Mark Wilson & Don Wardell, M.D.

Scott you're having problems with the message. You said "I've known Mark personally for more than 25 years" Nobody is trying to "hard sell" anybody.

If you don't think the things that are posted by Mr. Don are hard sells, then that's your opinion. You have to have this book, no collection is complete without this book, the only book about pool that teaches the proper way. Oh, OK, lets see a little bit, I mean Scott you can't say that Amazon has it wrong when you can look at most all books on their site can you?

But this book is different from every other book on pool, OK.


Scott Lee said:
Wow...just wow! Where is it that you missed the part about Mark and Don not caring if ANYBODY bought the book! Don is a freaking doctor man, he didn't help Mark out to make $$$...he makes plenty with his real job. The book has been a labor of love for Mark for more than 2 decades...and it's finally finished. If you don't want to buy it...fine...don't. But quit pissing on somebody's life work. They obviously don't want to put any of the book "out there", with the exception of being able to see/touch/scan/read it in person somewhere like at the DCC...so give it a rest. I've known Mark personally for more than 25 years. Nobody is trying to 'hard sell' anybody...for cryin' out loud. Nothing wrong with being proud of a lifelong accomplishment. :rolleyes:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
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1) The author doesn't care if the book is sold on Amazon or not.

2) It is the culmination of one of the top professional player/instructor's lifelong career.

3) Mark heads the ONLY real collegiate billiards training program in the USA (maybe anywhere)...Okay, it's new, but he already has some of the best junior players in the country enrolled in the program...how can that be bad?

4) So Don is enthusiastic about the book...big deal...you can be sure it's not because he wants or needs the publicity (he already stated he doesn't).

5) Buy it...or don't! In the end, it doesn't matter.

...and last, but not least...

6) Remember what your mama taught you...at least I hope she taught you..."If you don't have something nice to say...say nothing at all."

I think I covered everything...

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

tommyceilings said:
Scott you're having problems with the message. You said "I've known Mark personally for more than 25 years" Nobody is trying to "hard sell" anybody.

If you don't think the things that are posted by Mr. Don are hard sells, then that's your opinion. You have to have this book, no collection is complete without this book, the only book about pool that teaches the proper way. Oh, OK, lets see a little bit, I mean Scott you can't say that Amazon has it wrong when you can look at most all books on their site can you?

But this book is different from every other book on pool, OK.
Click to expand...
 
tommyceilings said:
Give the hard sell a break.

It gets tiring listening to you and your "you have to own this book, you are at a loss if you don't have this book, there is no better book ever written."

As far as posting a part of the book, your idea of "is not a work of fiction where a sample of style might influence someone to read it." is totally untrue. In fact, I've talked to a number of book dealers and collectors all of whom are completely unfamiliar with your previous writings.

If you aren't willing to post a few pages (tell me how the book can be pirated when you post a few pages,) then there are a lot of people unwilling to purchase it.

P.S. Check Amazon or most other online sites, you can read a portion of most every book, well except Willie's book. You know Willie, the guy who has read practically every book about pool in the English language.
Click to expand...

tommyceilings said:
Scott you're having problems with the message. You said "I've known Mark personally for more than 25 years" Nobody is trying to "hard sell" anybody.

If you don't think the things that are posted by Mr. Don are hard sells, then that's your opinion. You have to have this book, no collection is complete without this book, the only book about pool that teaches the proper way. Oh, OK, lets see a little bit, I mean Scott you can't say that Amazon has it wrong when you can look at most all books on their site can you?

But this book is different from every other book on pool, OK.
Click to expand...

I've read it, and I've read a whole lot of what is out there. There is NO other book like it out there.

That is just the opinion of someone who HAS read it. Your opinion is of someone who has NOT read it. Yet, you see no problem in giving a review of something you haven't even seen. I don't see where many, if anyone, is going to give your review any weight at all.
 
Williebetmore said:
He also has an extensive list of required and recommended study materials so he did not have to "reinvent the wheel" like most of the "normal pool books," and could make his book unique.
Click to expand...

Is this list in the book? I didn't see it on the website. Is it possible to get access to this list without buying the book first? I want the book, but I can tell you that it won't be my next purchase.

thanks
Fatz
 
tommyceilings said:
Give the hard sell a break.

It gets tiring listening to you and your "you have to own this book, you are at a loss if you don't have this book, there is no better book ever written."

As far as posting a part of the book, your idea of "is not a work of fiction where a sample of style might influence someone to read it." is totally untrue. In fact, I've talked to a number of book dealers and collectors all of whom are completely unfamiliar with your previous writings.

If you aren't willing to post a few pages (tell me how the book can be pirated when you post a few pages,) then there are a lot of people unwilling to purchase it.

P.S. Check Amazon or most other online sites, you can read a portion of most every book, well except Willie's book. You know Willie, the guy who has read practically every book about pool in the English language.
Click to expand...

TommyC,
No hard sell here. I would prefer if you do NOT buy this book. Not trying to be unpleasant about it, but this book was NOT meant for people like you. I hope this convinces you once and for all to NOT buy it. Not kidding at all.

P.S. - I am not starting ANY threads regarding this book; and am only responding to posts from people that seem interested, and who I've known and respected through AZB for many years (which list used to include you :-)). I am happy to provide my TOTALLY biased opinion to people who seem to be requesting it...which is the point of AZB; I'm sure everyone understands that...with the possible exception of you :-).

P.P.S. - I HAVE read (and own) virtually every pool book in the English language that I want (some are so short and paltry that I choose not to own them). Elvicash has a similar library. Do you?
 
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Williebetmore said:
TommyC,
No hard sell here. I would prefer if you do NOT buy this book. Not trying to be unpleasant about it, but this book was NOT meant for people like you. I hope this convinces you once and for all to NOT buy it. Not kidding at all.
Click to expand...

Doc, THAT is how you sell it and I think that is what Tommy was trying to convey to you and Mark.

Tell us who this book is for. Complete this sentence:

"This book is for people who _______________."

Then the reader of your explanation can identify (or not) with that Person and choose to buy it or not and decide if it is the best book ever or not, etc.

Jeff Livingston
 
chefjeff said:
Doc, THAT is how you sell it and I think that is what Tommy was trying to convey to you and Mark.

Tell us who this book is for. Complete this sentence:

"This book is for people who _______________."

Then the reader of your explanation can identify (or not) with that Person and choose to buy it or not and decide if it is the best book ever or not, etc.

Jeff Livingston
Click to expand...

Are serious students of the game.
 
chefjeff said:
Doc, THAT is how you sell it and I think that is what Tommy was trying to convey to you and Mark.

Tell us who this book is for. Complete this sentence:

"This book is for people who _______________."

Then the reader of your explanation can identify (or not) with that Person and choose to buy it or not and decide if it is the best book ever or not, etc.

Jeff Livingston
Click to expand...

Chef-man,
This book is for people:
who love the game,

want to love the game,

want to reach the highest level of play,

want to just improve a bit,

want to hear the thoughts of a man who has devoted almost 40 years to a single-minded pursuit of pool,

want to make their limited practice time as productive as possible,

want to see an accomplished player and instructor approach the subject in a scholarly and scientific manner,

want to hear some road stories written from a quite unusual perspective,

want to know more about Navy SEAL training and how those principles apply to excelling at anything (including pool),

want to know what resources such an instructor considers essential,

want a "shortcut" to the laborious process of developing proficiency,

want to read a heart warming story about EARL STRICKLAND!,

want to know why they CAN become good or great if they choose, no matter their level of "natural ability"


Jeff, these were some of our goals starting out, and while the list sounds quite ambitious, I think these goals were reached to our satisfaction. I desperately hope readers will agree...or I have failed Mark.
 
Neil said:
Are serious students of the game.
Click to expand...

Not enough info. More details for potential buyers.

Get fully into even just one reason, if that's all you've got. Tell your short story about what did not work before,then tell about reading the book and then tell the bennies you got from integrating the book into your game.

For example:

"Before reading this book I was really just guessing about different things in my game.
I'd shoot shots and not understand why I missed. I had read other books but those didn't have the
meat and potatoes I was looking for. Then I read this book and learned more about my shots than
I even knew before. It was exciting learning this new information and making more balls and winning
more games than ever before. After I had read it and started using it, I went out that week and won
my first tournament in years and others have started telling me that I am shooting much better pool
than before. Do you know anyone who might like to know about a book like that?"

THAT will sell books.


Jeff Livingston
 
chefjeff said:
Doc, THAT is how you sell it and I think that is what Tommy was trying to convey to you and Mark.

Tell us who this book is for. Complete this sentence:

"This book is for people who __Have a real job_____________."

Then the reader of your explanation can identify (or not) with that Person and choose to buy it or not and decide if it is the best book ever or not, etc.

Jeff Livingston
Click to expand...

Not for those who will miss their rent over $70
 
chefjeff said:
Not enough info. More details for potential buyers.

Get fully into even just one reason, if that's all you've got. Tell your short story about what did not work before,then tell about reading the book and then tell the bennies you got from integrating the book into your game.


THAT will sell books.


Jeff Livingston
Click to expand...

JL,
WOW!!! You want a lot :-). The book is tough enough to plow through without the obligation of then writing a detailed manuscript of your thoughts :-).

I think Neil is possibly the very first person to read it all the way through (if he's through it). I think his description is SPOT ON! No more needs said, Neil has summed it up cogently. Had I read his description first, I wouldn't have posted my rambling, lengthy list :-). Neil will understand we are not "selling" we are "sharing." No one will agree with everything in it; but every serious player will find something of value.
 
