JB stoops to new lows

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mia said:
I'll be honest here. I have no real favorite in the Barton/Justis debate as to who is the better case maker. Both guys are world class case makers. Both guys build an amazing product that speaks for itself AND has earned them many fans who are willing to speak for them as well. That kind of reputation doesn't just appear out of nowhere. Its established over a period of time by continuing to make a great product that people love.

But I'm with one stroke here. John has started a number of threads both here and on other sites where he takes shots at Jack... all the while adding the disclaimer that "Jack makes a great case" then follows it with "now let me tell you about all that's wrong with it". He makes videos using Justis cases as examples of bad protection, etc.. He offers to make 'upgrades' to Jack's product. Now he's going to teach everyone how to make "this very simple" case... a Justis case, etc.. The passive/aggressive "I'm just here to help you learn" front is just that... a front. John has made it clear that he has an agenda. And while that agenda SHOULD be to make a great case that players will love, his agenda is more like "Let's try and convince the world that Jack's cases suck and mine are better."

Both John and Jack are GREAT case makers who make a solid, well-liked product. Their work has earned them many fans and a considerable amount of success in their industry. But John seems hellbent on showing and telling everyone "Mine is better! Love me more!" in his extremely passive aggressive ways. Frankly, it makes John look bad because it gives him the appearance of being insecure when his long list of orders and his large number of fans and customers should be all the reassurance he needs that he's doing fine by many.

Jack and John BOTH have well-deserved reputations in the pool world. Jack's reputation as a great case maker is deserved. But John's reputation as that of a great case maker AND a crazy, petty, immature individual is also very deserved. He'd be better off just logging off, stepping away from the keyboard, and both making and selling cases rather than giving people in a public forum a number of reasons to steer clear of him and his product.

- B <----------- not a Justis "fanboy" and presently owner of a JB case
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This is accurate.
 
RunoutJJ said:
Don't you think there is good reasons for hatred towards certain people?? Just the facts being stated is enough to make me dislike him :rolleyes:
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Facts? What facts? Most of it is hearsay, one person hating another for whatever reason. There's three sides to every argument, his side, your side and the truth. How we decide to interpret it is up to us..right or wrong. About the only fact I've come away with is the case interior issues. Some say that's an attack, it's really called marketing. Competitors show the flaws of each other and try to help you understand why theirs is better. It's been going on for quite some time.

There are dozens of vocal people on this forum, it is what it is. If I based my like/dislike on someone's post, I'd hate almost everyone on here. I make my judgment of people based on real life interaction. With that said, I met JB at SBE and you would have thought he knew me for years, he spoke to me as an equal. Not, "I own a big case company and I have lots of money" arrogance, but he treated me the way I'd want to be treated.

There is NEVER a good reason for hatred against another person...Murderers, rapists and pedophiles excluded...especially based on forum posts. Besides, You or I hating "John Doe" doesn't really affect John Doe, it only affects us in the effort it takes to "hate" someone and express that feeling.

There's a TON of BS that is stirred up on these forums daily. Some create it and others live for it. If I ever log in and someone isn't complaining, slamming someone or making an ass out of themselves, I'm going to check my pulse! ;)
 
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Every time from here forward, when I see a JB/Justice fuid thread, i am going to propose potential match ups for my dad. He is 52 years old, 5'8", 140lbs (if he holds a 20lb brick), he's squirlly as all hell (He could make Earl blush somedays) and I pretend he is a 75th degree black belt in kraub-ma-ga...

Who wants some???
 
I'm actually lost on this one.

The slam against Jack is that his one man handmade case is so easy to make, it should cost $300.

So to prove that, John is going to one man, hand make a case and sell it for $450....about the same price as Jacks basic case.

Then....

John is going to sell a volume based Chinese team built case for $300, close to what Jacks imported cases sold for.

I must be missing something....
 
I have a JB case - one of the vinyl jobs 3 butts - 6 shafts. The bottom got slighlly wet. The ivory butt cap on my cue is now stained from whatever dye is used on the inside of the case.
 
RRfireblade said:
I'm actually lost on this one.

The slam against Jack is that his one man handmade case is so easy to make, it should cost $300.

So to prove that, John is going to one man, hand make a case and sell it for $450....about the same price as Jacks basic case.

Then....

John is going to sell a volume based Chinese team built case for $300, close to what Jacks imported cases sold for.

I must be missing something....
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You are missing something. JB is making a JJ knockoff for $300. If you want said knockoff signed by JB himself, it'll be $475.
 
RRfireblade said:
I'm actually lost on this one.

The slam against Jack is that his one man handmade case is so easy to make, it should cost $300.

So to prove that, John is going to one man, hand make a case and sell it for $450....about the same price as Jacks basic case.

