edit* I could of course say other names from those areas, but I didn't hear about him from them.

 

[gunzby]

There you go. If Hooker breaks all the time, he wins about one out of four games without Jack shooting. That leaves three games to be contested. If Jack wins two out of three he breaks even. He must win all three games to come out winners. DING DING DING! Caution Will Robinson, caution!

Have you ever been to Dello's Rack n Roll in Mentor, Ohio? I swear I have seen you before when I used to work there. We used to bet on everything under the sun there before the owners went to prison for drugs (pounds and pounds of coke and marijuana) and machine gun running.

 

[huckster]

Ask yourself this question, "How much is the bet?" When they start playing a dime a game or 10K sets, I like Jack. For a hundred a game, I'm not betting. Kapeche?

I like Jack too in alternate breaks, but the bet won't faze Hooker I seen him send it all in before

 

[huckster]

With cell phones, cell phone cameras, streaming video, text messaging, pix messaging, the internet and all the pool detectives that are on the job these days I don't think any true undercover guys are left. Or at least any that have a chance of making very much money.... The IPT outed the best undercover guy that was left in the business and the 2 or 3 other good undercover guys that were left.... Thanks IPT!

Billy Peay may not be a champion, but he is an action magnet and I doubt there are 50 players in the U.S.A favored over him on the small track and maybe not 20 players in banks

 

[huckster]

Have you ever been to Dello's Rack n Roll in Mentor, Ohio? I swear I have seen you before when I used to work there. We used to bet on everything under the sun there before the owners went to prison for drugs (pounds and pounds of coke and marijuana) and machine gun running.

Was that the same guy who won the lottery and was a pretty fair player?

 

[gunzby]

Was that the same guy who won the lottery and was a pretty fair player?

Not sure about him winning the lotto, but he was a halfway decent player.....definitely not a top 10 in that place though. He certainly was a top gambler there. I remember him betting on me and another guy in arm wrestling. He also bet one of my best buds against anyone in a chugging contest. His $100 against anyone's $10. The person he was betting on was Danny Jones if you know him........the beer chugging machine.

 

[jay helfert]

I am pretty sure I know that break. I was "taught" it at the US Open many years ago. Balls racked like 9 ball and the cue goes............. and a ball goes straight into the corner pocket every time?

In deference to the spirit of the thread I will not outline the specifics of the break I know - whether it be the one you are talking about or not.

I wonder who the best undercover guy is now? I was playing at a local dive and a player I know shows up and I start to say hey ............. and he stops me and says, they know me as ............... in this place. Cracked me up that he was incognito in this bar. I kept his secret and still beat him in the little rinky dink tournament. I needed that $50.

Of course he probably made well more than me by staying on the stall.

It's a two rail kick out of the corner into the bottom of the pack. When you see it once, you know it. Then it's just a matter of practice. This is no real secret.

 

[jay helfert]

With cell phones, cell phone cameras, streaming video, text messaging, pix messaging, the internet and all the pool detectives that are on the job these days I don't think any true undercover guys are left. Or at least any that have a chance of making very much money.... The IPT outed the best undercover guy that was left in the business and the 2 or 3 other good undercover guys that were left.... Thanks IPT!

Oh there's a couple, don't kid yourself. I ain't saying anymore, but there are a handful of very good players out there who not many people know about. More than a handful actually. Two Handfuls!

 

[jay helfert]

Have you ever been to Dello's Rack n Roll in Mentor, Ohio? I swear I have seen you before when I used to work there. We used to bet on everything under the sun there before the owners went to prison for drugs (pounds and pounds of coke and marijuana) and machine gun running.

I played a lot of pool in Ohio in the 60's and 70's. If you were around then you may have seen me. I beat Howard Vickery in a bar in Columbus playing Eight Ball before he became famous. :wink:

 

[Black-Balled]

I've read it before now and my pnly complaint is that it isn't 800 pages!

A great read...go read, AZB.

For an unauthorized (Barbara wouldn't let me use her or Jack's first names) full blown movie script, based loosely on Jack and Barbara's road adventures, read "Roxanne's Game."
www.scriptforroxannesgame.blogspot.com/

the Beard

"Roxanne" is really Barbara, "Mick" is really Jack, and me is really me.

