Mosconi Cup - Great Entertainment or Serious Pool

[punter]

The Mosconi Cup is very popular, exciting, and highly anticipated each year. But with the short races, do you think it's meaningful as a barometer of which team is really the best? Do you like it just like it is or would you tweak it a little? How about the selection process? Tell me your thoughts please.

 

[sjm]

Both. It's a pro sport and it is for the fans. No event electrifies the fans more than the Mosconi Cup.

It's a race to eleven matches and is, in fact, not a short competition at all.

It showcases ten of the very best players in the world, and all tne of them care deeply about the result.

No event brings out the passion in the American and European players like this one.

Team USA will be ready!

 

[RobertaAgnor]

I agree.......

Both. It's a pro sport and it is for the fans. No event electrifies the fans more than the Mosconi Cup.

It's a race to eleven matches and is, in fact, not a short competition at all.

It showcases ten of the very best players in the world, and all tne of them care deeply about the result.

No event brings out the passion in the American and European players like this one.

Team USA will be ready!

Can't say it better than that!

 

[punter]

Thanks for replying. For the record, because everyone may not know it, I believe these matches are Race to 5. Please correct me if I am wrong.

 

[MahnaMahna]

In Vegas, playing high level pool, no ridiculous jerseys, everyone gets paid, what's not to like! I wonder how much free popcorn they have to give away to get spectators?

 

[punter]

In Vegas, playing high level pool, no ridiculous jerseys, everyone gets paid, what's not to like! I wonder how much free popcorn they have to give away to get spectators?

I think it's a great competition and very exciting. My only complaint is the race length.

IMO, Race to 5 is too short. It lessens the meaning of the outcome to me. But it's still great entertainment.

 

[RunoutJJ]

Its alt break so every player has a chance to win a game from the break so the Race to 5 is pretty fair chance. It seems that the break is what was a big factor for the past i dont know.... 3 years??

Race to 5 is great for spectators and puts HUGE pressure on the players to win every game. THAT.... Is why the Mosconi Cup is the best edge of the seat pool action on the planet!!! I was on the edge of my seat and screaming at the balls to go in!! Never in my life have I watched any live stream with that much fire in my chair. I was griping the edge of my computer desk with white knuckles... I jumped up out of the chair and stood there clapping when SVB made that kick combo on the 9 ball to close out Daz!! My girlfriend spilled her bowl of popcorn and even yelled at me for making so much noise. Sh'e not as big of a fan as me (she does know a lot about the players and the drama though :lol but she fully understands how awesome this event is!!

Like I said a million times over if they aired scenes from York Hall on ESPN most Americans would be into it. Tis sad that there are countless of millions of people that have know Idea that it goes on :frown:

On a lighter side most of my British friends haven't a clue either

 

[MaxEnglish]

There it is, the ten greatest players in the world... ...wrong... great players, but the selections are somewhat baffeling at times. The current selection format never even brings the top five American and the top five European players together at the same time...

 

[SakuJack]

I think it's a great competition and very exciting. My only complaint is the race length.

IMO, Race to 5 is too short. It lessens the meaning of the outcome to me. But it's still great entertainment.

A single race to 5 may be too short, but playing potentially 21 races to 5 (in that it's a race to 11 matches/sets) gives the outcome plenty of meaning, IMO.

By the end of the week (if everything goes hill/hill) we could see almost 200 racks played - that's plenty of pool to determine the best team.



EDIT: I just checked and last year we saw 152 racks across 20 actual matches. I feel pretty confident in saying if you come out on top there then you deserve to win.

 

[JAM]

Good poll. I voted for No. 1. There's a variety of formats that could be utilized, but for TV purposes, entertainment value, this format is fast and furious. Mosconi Cup rocks!

After all, there can only be one winner, right?

 

[Pre-Flag Master]

A single race to 5 may be too short, but playing potentially 21 races to 5 (in that it's a race to 11 matches/sets) gives the outcome plenty of meaning, IMO.

By the end of the week (if everything goes hill/hill) we could see almost 200 racks played - that's plenty of pool to determine the best team.

I don't agree with this reasoning. If a race to 5 is considered too short to be a true test, then I don't think that it matters how many races to five you have. Look at it like this, if a race to 5 is a coin flip, then each match is 50/50. By the time you get to the end of seeing who wins a coin flip 11 times, then I think statistically it's going to be pretty close every time. Which actually is a good thing, in a way, because it keeps the tournament close and exciting every year. That has to be great for ratings. So I would say that makes it lean toward entertainment.

Now don't get me wrong, I love the Mosconi cup. I think it's great pool, because it *IS* 10 of the best players in the world and you see some great racks. So I don't really care that much that it is a coin flip, I just like that I get to see great pool.

You have to keep the format feasible for TV. The only thing I would change is that I would make it races to 7. That would improve that a little, and give more pool.

As for the selection process, I am all for Matchroom choosing who they want. It is *supposed* to be entertainment to a certain extent, and they have to present something that looks good on TV. I usually like their choices. This year, I was surprised they took Earl because he always has the potential to make a scene. I am surprised they did not pick Toasty because he is always a gentleman and he rocks at the table - that one I really don't get.