Then....

John is going to sell a volume based Chinese team built case for $300, close to what Jacks imported cases sold for.

I must be missing something....
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I was thinking the exact same thing..... what exactly is JB's point, that when he touches the case only, he charges top of the line prices, just like Justis? But when he hires a few dudes at a couple of bucks an hour, the price is much lower?

I'd ask JB to expalin, but I really don't wanna read a post about the Encyclopedia of Cases right before lunch :)
 
watchez said:
I have a JB case - one of the vinyl jobs 3 butts - 6 shafts. The bottom got slighlly wet. The ivory butt cap on my cue is now stained from whatever dye is used on the inside of the case.
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That might be, but if it had caught fire when it was wet it would have been the best protection that is currently on the market.
 
from my understanding he is building this one case by scratch. and maybe its the one in his youtube vids? but idk from just the materials and over all construction that is being put into his cases i'd buy one. but i just bought a 3x6 that i think will be just fine for me right now. but i think this thread should end weather you like them or not everyone is promoting both cases regardless of view. justis or JB both good choices one is cheaper though. who really cares what someone else buys.
 
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tank69 said:
Facts? What facts? Most of it is hearsay, one person hating another for whatever reason. There's three sides to every argument, his side, your side and the truth. How we decide to interpret it is up to us..right or wrong. About the only fact I've come away with is the case interior issues. Some say that's an attack, it's really called marketing. Competitors show the flaws of each other and try to help you understand why theirs is better. It's been going on for quite some time.

There are dozens of vocal people on this forum, it is what it is. If I based my like/dislike on someone's post, I'd hate almost everyone on here. I make my judgment of people based on real life interaction. With that said, I met JB at SBE and you would have thought he knew me for years, he spoke to me as an equal. Not, "I own a big case company and I have lots of money" arrogance, but he treated me the way I'd want to be treated.

There is NEVER a good reason for hatred against another person...Murderers, rapists and pedophiles excluded...especially based on forum posts. Besides, You or I hating "John Doe" doesn't really affect John Doe, it only affects us in the effort it takes to "hate" someone and express that feeling.

There's a TON of BS that is stirred up on these forums daily. Some create it and others live for it. If I ever log in and someone isn't complaining, slamming someone or making an ass out of themselves, I'm going to check my pulse! ;)
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I posted this comment without even reading your post. Sorry Im just trying to up my post count...
 
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ChicagoRJ said:
I was thinking the exact same thing..... what exactly is JB's point, that when he touches the case only, he charges top of the line prices, just like Justis? But when he hires a few dudes at a couple of bucks an hour, the price is much lower?

I'd ask JB to expalin, but I really don't wanna read a post about the Encyclopedia of Cases right before lunch :)
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Do you guys not read or comprehend what he was saying? Really?

JB is making a JJ knockoff for $300. If you want said knockoff signed by JB himself, it'll be $475.
 
Maxx said:
That might be, but if it had caught fire when it was wet it would have been the best protection that is currently on the market.
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Don't stir up any crazy casemakers, please.

On another note, love your avatar. Yours? Original Panhead or reproduction? Restored?


Eric >nice
 
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I guess if you have a problem with it, you shouldn't buy it. Otherwise, I'm guessing the market will dictate whether or not he should continue. I haven't heard him asking for free money, so I'd guess his products are being bought for whatever he's asking.

I've got a $5 case for my $10 stick. :o If I put on another piece of duct tape, maybe it'll be worth $6.
 
I don't have enough hands or fingers to count the number of car/truck manufacturers' commercials I see on TV comparing their product to the competitions', and going so far as to say that their product is superior and why. Heck, Microflaccid and Apple had a very successful run of commercials going back and forth at each other. Cellular phone providers...same thing. Currently Shark is taking a hard stab at Dyson, offering more performance for a 1/3 of the price.

This is all healthy business competition....without it, we'd have the dreaded monopolies, where there is no choice...ya get what ya get.

You can love JB or hate him...but the fact remains that he offers a rock solid product, a fact that many can attest to. Additionally, he has helped several fledgling custom case makers to craft a better product, just by sharing his experiences over the many many years he's been doing this now. And not just case makers...other leather workers as well. He does so much more behind the scenes than most of you will ever know to help promote the pool industry...worldwide. We ALL have so many different personalities here...I just find it easier to accept people for who they are, and move on. It wastes far too much energy to hate.

Lisa
 
I don't see what the fuss is about. Sounds like people will be able to buy a nice case for $300. W, the consumers, win with that deal. What I see is competition between JB and Justis. Competition is almost always a good thing for the consumer in numerous ways. If JB came up with a creative way to spin that, good for him.
 
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