Well now I understand why the book is nearly a secret. Who wants to put up with this?

Williebetmore, I'm a professional salesman. The product is high end tooling = Mucho $$. For example a SMALL Impact Wrench I sell for nearly $1K each. When I hear things like this, I shut up and walk. The customer is happy where they are and will never see the benefit. They have no clue of the difference of Price vs Cost and no willingness to experience the difference.

I very much appreciate your help. Seems it should have been via PM.

Time to walk Willie!!
 
chefjeff said:
After I had read it and started using it, I went out that week and won
my first tournament in years


Jeff Livingston
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Jeff,
It is also worth pointing out that your description above is EXACTLY the type of thinking this book hopes to dispel. Pool proficiency is NOT a quick fix, "one lesson and I was great." It is the first book to describe the obstacles that must be overcome; and the first to describe the extent of the labor necessary to become good. It is NOT quick, and it is NOT easy...but with Mark's method it is possible for anyone who wants to do the hard work. At least they will have a fighting chance with Mark's method, but most will choose to avoid the hard work...it is the nature of things. Hopefully the most realistic view of how difficult pool really is.
 
I am sure that I wish to continually improve my ability to strike the cue ball correctly.

My check in on its way. Hope to receive this as a early Christmas gift for myself.

It appears that you are the author, publisher and shipping department of this text. It must be a work of love to have committed so much of your time and knowledge to a project that will never pay for the effort expended.

I wanted to Thank You for doing it. I will try and use the information provided to improve pass the Banger level.
 
Williebetmore said:
Jeff,
It is also worth pointing out that your description above is EXACTLY the type of thinking this book hopes to dispel. Pool proficiency is NOT a quick fix, "one lesson and I was great." It is the first book to describe the obstacles that must be overcome; and the first to describe the extent of the labor necessary to become good. It is NOT quick, and it is NOT easy...but with Mark's method it is possible for anyone who wants to do the hard work. At least they will have a fighting chance with Mark's method, but most will choose to avoid the hard work...it is the nature of things. Hopefully the most realistic view of how difficult pool really is.
Click to expand...

That helps.

I was just throwing out an example of how to tell who this book is for, not attempting to tell about this exact book (that I haven't read).



How about this? This book is for those who....

It's for those who are sick of looking for quick fixes that don't really exist and are tired of wasting time and money trying every bit of bad advice. It is for those who are so serious about their games that they will spend many hours, not just reading, but experimenting with every page's advice from a known professional player and teacher. It is an ongoing workbook to glean the information the pros have worked on their entire careers to become the best. If you've spent more than $80 on table time and still aren't much better, the next $80 you spend might be better spent on this book first.


How's that? Are we closer to what type of Person would want to buy this book?


Jeff Livingston
 
thanks so much

Thanks so much for starting this thread. I went to the website and will get the check in the mail later today. I truly appreciate this information.
Sincerely,
Phil Dade
 
chefjeff said:
That helps.

I was just throwing out an example of how to tell who this book is for, not attempting to tell about this exact book (that I haven't read).



How about this? This book is for those who....

It's for those who are sick of looking for quick fixes that don't really exist and are tired of wasting time and money trying every bit of bad advice. It is for those who are so serious about their games that they will spend many hours, not just reading, but experimenting with every page's advice from a known professional player and teacher. It is an ongoing workbook to glean the information the pros have worked on their entire careers to become the best. If you've spent more than $80 on table time and still aren't much better, the next $80 you spend might be better spent on this book first.


How's that? Are we closer to what type of Person would want to buy this book?


Jeff Livingston
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Chef,
That was eerily correct...are you sure you haven't read it already????????

P.S. - saying "I don't care if anyone buys the book" does not preclude me from also saying "I hope a lot of people will buy it and find it incredibly useful." I think you get it, but many will not. Until things get too hateful, I will continue to try to answer questions or concerns...AZB is like my family, just trying to contribute, not sell.
 
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One more bit of essential clarification for my friends.

This book is Mark's dream; but if you bother to read it, you will find that he did NOT claim to have developed everything in it; but clearly wants to share all the things he has picked up from his mentors throughout the years. The book is really meant as an homage to those in the pool world who have shared with Mark...it is as much their book as his book.

Sailor Stellman, Jerry Briesath, Dallas West, Jeff Carter, Bob Moore, Efren Reyes, Jeanette Lee, Ralf Souquet, Jimmy White, Earl Strickland, Steve Davis, Luther Lassiter, Minnesota Fats, Louis Roberts, Robert Byrne, and Joe Tucker are all names that have contributed unknowingly to this book; and the authors are eternally grateful to them.
 
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