 

[Rusty C]

In 1976 Jack came to Amarillo Texas, there was a man that lived here named Chuck Walker. He own a big construction company here and he loved to bet high. But he was a little bit of a hustler himself, he loved to bust people and enjoyed seeing people broke. He beat a guy out of his boots one time and took them. So somebody brought Jack to town to see if they could trap Chuck. So Jack went into that bar everyday for about a week playing eight ball for a dollar a game with Chuck and losing almost every game. When Chuck would try to raise the bet Jack would say no and quit. Well this was driving Chuck crazy because Jack had been flashing alot of money. So one day Chuck explained the game of 1 pocket to Jack and offered Jack a big spot if he would bet high. Well Chuck ended up losing $30,000. A little of the money was won playing Gin

 

[CrownCityCorey]

It's interesting that no one has discussed Jack's moniker - 'Frisco Jack!

I personally tried many times outmaneuver him and get Jack to play some 9-Ball. I never got the game. He was always "working" for his big stakes action. I was way too tough and he could only win a few hunny. The only point for him would have been to loosen up his stroke cheap.

I also personally watched Jack and Toby play at the Cue Club in Vegas. 8 ahead one-hole (9/8-10/8) for 25k (they posted up two sets). I started watching the match on the 1st day. By the end of the day (they set and 8 hour time limit), I think Toby was ahead by 3 or 4 games. I continued to come and watch the entire session for the next 3-4 days. When I left, Jack was ahead 3 or 4 games. He just kept getting stronger and stronger.

After I left town and went back to L.A. I would get reports everday on the match from folks as they came back from Vegas as well. The same set was still going on!

Ultimately, so I heard, they decided the match was taking too long, no way two sets of 8 ahead were gonna happen if they played for a month! At even, they bet the whole 50k and a couple days later - Jack was counting his winnings.

Awesome!

 

[jay helfert]

It's interesting that no one has discussed Jack's moniker - 'Frisco Jack!

I personally tried many times outmaneuver him and get Jack to play some 9-Ball. I never got the game. He was always "working" for his big stakes action. I was way too tough and he could only win a few hunny. The only point for him would have been to loosen up his stroke cheap.

I also personally watched Jack and Toby play at the Cue Club in Vegas. 8 ahead one-hole (9/8-10/8) for 25k (they posted up two sets). I started watching the match on the 1st day. By the end of the day (they set and 8 hour time limit), I think Toby was ahead by 3 or 4 games. I continued to come and watch the entire session for the next 3-4 days. When I left, Jack was ahead 3 or 4 games. He just kept getting stronger and stronger.

After I left town and went back to L.A. I would get reports everday on the match from folks as they came back from Vegas as well. The same set was still going on!

Ultimately, so I heard, they decided the match was taking too long, no way two sets of 8 ahead were gonna happen if they played for a month! At even, they bet the whole 50k and a couple days later - Jack was counting his winnings.

Awesome!

Don't think Jack is one trick pony. About 10-12 years ago when Sal Butera was about the best 9-Ball player in SoCal, he hooked up with Jack in a ten ahead set for 20K (10K each). I had 1K of Jack's action. Sal had him down seven or eight games the first day, but in the end Jack got there. Consider yourself lucky Corey that you never tested Jack at high stakes 9-Ball.

 

[markgw]

Back in 1993 I was on tour with my band Great White and on everyday off I would go to poolhalls around the Country to find someone to match up with. That year I saw Jack Cooney in 5 different poolhalls matched up in 5 different States. When I saw him for the 5th time he came up to me and asked if I was following him. I just laughed and explained I was on tour with my band and it was a coinsidense. But I would watch him play and he always gave weight and it was always 1 pocket.

 

[CrownCityCorey]

Don't think Jack is one trick pony. About 10-12 years ago when Sal Butera was about the best 9-Ball player in SoCal, he hooked up with Jack in a ten ahead set for 20K (10K each). I had 1K of Jack's action. Sal had him down seven or eight games the first day, but in the end Jack got there. Consider yourself lucky Corey that you never tested Jack at high stakes 9-Ball.

Naw. I don't consider myself lucky. Just part of taking my lumps to improve.

 

[lfigueroa]

Lou, I'm sure your memory is better than mine - I'm doing good if I remember where I parked my car when I leave the pool room...lol

- Ghost

Ps, Did you have to remember that - now it's even worse - I must have lost 4 to 1 instead of 3 to 1....

Well, yeah. I just didn't want to mention that part

Lou Figueroa