Mosconi Cup 2024, Nov. 30-Dec. 3, Orlando

jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
Silver Member
No doubt, the "AZB asterisk squad" will put an asterisk next to any Team USA victory this year. I root for Team USA, but fully understand that beating a Filler-less Team Europe would be a heavily watered-down accomplishment.
The whole thing is for entertainment, there's not a single rational person that would bet USA over Europe in a round robin race to 20 where every player from both teams play each other.

I want usa to win but there are just too many likeable players from Europe to root against them.
 

sneakynito

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I don't have a problem with Gorst playing for Team USA. He lives in the USA and is paying taxes here.

And it's not like Russia is part of European culture anyway, they are only in Europe because of geography.

My problem is the absence of Filler. The credibility of the tournament has been damaged.

And Billy Thorpe getting the wild-card over Oscar Dominguez is ridiculous. Oscar has worked his ass off the entire year and accumulated more points than Billy.

We all know Skyler and Billy are friends.

MC is about entertainment. If it was supposed to be about credibly finding out who the best pool players are then there wouldn't be race to 5 9ball scotch doubles matches in the tourney.

Billy is more entertaining than Oscar. And Filler's image is currently soured.

The decisions make sense to me, and are probably better for pool, as I'd bet most people who end up seeing the event on TV have no idea who these people are anyways.
We're better off with them bringing solid pool players with big personalities than just whoever shot the straightest all year imo.
 

bud green

Dolley and Django
Silver Member
What's the losing team get per player, 20 grand?

Big payday opportunity lost for Oscar win or lose.

I like Billy, and hope he plays well, but I'd be pretty disappointed if I was Oscar.
 

The_JV

'AZB_Combat Certified'
MC is about entertainment. <snip>

Billy is more entertaining than Oscar. And Filler's image is currently soured.
Two different things at play here though.
  1. Billy is a captain's pick which I'm sure is on some level vetted by MR. Team USA already has a emotionless robot in Tyler that they can't deny based on qualification. No need to double down on that boredom with Oscar. I'm not a fan of Billy's game in the slightest and he is better served petting a rabbit during the pre-event interviews then being passed the mic. However, he will be the emotional leader without a doubt, and as someone earlier said. If he can fire up his teammates then he'll indirectly effect their performance.
  2. Filler is being taught that if you nip at the hand that's attempting to feed you, then you won't be offered desert. This has nothing to do with Filler's image and everything to do with MR opting to take a promoter's stance on someone who has to some degree hurt their promotion efforts. It's that simple. If anything the choice was a hard one for MR. Hate sells, and there's no higher concentration of hate for FIller than in the US.
The decisions make sense to me, and are probably better for pool, as I'd bet most people who end up seeing the event on TV have no idea who these people are anyways.
Yes, and maybe. The mosconi may just be the one event all year that is produced in such a manner that may catch the eye of the "channel surfer". I for one couldn't care less about pro darts, but admit I'll stop and take a gander when you see those crowds in the background.
We're better off with them bringing solid pool players with big personalities than just whoever shot the straightest all year imo.
100% agree.... skill aside, this is the reason you will see Mr Shaw at this event until he gets bored of it.
 

The_JV

'AZB_Combat Certified'
If you saw Oscar's FB post, he stated he is not chasing points next year...only playing the select tourney's that make sense for him and his family. It's a shame.
Yes, major shame. For fans of Oscar and for the NA pool scene. The continued captains (you're my buddy) favoritism in the USA picks throughout the last several years is what has made this event a joke. It hasn't been about your best team for a very low time. That said, you do have Tyler playing. Although not a Mosconi juggernaut, he has earned it.
 

jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
Silver Member
Two different things at play here though.
  1. Billy is a captain's pick which I'm sure is on some level vetted by MR. Team USA already has a emotionless robot in Tyler that they can't deny based on qualification. No need to double down on that boredom with Oscar. I'm not a fan of Billy's game in the slightest and he is better served petting a rabbit during the pre-event interviews then being passed the mic. However, he will be the emotional leader without a doubt, and as someone earlier said. If he can fire up his teammates then he'll indirectly effect their performance.
  2. Filler is being taught that if you nip at the hand that's attempting to feed you, then you won't be offered desert. This has nothing to do with Filler's image and everything to do with MR opting to take a promoter's stance on someone who has to some degree hurt their promotion efforts. It's that simple. If anything the choice was a hard one for MR. Hate sells, and there's no higher concentration of hate for FIller than in the US.

Yes, and maybe. The mosconi may just be the one event all year that is produced in such a manner that may catch the eye of the "channel surfer". I for one couldn't care less about pro darts, but admit I'll stop and take a gander when you see those crowds in the background.

100% agree.... skill aside, this is the reason you will see Mr Shaw at this event until he gets bored of it.
Filler skipping an event = bad

MR forcing Filler out of 2 massive events(viewer wise) = good??? Make it make sense

Apparently Filler skipping an event isn't that important .

Not directed at you, just thinking out loud
 

VVP

Registered
From Oscar DOMINGUEZ 's FB post:

I’ve been in the top 6 Americans for the past 19 years or so. I’ve made Mosconi 3x as the #1 or 2 ranked player… NEVER as a wildcard. So I need to adjust my expectations of ever getting chosen, only took nearly 20 years 😄
 

sjm

Older and Wiser
Silver Member
We're better off with them bringing solid pool players with big personalities than just whoever shot the straightest all year imo.
Then let's have Strickland. Billy's Fargo is 774 and Earl's is 773. While neither pick can be justified based on their play in 2024, Earl brings much more electricity to the Mosconi Cup than Billy ever could.

Billy would have been a good coach of Team USA if he can fire up those around him.

All these points aside, while I feel terrible for Oscar, I'm happy for Billy and will cheer hard for him at the Mosconi.
 
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The_JV

'AZB_Combat Certified'
Filler skipping an event = bad
Of course... the promoter wants to have the best product possible.
MR forcing Filler out of 2 massive events(viewer wise) = good??? Make it make sense
Over stating this... MR isn't forcing Filler out of anything. They simply aren't inviting him to their invitational events. Which also happen to be big paydays just for showing up.

Regarding viewership. Do you think the numbers are actually going to be lower based on Filler not playing..? Far more likely it's the subpar product on display from this side of the pond that's hurting the show. Grand scheme... Filler not playing makes this a slightly better contest. Still, in theory, the Euros should win. However the only carrot that might pull viewers as well as hate, is hope. Americans still have Shaw to complain about. The increased hope probably equals out the loss of hate some would love to pour onto Filler.
Apparently Filler skipping an event isn't that important .
Probably not, but MR still has the right not to provide a bonus to someone undermining their promotions.
 

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Matchroom announced the teams:

Team USA
Skyler Woodward (Captain of Team USA)
Fedor Gorst (World Champion)
Shane Van Boening (Five-time US Open Champion)
Tyler Styer (Two-time Mosconi Cup winner)
Billy Thorpe (Two-time Mosconi Cup winner)

Team Europe
Jayson Shaw (Captain of Team Europe)
Eklent Kaçi (Two-time Mosconi Cup winner)
David Alcaide (Four-time Mosconi Cup winner)
Mickey Krause (European Open Champion)
Francisco Sanchez Ruiz (Former World Champion)
It's the same Team Europe that lost to Team Asia a few weeks ago. Those guys lost nearly two-thirds of their matches, so Team USA should have no trouble beating them.

(right?)
 

ribdoner

SATISFACTION GUARANTEED
Silver Member
Of course... the promoter wants to have the best product possible.

Over stating this... MR isn't forcing Filler out of anything. They simply aren't inviting him to their invitational events. Which also happen to be big paydays just for showing up.

Regarding viewership. Do you think the numbers are actually going to be lower based on Filler not playing..? Far more likely it's the subpar product on display from this side of the pond that's hurting the show. Grand scheme... Filler not playing makes this a slightly better contest. Still, in theory, the Euros should win. However the only carrot that might pull viewers as well as hate, is hope. Americans still have Shaw to complain about. The increased hope probably equals out the loss of hate some would love to pour onto Filler.

Probably not, but MR still has the right not to provide a bonus to someone undermining their promotions.
if filler garnered the points he deserved to be on the team
 

jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
Silver Member
Of course... the promoter wants to have the best product possible.

Over stating this... MR isn't forcing Filler out of anything. They simply aren't inviting him to their invitational events. Which also happen to be big paydays just for showing up.

Regarding viewership. Do you think the numbers are actually going to be lower based on Filler not playing..? Far more likely it's the subpar product on display from this side of the pond that's hurting the show. Grand scheme... Filler not playing makes this a slightly better contest. Still, in theory, the Euros should win. However the only carrot that might pull viewers as well as hate, is hope. Americans still have Shaw to complain about. The increased hope probably equals out the loss of hate some would love to pour onto Filler.

Probably not, but MR still has the right not to provide a bonus to someone undermining their promotions.
He more than qualified which means they are removing him
 

Fatboy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
In the Beasley Open 9-Ball event going on now, Johnny Archer knocked Billy Thorpe to the 1-loss side yesterday 8-7, then beat him again in the single-elimination round of 16 today 9-4.
He beat Hennessy after that, his playing good.
 

The_JV

'AZB_Combat Certified'
if filler garnered the points he deserved to be on the team
He more than qualified which means they are removing him
Kinda like Oscar for the americans..? I know, I know.... Oscar was low enough that he fell into one of the captain's choices. That's different to some degree.

However that's the thing about the Mosconi that always confused me. The Euros always seemed to use and adhere to a points system. Whereas in earlier years (not the most recent ones) the Americans appeared to throw whatever team met the captain's fancy, with obvious choices being included. I'll have to bend a knee to what I'm told here. As I've never been very intense about Mosconi and don't have the inclination to correct my possibly misguided point of view via personal research.

Regardless, MR holds the keys. They've set the format, They write the cheques. Use whatever word you want to describe their action.

The unknown here is what, if any, verbage is in the player's agreement. If what you two are implying is "true" then Filler has legal recourse. We all know that's not the case, but "un-invited" doesn't suit the narrative.
 

jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
Silver Member
Kinda like Oscar for the americans..? I know, I know.... Oscar was low enough that he fell into one of the captain's choices. That's different to some degree.

However that's the thing about the Mosconi that always confused me. The Euros always seemed to use and adhere to a points system. Whereas in earlier years (not the most recent ones) the Americans appeared to throw whatever team met the captain's fancy, with obvious choices being included. I'll have to bend a knee to what I'm told here. As I've never been very intense about Mosconi and don't have the inclination to correct my possibly misguided point of view via personal research.

Regardless, MR holds the keys. They've set the format, They write the cheques. Use whatever word you want to describe their action.

The unknown here is what, if any, verbage is in the player's agreement. If what you two are implying is "true" then Filler has legal recourse. We all know that's not the case, but "un-invited" doesn't suit the narrative.
I still don't like it 😁
 

Island Drive

Otto/Dads College Roommate/Cleveland Browns
Silver Member
I am a big Oscar fan. I think he is the epitome of a professional and He has put a lot of miles and time in chasing the points to be on this MC team this year. He has earned the right to be on the team, IMO.

Having said that, I think Billy is custom made for this event. He has a swagger and braggadocio that is at least equal to Shaw, which I think ultimately helps the team in this event.

Now, I would not have hated it if he would have picked Oscar over Styer.
Interesting/realistic viewpoint, I've thought the same, but.

Mr. Styer is not getting worse each year, I don't know the man But results/traveling/getting out there tell me he's putting in the time to improve, this aspect of what's going on in his life, feels like me and Jeff Carter during Jeffs prime & reached his protentional. He was never a natural player, his game was a taught procedure.
USA, when instruction first came on scene after Varner/Daddy Warbucks (Hubert Cokes) then JJ and the Red Raider in Houston.
But instructors only taught you mechanics back then, they were not coaches. Tho some thought they could, not many tho.


I'd prefer Styer over Dominguez because he's improving a little each year.
And if he's younger, all the better.


I don't watch Styer or Oscar that much.
That's just me, prefer faster play, like Bustamante.
The Cup has it's character.
When there's one in the group that's too quiet, it's up to the team to ''support'' talk and help and get em to ''open up'' a little more change his character just a little, it'll lighten the load on all.
 
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skip100

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member

skogstokig

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Kinda like Oscar for the americans..? I know, I know.... Oscar was low enough that he fell into one of the captain's choices. That's different to some degree.

However that's the thing about the Mosconi that always confused me. The Euros always seemed to use and adhere to a points system. Whereas in earlier years (not the most recent ones) the Americans appeared to throw whatever team met the captain's fancy, with obvious choices being included. I'll have to bend a knee to what I'm told here. As I've never been very intense about Mosconi and don't have the inclination to correct my possibly misguided point of view via personal research.

yes, team europe had basically a merit system while team USA had "hook a buddy up" to a degree. of course making players coaches could lead to that again, as many are implying here with sky - billy.

but other ppl too have been putting billy's name in there for this year, because of intangibles like team spirit. maybe there's a case for those factors, idk, hard to measure. i would say that oscar's best game is without a shot clock, and that billy is faster paced. but overall i still think oscar would be better because of current form.
 

Scrunge19

Registered
If you need a dedicated hype man on your team just to get you amped up to play an event like the Mosconi, you probably shouldn’t be there.
 
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