If I found myself in a conversation with Barry Hearn, the only change I would suggest is going to races to 7. In the poll, I chose C.

Fatz

 

[SakuJack]

I don't agree with this reasoning. If a race to 5 is considered too short to be a true test, then I don't think that it matters how many races to five you have. Look at it like this, if a race to 5 is a coin flip, then each match is 50/50. By the time you get to the end of seeing who wins a coin flip 11 times, then I think statistically it's going to be pretty close every time. Which actually is a good thing, in a way, because it keeps the tournament close and exciting every year. That has to be great for ratings. So I would say that makes it lean toward entertainment.

I think it depends on whether you see a race to five as a coin flip. Some do, but I feel that is misguided. It's a test of skill under intense, short term pressure, just like a race to 100 is a test of skill and endurance. Luck plays a part, but when you look at the actual matches (particularly at this high level) more are lost by twitches on shots or nervy position play than they are on bad rolls or flukes - in my opinion, of course.

I can't think of a recent year where I felt the result didn't reflect the level of play of each team (i.e. I can't think of an example where the best team lost). That in itself gives me faith in the system.

It would be interesting to see how the overall results compare to actual racks won and lost. So a team could win 11-5 but in actual racks won and lost it could be a lot closer than that.


EDIT: All that said, I'd like to see races to seven, too .

 

[punter]

Bumping for day shift.

 

[CreeDo]

Turns out the major complaint about the Mosconi cup, the race length,
is actually not a big deal.

I cranked out some math in another thread.
Basically if one team is 2% worse than the other, then the underdog team should only win
the entire thing about 32.4% of the time.

If they switched it to a single long race it's not much different. Then the underdog
only wins 29% of the time.

Bottom line: The format is fair enough that the better team usually wins. At least 70% of the time,
even if they're only a hair better.

As for the rest of it, I wouldn't change it. It works and people look forward to it.
I do think Matchroom's "Sweet spot" for wildcards is 2 players.
Let the other 3 get there via merit (BCA points or whatever).

More than that and people doubt the fairness of the process. Less than that and you
might have one or two TV-friendly personalities like Johnny Archer not get on the team.

 

[thewhiffer]

If all pro level events could capture the excitement of the Mosconi Cup it would elevate the sport in terms of spectators.

 

[sjm]

I do think Matchroom's "Sweet spot" for wildcards is 2 players. Let the other 3 get there via merit (BCA points or whatever).

Shhhhhhhhh. Having World 9-ball Champion Thorsten Hohmann and 3rd place finisher at the US Open Jayson Shaw on the sidelines is certainly in the best interests of a USA victory. We might win this thing.

 

[CreeDo]

Shhhhhhhhh. Having World 9-ball Champion Thorsten Hohmann and 3rd place finisher at the US Open Jayson Shaw on the sidelines is certainly in the best interests of a USA victory. We might win this thing.

Are you implying some unfairness in the selection process?!!?

I think our best bet is to naturalize toastie as a us citizen without his knowledge, find barry hearn,
then have him draft hohmann onto the team to replace hatch.

 

[sjm]

Are you implying some unfairness in the selection process?!!?

I think our best bet is to naturalize toastie as a us citizen without his knowledge, find barry hearn,
then have him draft hohmann onto the team to replace hatch.

You may be on to something here, Creedo.

 

[spartan]

The Mosconi Cup is very popular, exciting, and highly anticipated each year. But with the short races, do you think it's meaningful as a barometer of which team is really the best? Do you like it just like it is or would you tweak it a little? How about the selection process? Tell me your thoughts please.

Mosconi Cup started as entertainment and only recently became serious ppol
Race to 5 racks is bit short but it is race to 11 matches so it is race to a minimum of 55 racks (assuming winner whitewashes and wins all 11 matches 5-0) or maximum of 95 racks (assuming winner wins 11 matches 5-4 and loses other 10 matches 4-5).
It is a team format so you are not looking at just 1 match but results of all matches. So that is like 2 players playing race to 55. If race to 55 is considered long enough to determine the better player than this format is good enough
Though I prefer the formats of early editions. Like the first few editions were races to 16 matches. Each match was best of 3 sets. Minimum 3 racks to win but ahead by 2 racks with maximum race to 5. That is better format for the better player
Over the years they keep tweaking the format. As recently as 2011 each match was race to 6. Last year it was reduced to race to 5
:smile:

 

[Pre-Flag Master]

See post #11.

Mosconi Cup started as entertainment and only recently became serious ppol
Race to 5 racks is bit short but it is race to 11 matches so it is race to a minimum of 55 racks (assuming winner whitewashes and wins all 11 matches 5-0) or maximum of 95 racks (assuming winner wins 11 matches 5-4 and loses other 10 matches 4-5).
It is a team format so you are not looking at just 1 match but results of all matches. So that is like 2 players playing race to 55. If race to 55 is considered long enough to determine the better player than this format is good enough
Though I prefer the formats of early editions. Like the first few editions were races to 16 matches. Each match was best of 3 sets. Minimum 3 racks to win but ahead by 2 racks with maximum race to 5. That is better format for the better player
Over the years they keep tweaking the format. As recently as 2011 each match was race to 6. Last year it was reduced to race to 5
:smile: