Sorry, but this is false. The equal/opposite system is mathematically correct. And can be shown and proven on and off of a pool table.
Learn with an aiming system or not
- Thread starter Mike81
- Start date
Sorry, but this is false. The equal/opposite system is mathematically correct. And can be shown and proven on and off of a pool table.
How do you know they didn't use something other than ghost ball? You don't. You only know what you read in your beginner book.
But the answer is that they got great the way everyone else gets great, they put in the table time using all the tools they knew of and wanted to use.
The thing about CTE is that the motions that a CTE user adopts THOUGH the use of CTE pretty much mirror the body motions of great players so one COULD conclude that CTE is likely to be a detailed break down of the perceptive process that good players seem to evolve into. I mean if players say I don't know how I aim then that doesn't mean that how they aim is a mystery that can never be solved. It simply means that either they don't want to tell you, which is sometimes true, or they really don't know because they never bothered to try and figure it out.
It doesn't mean that they never CONSCIOUSLY tried various aiming methods throughout their lives. It just means that at the moment they were asked they either don't want to talk about it or they don't know at that moment.
You have never tried CTE as far as I know. Yet you have said often that it's BS and snake oil etc... So you wouldn't know how easy or difficult it is to learn and use. Frankly, given your stated career experience I would be embarrassed if I were you to be taking the stance that I couldn't understand CTE. I know people who are pretty simple folks without a background that requires the level of intelligence the job you claimed to have done would require who understand and use CTE quite successfully.
But no one NEEDS CTE to become a good player. We are all clear on that. Even Stan. It's perfectly clear that many players get to high levels without doing anything formal to aim. Even if what they do seems to be very close to the eye patterns and body motion of dedicated CTE users it's obvious that they got there another way that produces the same results.
But if one has a set of instructions that help with precision aiming then one can focus more on all the other aspects needed to play great pool. That's the whole point of CTE and other aiming systems. To give the player something concrete to use as a guide towards "just seeing it" after enough time has been put in to make aiming automatic.
Isn't that the purpose of the Arrow template? You place the template and try to use it to get the "shot picture" and do that until you have it down and then you move the template to a different position and repeat the process, over and over for thousands of shots. Why do you need the template at all? Can't you just set up the shot and do it over and over until you just see it?
CTE gives the user a set of "keys" with which any shot at any time can be aimed correctly once the user knows how to properly use the visual references. Isn't it easier to train yourself to see the "perception picture" for a small number of references than it is to train yourself to see a different shot picture for every possible shot?
I think it is.
If I set up a shot and aim it using CTE then I set it up again and use the same perception and pay close attention to my stroke. If it goes in then I set it up again to be sure and if it goes in then I am good, I know how to aim it.
If I miss it the second time I adjust to a different perception and pay attention to my stroke. If I goes in then I do it again to be sure. Then I am good an I own it.
Maximum three shots to figure out the right aim and own that shot as far as aiming goes. From that point anytime I miss it's 99% stroke error.
I find that to be way easier than endless trial and error for thousands of shots.
Oh and using CTE STILL BUILDS SHOT PICTURES. So eventually the shooter locks onto the shot line instantly as he steps to the table because not only has the process become ingrained but also the totality of how the shot looks is an image in the shooter's mind. This helps them to understand the rare times when they did something wrong in the aim and have gotten down on the wrong line. In the beginning though users often use CTE and get to the right line but they are so used to being on the wrong line they don't trust it and have to force themselves to shoot anyway. And the line proves to be right and thus the old shot picture is erased and the new one replaces it.
Lastly Duckie, everything I wrote here isn't for you. It's for the readers. You sir have an incredibly closed mind and it's a sad thing for someone who claims to be passionate about pool. As a player I sincerely hope you do someday reach a decent level but more importantly I hope you someday get the chance to meet someone like Hal and Stan who can open your eyes to aspects of pool that you frankly don't know exist. You see us talking about them and you deny their existence but until you see the on-table proof you won't ever know what you're missing. I hope that you someday get to experience it first hand. Until then though these messages aren't for you. They are for the readers who might be thinking about trying CTE and similar good aiming systems. Go ahead and try them and see what you see.
Exactly. You don't GET that I have ghost ball and ESTIMATION in my tool box and can use them whenever I need to.
I have said that a zillion times. I can use ghost at any time, even on shots directly to a pocket if I choose to. In fact when I use CTE I find it makes it easier to then imagine the ghost ball position and sort of double check it against the shot line CTE has led me to.
I use GB estimation to figure kicks and sometimes banks IN ADDITION to CTE for banks and another system I recently learned for banks. I also use ghost ball to figure some caroms along with another method I figured out that works well.
And I use CTE to figure the shot line from the intervening ball to the object ball for combinations and then GB/Contact point to feel my way into the shot line to the first ball once I have determine the line. And that works well for me, raised my success rate on combinations dramatically once I figured it out.
I learned Double the Distance from Jimmy Reid in 1996ish in Germany. I have since adapted it to safety play as shown in my video. I also use my cue "bounce" to do the estimation of the distance to be doubled rather than walking around and using the cue as a yardstick and trying to look back through the spot on the rail and have to walk back to the cue ball and hold that spot. The way I do it works really well to find the rail spot from behind the cue ball and move into the shooting position easily from there.
Hope that clears it up for you so that you finally understand that CTE is just ONE tool in my box that I use when it's the best tool for the shot.
Tried the message thing...no response....How ya doing JB?
Texas Express case....Robin Adair
Texas Express case....Robin Adair
I didn't say the templates are not useful. I just said that GB aiming isn't so "easy" that it doesn't SEEM to require numerous templates and devices to learn to use it.
You have no real clue what Gordy's templates do. They are not there to teach someone how to use Ghost Ball. They use ghost ball diagrams to teach someone how to move FROM the cueball to object ball center into the gb position by teaching them what the offset angle LOOKS like for various shots from 0 - 85 degrees.
Gordy's templates are so advanced that they really have to be seen in person to understand the thought that went into them. Ghost Ball is ONLY used to bring the concept from paper to the table in a PRECISE manner so that the user never needs to worry that the GB drawing is in the right space or not.
In fact, Gordy's templates are a damn good way to test aiming systems without having to mark up the table. And once the user is convinced that the aiming system does in fact produce the right shot line they can then test their stroke and get immediate and accurate visual feedback using the template's precise lines for stroke path to gauge against.
You are trying to cause division when in fact Gordy is well aware of CTE and other aiming systems and has ZERO problem with them. He even teaches his students how various systems reconcile to the shot line using his templates.
You have to PM him half a tip to the left.
Unless it's a "defensive" message. Then you have to "ghost ball double the distance" PM him.
On it.........
That will be the day, you 'simplify' anything, John!..You may not have noticed, but your average reply (in defending aiming systems) has jumped from about 500 words, to 3 or 4000 per post!..Its OK though, as most of your ranting is 'rinse and repeat'!...You have not said anything 'new', in about 5 yrs. now! :sorry:
PS..Isn't it about time for a new 'refined' video, explaining CTE?..Puhleeeeeeeze John, give it a rest!
That will be the day, you 'simplify' anything, John!..You may not have noticed, but your average reply (in defending aiming systems) has jumped from about 500 words, to 3 or 4000 per post!..Its OK though, as most of your ranting is 'rinse and repeat'!...You have not said anything 'new', in about 5 yrs. now! :sorry:
PS..Isn't it about time for a new 'refined' video, explaining CTE?..Puhleeeeeeeze John, give it a rest!
Next video will be short.
less than one minute.
SJD says:
Pool peaked in 1975. If you can't run a rack within a week of picking up a cue you don't have it and should try a different activity. I was great and you will never be.
The end.
Thanks, Joey!
I appreciate your comments. I hope that I can share my work with you at some point. Our door is always open.
Stan Shuffett
I am a pool nut so I became a sponge and learned much from yourself and some of the guys at Kolbys. I have been fortunate to be around some good players watching them for countless hours along with picking their brain. I should be better then I am if I had more time on the table. It is great to know the moves and beat guys to the shot which I did okay but I was a bit gun shy as my pocketing was not so hot.Even though I haven't seen you in several years Lenny, it has been great watching your improvement on the streams!..I would like to think maybe you learned a few things from
the old days, when I used to play you '9 to close'!
And obviously, playing with better players, like Scott and Bernie, has also given you a lot of valuable experience and confidence in your decisions (moves) playing one pocket! ..That means more than all the 'aiming' tricks you could ever learn!..'Fundamentals and feel', will always be where its at in pool!(don't listen to Barton!)
PS..Please tell Jimmy, and all the gang at Kolby's, I said hi! :thumbup:
I have worked on that and it has really helped me to improve using this shaft aiming method as a guide. It is not a magic bullet but gets me close to making the ball, the rest is hitting enough balls to be precise. No substitute for quality table time whether its practice, tournaments or action.
have you decided to stream your upcoming match, from what i hear your game has improved by 2 to 3 balls---doesn't surprise me
Justin will stream it on his Facebook account. I might stream it as well if the bandwidth will support it.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk
I've found shaft aiming to work well to get more precise points of aim that as I've got older I don't see as well when I was younger I could see nat shit on a ball and hit it not so good at that now works really good at back cut balls in the sides with inside English
It's great stuff easy to learn , IMHO the easiest "Method " of aiming to learn bar none
1
Nien, nien, nien, you must not learn "short cuts", you must only hit one million balls, you must not "aim", you must suffer for years, you must do it just like everyone else, because they all know exactly how other folks should learn stuff. There is ONLY one way, and it's their way.
How dare you Leonard
Nien, nien, nien, you must not learn "short cuts", you must only hit one million balls, you must not "aim", you must suffer for years, you must do it just like everyone else, because they all know exactly how other folks should learn stuff. There is ONLY one way, and it's their way.
How dare you Leonard
Ya it's almost cheating but it's by far the easiest to learn because it's basicly point and shoot like a gun , it has variables when you need English but it's pretty simple plug and play method , Iv shown this to countless players and they all love it
1
Good point Mr.Greek!..Unlike ChicagoRJ, who can not understand why he is still an APA 3, after 30 yrs. of trying various 'aiming systems'!..He wonders why a guy like FastLenny, has flown past him, in less than half the time?
Nien, nien, nien, Lenny, you must not learn "short cuts", you must only hit one million balls, you must not "aim", you must suffer for years, you must do it just like everyone else, because they all know exactly how other folks should learn stuff. There is ONLY one way, and it's their way. How dare you Leonard
PS..But, like the typical Chicagoan, RJ will ignore common sense, even when Lenny explains it in great detail to him! :embarrassed2:
Last edited: