Man, pool halls are dangerous

once he turned on you, you were justified. before that the circumstances determine what happens. they are not always what they appear to be.

there have been many times someone saw a man beating up a lady so jumped in to protect her and got stabbed or shot by the lady(wife) for hurting her husband.
 
manwon said:
Thanks very much for the support and thankfully the Tacoma prosecutor also saw things from my perspective. As far as Rittenhouse is concerned, I just think he was completely wrong. He intentionally placed himself in that situation. I don't know what he was thinking, but it appears that he thought he was a big shot because he had a gun.

That's really a stupid way to approach things and there are many people who also feel like a gun gives them strength and power that they normally wouldn't have. I've seen people pull guns over the most ridiculous little bit things, and it makes me wanna just slap them across the face. Guns are not a joke. They're not a toy and they shouldn't be treated as such. My philosophy always was very simple never pull my pistol unless I'm gonna shoot someone I lived by after 40 years and the one time I had to pull my pistol I follow through.

However, today, I would have to rethink that because the political climate could support me or fail me based upon whims and the political party that runs the city where the event occurred. Washington state is run by Democrats and today their liberal views are very very strong under today's circumstances, I may have been prosecuted, it's very hard to know for certain. And.

Whether someone would try to save my life under those same circumstances or not, doesn't really matter to me. My actions were based upon my beliefs, and frankly I could care less how other feel about the situation. I believe I did the right thing and that's all I need to feel like I was vindicated. Like I said, under the same circumstances, I would probably do the same thing again. Because it doesn't take conscious thought, it's a reaction to a situation that has turned deadly in my presence. And with that thought in mind taking out a thread just seems like the logical thing to do it could be because of my military background I'm not certain, but I am certain of how I would respond under those circumstances again..
Click to expand...


Craig, I strongly agree with all of your posts! Might not on the cases you cited because I am not familiar with them but very doubtful I would think any different than you.

I found concealed carry to be inhibiting. There were several times teeth would have flown except I was carrying. I was all too aware that if things escalated I probably would face lawyers blaming me for the incident. If I had ever had to shoot someone I very much wanted it to be a good shooting in the eyes of the law.

One time that was very close, I was alone facing an angry mob of hundreds. It was late night/early morning and I was counting on the noise and fire from the 357 snubby causing as much panic as the damage I did but I had plenty of time for thinking while talking and I would be shooting as fast as I could just below about elbow high so every shot was likely to wound multiple people and some fatalities were almost a given. My truck had a large push bumper and if I managed to get in it I was hanging it in granny gear and certainly running over some people getting to the highway also. I was just there doing my job, I was going to defend myself before going down in front of a mob. I wouldn't like my position In a court room but the front of the mob was jammed not much over a foot from me and the members further back egging them on.

If I was so much as touched I was going to start shooting. A matter of better to be judged by twelve than carried by six! Thinking about it, 24 hour wrecker services got me in more hairy situations than pool ever did.

Hu
 
ShootingArts said:
Craig, I strongly agree with all of your posts! Might not on the cases you cited because I am not familiar with them but very doubtful I would think any different than you.

I found concealed carry to be inhibiting. There were several times teeth would have flown except I was carrying. I was all too aware that if things escalated I probably would face lawyers blaming me for the incident. If I had ever had to shoot someone I very much wanted it to be a good shooting in the eyes of the law.

One time that was very close, I was alone facing an angry mob of hundreds. It was late night/early morning and I was counting on the noise and fire from the 357 snubby causing as much panic as the damage I did but I had plenty of time for thinking while talking and I would be shooting as fast as I could just below about elbow high so every shot was likely to wound multiple people and some fatalities were almost a given. My truck had a large push bumper and if I managed to get in it I was hanging it in granny gear and certainly running over some people getting to the highway also. I was just there doing my job, I was going to defend myself before going down in front of a mob. I wouldn't like my position In a court room but the front of the mob was jammed not much over a foot from me and the members further back egging them on.

If I was so much as touched I was going to start shooting. A matter of better to be judged by twelve than carried by six! Thinking about it, 24 hour wrecker services got me in more hairy situations than pool ever did.

Hu
Click to expand...
Hu, I have never been in a situation like that, but one thing is for certain I would not have pulled my gun. I think you handed things the right way I mean hindsight is 2020. As far as being judged by 12 or carried by six, I would certainly also like to be judge 12. I imagine you’re confronted by that many people your survival instinct kicks in and you’re running on adrenaline. I think the way you handled it is good and not pulling the pistol unless someone lay hands on you is the right decision. I think you’re just lucky you got away!!
 
If you own a gun or actually carry one, you are hoping you never need a lawyer.

Guess what? Hope is neither a defensive tactic and is really a lousy winning strategy.

If you ever had to shoot anyone, it is going to cost you a lot of money hiring an attorney
since even if your local DA decides it was a righteous shoot, you can still be suited by the
relatives of the person you killed. Wrongful deaths suits are expensive and the fact you were
never criminally charged in no way relieves you, nor is it a allowable defense for escaping civil
litigation. So make sure you have separate insurance coverage for any gun shooting.

It costs about $1.30 a day and we both know you piss more than that away every day and never
give it a second thought. If you shot someone, you ended the physical threat & just created the
opportunity for a very expensive financial threat that could easily lead to actually bankrupting you
 
manwon said:
Hu, I have never been in a situation like that, but one thing is for certain I would not have pulled my gun. I think you handed things the right way I mean hindsight is 2020. As far as being judged by 12 or carried by six, I would certainly also like to be judge 12. I imagine you’re confronted by that many people your survival instinct kicks in and you’re running on adrenaline. I think the way you handled it is good and not pulling the pistol unless someone lay hands on you is the right decision. I think you’re just lucky you got away!!
Click to expand...

I was lucky, and not totally unknown. Sudden acts of violence happened now and then. Redneck town. I ran for city, state, and sheriff's departments but besides that I ran for the Federal Housing Agency. Ran fair all the way around but just the way it went when towing from the projects I was often facing angry crowds/mobs of twenty to sixty people. Three to five hundred or so was definitely a bit bigger than I was used to and I was sure I wasn't the Lone Ranger with a gun that night. The gun hung upside down under my left arm and it was almost impossible to block my draw.

Had I drawn not shooting wouldn't have been an option legally, but more importantly at the moment, I didn't want the crowd to have time to think about it. The shock value of the gun out and blasting was important. I was directly interacting with a half-dozen in front of me but there were more that were inclined to sneak in from the sides with or without a gun or knife. It was possible to climb on my truck bed and come at me from behind too. Can't give the cowards too much time to get brave plus a honky-tonk with a capacity of fifteen hundred had just closed down and we were in the back parking lot. Almost all of these people were drinking or drunk!

Never saw any advantage to cowering down to a mob so I was strongly stating my case, might have made the more aggressive guys upfront a little unsure. I was towing at an owner request but the mob assumed I was towing for the police! A few in the crowd might have been customers and friendly with me but nobody was speaking up. Most of the front seventy-five or a hundred were angry thinking I was towing a young lady's car for the police, I wasn't paying much attention to more than the thirty or so I had to get through to get to the driver's door of my wrecker! Engine was running to use the hydraulics and my first choice was to get in the truck and get out of Dodge.

That is what finally happened after long minutes. The crowd eased back enough I could squeeze between them and the wrecker. I crept to the highway in granny gear and never looked back. Could have made national headlines especially since the crowd was black and I am white and while race didn't have a thing to do with it, it would get into news stories. If the gun had to come out there would have been a half-dozen or more dead, the only question was would that include me.

Hu
 
craig was 100% justified.

(to keep it pool related)

while working 3rd shift at the pool room, I heard some kids were beating up a another kid in the parking lot.

turned out to be some Vietnamese kids beating on a Vietnamese kid I knew as a customer. I went out and ran them off. the kid I knew stayed but didn't thank me. as it turns out he was joining their gang and this was his beat down.

guess you got to pick your battles.

m.c.
 
manwon said:
Thanks for the post and I’m fully aware that under different circumstances I could’ve very easily have been prosecuted. But the circumstances that occurred when I shot that guy clearly identified him as the aggressive and dangerous individual. The restaurant was full of people, and they were at least seven statements taken from other customers who witnessed everything that occurred not to mention the restaurant had multiple video cameras that filmed the entire event.

Plus, the guy had already stabbed one person so his intentions were clear and it made him fair game. When confronted with a situation like the one I was, there is only one reason to shoot someone and that is to end the threat. Shooting someone in the leg, the arm or the foot is a joke no one does it, dead center mass is the only place to aim under those circumstances. If someone can’t do it for whatever reason, they should never pull a gun because the odds are that they will become a victim.
Click to expand...
I understand. But if you did that today, I dont think it would be the same. (Because of the politics today)
 
white1 said:
Pool rooms been dangerous since they were born. Adds to their mystique
Click to expand...
Where I grew up playing, the greatest danger was from the room manager. He kept a sawed-off baseball bat (center drilled/filled with lead) behind the counter, and very actively encouraged the ‘library’ atmosphere of the place. Which explains my lack of sympathy for those Ecuadorian victims patronizing any room with a loud jukebox 😎.
 
loggerhead12 said:
Depends on what state you're in. Most still allow self-defense.
Click to expand...

Yeah, my state goes by the 21' rule last I knew. Started off with a fuss because the police were shooting people who had clubs and knives. The police gave plastic guns to some of the state legislators and had them try to simulate defending themselves from attackers inside 21'. The legislators quickly found it was shoot immediately or the attacker with club or knife had the advantage. The 21' rule was quickly applied to concealed carry too.

One thing rarely mentioned, concealed carry often saves lives on all sides. There is a story of an angry mob I negotiated with elsewhere in this thread. There were a handful more times when had I not been carrying a firearm the disparity of force would have left me no choice but to act first. The reason I bought a carry gun to begin with was that I almost had to use a five pound steel hook to defend myself one night. The would be attacker would have been just as dead but I would have been in more trouble. I learned from a case where a friend had to defend himself and his family, if you kill somebody, neatness counts!

Another thing, "Shall Issue" states are far safer. It was kinda funny, our vehicle is an extension of our home in my state, quite legal to have a firearm in your vehicle. However, the day shall issue went into effect in my state, roadrage incidents went down over 90%! An armed society really is a polite society. Much more recently, I had a minor altercation with two young men. One was middle sized, the other was the biggest man I have seen in decades. The giant was the one pulling back. If this crazy old white man wasn't intimidated he was probably carrying, ready, and willing to shoot somebody!

Just the fact that the average person could be carrying is a deterrent to crime and violence.

Hu
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top