Message from Allen Hopkins

[av84fun]

River City...Your post was SPOT ON. The players are now being quoted as being against any settlement on ground of personal integrity and self respect. I admire that although I am on record as being careful about the final "settle vs. sue" decision.

But as you point out, the problem with the IPT is its top management who are known liars. So, if the Devil himself decides to start a pool tour offering big money...I would hope that the players would refuse to join.

THAT is the problem with AH's post. He is suggesting that the likes of KT be "given a chance" to make things right...or words to that effect.

Regards,
Jim

 

[worriedbeef]

Worriedbeef...<<He's not brown-nosing KT like some people seem to think, but he's trying to look at things constructively. All he's saying is surely it's more beneficial for all concerned, not just the players but indeed the game of pool itself, if we leave suing Mr Trudeau to a last resort, and try and back him to the hilt and encourage him, trying to make sure this IPT stays alive!>>

I won't use the phrase "brown-nosing." That was your expression. But AH was CERTAINLY being "supportive" of KT and so, without question, are you.

Thats OK! You have the complete right to express that view. But when you or AH is criticized for that view, don't object to those criticisms on the theory that you were not being supportive...because you ARE by the clear language of your post and AH's.

<<and the most constructive thing the players can do in my opinion is support KT and urge him to keep this tour going. regardless of the sour taste it may leave in some's mouth.>>

Again...OK...but how much of a sour taste was left in YOUR mouth? How much does the IPT owe YOU? It is pretty empty to suggest to people who are owed ,in some cases, HUGE sums of money, that they should but "constructive" toward someone who owes them money as is now...officially...refusing to pay in full.

Regards,
Jim

Just to come back and say i do understand the sentiments of your post. And I do understand that inevitably not being a pro player myself it's always gonna be said that "I'm not owed any money myself" therefore my opinion is less valid. not that you said that btw, it's just a point of view that's been branded about quite a bit in all the IPT debate. but i would just like to reiterate, ultimately the reason for my opinion is because I'm on the players, and the game's side! When i spoke about "being constrctive", I'm stressing that the players and the game of pool will be ten times better off with the IPT working and working well. I just don't want to see it's chances of surviving dealt a blow because of the players being rash, emotive, and angry. understanderble maybe, but the result would be a sad one in the end if it came to that.

 

[ironman]

I'm not saying that the players got what they asked for, and neither is Allen Hopkins. All I'm saying is that before laying blame elsewhere, look within. A con man or a hustler can only be successful if the target is ignorant of the con or the hustle. Pool players have plenty of experience being screwed in the past, so they weren't ignorant of the possibilities.

-djb

I agree. Had he been made to post, none of the players would be in this situation. But, KT assured everyone that he had indeed posted {escrowed} the money to fund the tour. Nobody on the planet had the stones to question this.

None of the players would have stood up had someone decided to Unite before Orlando. Nobody wanted to rock the boat.

The man stood there and told lie after lie. Still doing it.

Now, AFTER THE EVENT,,,,,, the prize money is reduced? The players get 1/3 what they were PROMISED,,,,, and now it's turn the other cheek and help poor KT on next year? What will the prize funds be next year,,,, 30 million? Air is air!!!

 

[Fuji-whopper]

Good point, there is no one that is checking on the "promises" that were made. We need a spokesperson for pool, which may be a start for a union or association that is so badly needed.

Any volunteers?

 

[Timberly]

I just don't want to see it's chances of surviving dealt a blow because of the players being rash, emotive, and angry. understanderble maybe, but the result would be a sad one in the end if it came to that.

Out of curiosity.... what gives you the impression that the IPT is going to, or would continue if the players didn't go through with this?

Please do not take my question as an attack, I truly do not mean it that way. When I see people post this type of message, I'm honestly curious as to what has happened and/or been said that leads people to believe that the tour will continue?

Thanks

 

[worriedbeef]

because technically, the IPT is still here and operating, and hasn't died. Obviosuly i completely undertstand the arguments people say about "the IPT ceased to be alive and well when the money wasn't paid, etc etc, but the fact is, it's still here.

all i am saying is it would be a bit sad i think if we end up with a big lawsuit and trial etc, and even if the players win and get 100% of their money, would that really be as much as a positive as the IPT staying afloat? Maybe I'm wrong hoever in taking it as a given that if there was a legal battle, the IPT wouldn't continue any more! but it just seems likely and common sense.

And besides, in many ways your question Timberly is an irrelevant one - i may very well be being extremely optimistic - the probability of the IPT surviving might well be low, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't still do all we can to keep it afloat. A continuing IPT for me, is the best possible outcome in all this and benefits more people more than anything else. that pretty much sums up my whole opinion in this whole debacle.

And i understand you didn't mean your post as an attack btw.

 

[!Smorgass Bored]

What Were You Thinking ?

Good point, there is no one that is checking on the "promises" that were made. We need a spokesperson for pool, which may be a start for a union or association that is so badly needed.

Any volunteers?

Volunteers? You mean that if I (me) volunteered, that I'd be chosen to represent 'somebody' or 'something' ? I can't quite put my finger on the flaw in this reasoning.....
Doug
( I'm shaking it here,boss. I'm shaking it. <from Cool Hand Luke> )
.
.
.
.

 

[JimmyB500]

Smorg-You a natural born WORLD SHAKER. That's what you are. Gotta learn the rules though. Or you spend a night in the box...........

 

[!Smorgass Bored]

Gettin My Dirt Outta Boss Keene's Ditch

Smorg-You a natural born WORLD SHAKER. That's what you are. Gotta learn the rules though. Or you spend a night in the box...........

I can eat fifty-ONE hard boiled eggs....
Doug
( BURP ! Excuuuuuuse ME )

 

[Timberly]

And i understand you didn't mean your post as an attack btw.

I'm glad you understand that and thank you for your honest reply.

I'm just one of those people that looks at things in the literal sense. I take what I'm given and apply what is common sense to me. Everyone thinks they have common sense but we all know that common sense isn't all that common. To others, I might be one of those people that actually has no common sense, but to myself... I of course have all the answers. J/K!! Anyway, I apply (my) common sense to what I've seen and heard from the IPT and it is my opinion (and I of course could be wrong, none of us know for sure) that if all the players agreed to the lesser payment, the IPT would still end up not continuing the tour.

At this point, I just don't see it happening. They cut the 2007 schedule from something like 11 events to 7 and the events weren't going to start until June or July, then they canceled London, lied time after time about the checks, postponed the rest of the events without a re-scheduled date.... To me, in my mind... all of these things add up to say that there isn't going to be a tour next yr, regardless of whether the players accept the 1/3 or whether the sue.

That's just me and my way of thinking. I guess I'm not as optimistic as some. I would like to be more optimistic but my brain doesn't see the logic in it, no matter how much my heart wants it to.