Justin Bergman going to Mosconi Cup for Team USA
- Thread starter JAM
- Start date
I tend to agree but don't forget this is Matchroom's baby. Don't think they weren't involved. They're gonna do what they feel makes the best production.
The FU was putting a process in place and not following it. Ask Morris and Archer about it.
BTW Epstein didn't kill himself.
The selection process was always 5 Captain’s picks for team USA. I think the screw-up was Johan opened up too much into his method for making the 5th pick...the process up until then was he picked who he and Jeremy felt should be on the team, (Tyler winning in Moscow sealed it right up for #4 for example )it was the same going in for #5 and he just let out too much information which lead to the hint that there was a defined process.
I remember you saying it was odd that 6 players were chosen to go to Moscow for the dream challenge, and you were correct. It was odd, but I assumed Johan wasn’t entirely sold on Max, even though max won against the others in the mini tournament to be included in Moscow. And I still think it was Corey’s spot to lose-Johan seemed to be leaning towards Corey during the dream challenge.
Win or lose, next year, Coach should just keep the media in the dark and let us speculate...and when the final decisions are made, no one will seem mislead.
Agree. Just say from the get-go that the team will be announced at the end of(insert event name) and that's that. No subterfuge(love that word) required.
I don't know why the selection process has to be so difficult or be kept so hush-hush.
1. In December, announce a list of which events in the following year will earn MC points. These should be non-invitational tournaments, 9 ball, and played on a 9' table.
2. For the big 4 (DCC 9-ball, US Open 9-ball, World 9-ball, and Int'l 9-ball), those events should have double points.
3. Top 3 in points make the team, and coach gets 2 wildcard picks. However, the 2 wildcard picks must be in the top 15 in points earned.
I know there is a difference of opinion on this subject, but I will restate what I said earlier to hopefully make the point clearer. We have picked a player who is by most everyone's opinion, the better player for this year's Mosconi Cup. A SHORT TERM GAIN AT BEST, and even that is debatable. IN THE LONG RUN, our coaches have lost ALL credibility, and no player who wants to be on the team in the future should go through the camps, training sessions, or anything else, because it DOES NOT MEAN A THING. So long term, we have probably ruined our training process, and our chances of getting players who are willing to sacrifice for the team. In my opinion, and apparently I am not the only one, this is bad for America's Mosconi Cup future teams, and American pool in general.
If they go back to points all events should be in US. Unless MR/BCA whoever is payin the tab i wouldn't force them to go overseas. I wouldn't make anybody go to Qatar. I'm good with capt picks just do it better.
I’m not convinced that when Johan and Jeremy tap a few players on the shoulder for an all expense paid trip to Moscow next year, those players will respectfully decline because of the Justin pick this year. A year ago, Oscar Dominguez still relished at the chance to train with Johan even though his odds at making the team were nil.
Also there is a history of Johan trying different processes out and then totally going to opposite direction. Remember the mandatory boot camps he staged in order to make the team, that Shane skipped out on, but ultimately Shane was on the team, because, he’s Shane V B. That was an infraction of the stated process for making the team, and they would go on to win the cup.
So no, I don’t see this hurting team USA from getting players to try out for the team next year or the year after. You know what would help? A second victory in a row! Go USA!!
It all comes down to ''organized sport''....of which we are not quite there yet....and obviously still working on it, tho now it's worldwide.
REMEMBER.... we're dealing with pool players, some things take 60 years to figure out properly.
The American pros went thru many fiascos during their twilight/Lassiter/Crane/Ronnie Allen years, since Janscos, then 3 different Pro Tours....came and went.
This type of dance has been seen before ''many times''. I've learned how and what to expect from the Big cats!
In the early days of the Worlds Tournaments when Souquet and Mika first showed up in Germany, some American pros turned down their FREE entry. They felt it was not worth their time and money. They made more staying home.
REMEMBER.... we're dealing with pool players, some things take 60 years to figure out properly.
The American pros went thru many fiascos during their twilight/Lassiter/Crane/Ronnie Allen years, since Janscos, then 3 different Pro Tours....came and went.
This type of dance has been seen before ''many times''. I've learned how and what to expect from the Big cats!
In the early days of the Worlds Tournaments when Souquet and Mika first showed up in Germany, some American pros turned down their FREE entry. They felt it was not worth their time and money. They made more staying home.
Could have been done better but this won't have any effect on future MC teams or pool in general. Its not nearly(or shouldn't be anyway) as dramatic as some feel it is. Max and Corey are pros who get what went down and they'll deal with it fine. Also don't lay all this at the capt's feet. This is a Matchroom production so don't think they didn't have input in this. Time to play and the US keep that cup!
It seems to be what team Europe does, except the 2 picks are whoever the captain wants because some Euro players live in America and don’t play on the tour regularly.
Yes, that would be a defined process and unable to argue with the results of that selection.
Plus, the US Open, DCC and International 9 ball have become extremely high level talent pools from around the world, so the top American players from those fields will certainly be able to field a great USA team.
It's the World 9 Ball.
If you really want to be elite, then you find a way to make it there.
før fanden! niels lives in denmark.
the other wild pick, mr shaw, i was sceptical of this year. after his latest two tournaments i guess i will have to eat my words minced into a haggis
back on topic i kind of agree with making the US selection process more like the european one. there are enough big tournaments now for that to be reasonable.
How do we know our coaches have lost all credibility? Have the involved players spoken up about being slighted?
I get that some hardcore fans feel tricked, duped, and slighted based on the published selection process. But what do fans really know?
How do we know those players weren't paid well including room and board to go play in Russia? How do we know that the coaches didn't tell the players that if they won or played lights out in the Kremlin Cup that they would secure a spot? How do we know that the coaches didn't tell the players that if they didn't win or play lights out at the int'l open, OR if another American obviously outplayed them, they could be bumped from consideration?
The answer is that as far as I know, we don't know the answers to any of those questions. Again, I get that some fans feel duped, but until the players come out and call it shady, I will give the benefit of the doubt to our coaches. JJ has always seemed to carry himself with integrity, and he and Johan have earned the benefit of the doubt( from me at least!)
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Neither I nor anyone in the thread has second guessed this pick, only the bastardization of the process.
Yes, he did say it, and it was publicly announced to the billiard press and reported in an AZB Headline News Article of October 3, 2019.
Jay, this was just a screwup. Everyone understands that the end result is the best one for Matchroom and for Team USA,, but the process took a hit here and no number of excuses will erase the fact that this needs correction and far greater definition going forward.[/QUOTE]
Have you contacted Matchroom Stu so that the necessary changes can be made?
Thank you. The MC is very much Matchroom's event. Try as we may it does not belong to any of us and ultimately we have no say in how they run their business. :wink:
Yes, and no one was complaining then. So it was okay to bastardize the selection process when it got Shane back on the team but when it got Justin on the team all hell breaks loose. You can't have it both ways!
Personally, I was glad last year when Shane was given a second chance to be on the team and it appears to have worked out okay. I'm also glad that Justin is on the team this year. It remains to be seen if it works out as well.
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Here are just a few of the 50+ players who have gone directly to the major leagues, bypassing the players in the farm systems and those who went through spring training. Interestingly enough Stu you are correct. No player has ever taken this direct route to the New York Mets.
Hall of Famer Mel Ott, Sandy Koufax, Al Kaline, Harmon Killebrew, Catfish Hunter, Clete Boyer and Gil Hodges.
Any of these names ring a bell with you?
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