My final word

W

wincardona

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Tom in Cincy:
...Opinions are like noses... everyone has one.. some are very good, and some just smell...
...It still amazes me that pool players think that because they can type and play pool that their opinion means more than anyone else
Lou Figueroa: replying to Tom,
...Your last points about the pool players who can type (and set up very handy straw men to knock down at their whim) is priceless.
　
Those comments were obviously directed at me. I don't like being attacked but defending myself is in my nature. So I will now make a final reply to your sneering remarks.
You two make it appear that my 50 years of experience in the pool world is actually a disadvantage when it comes to having an opinion on a major tournament project. Yes, poor me, someone who has for almost 50 years, suffered through, and took an active part in, tournament glories, expenses and disappointments. Why should I be validated? The question is, why should my opinion be invalidated by those naysayers who seek to throw cold water on any new potentially good project. Those who hide behind their cry, oh what’s best for the pool world, when they are in actuality looking to spread their inherent negativism. We used to call it "knocking."

I once read an old quote from a wise man who said, "Many vile and nefarious deeds are oft committed in the guise of patriotism." What that means is that people, and often governments, hide behind the phony shield of "patriotism" in order to chop off somebody’s head. The analogy here is when people say they are just asking questions to help them make an intelligent decision, when in reality the question itself unfairly paints a coat of "knock" on the subject. Something like saying to a normal girl, "Do you have AIDs or venereal disease? Are you sure?" And then try to cover up with, " sorry, just askin

Whenever I hear about a project that is potentially good, and serves a purpose, and for some reason I feel uneasy about participating in it, I quietly dismiss it from my thoughts. And if I had no intentions of attending or supporting it, I certainly wouldn’t put it up in front of the pool world for debate.

Have a nice day, fellas, Bill Incardona
 
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Good post Billy.

I am sure that you were told this in grade school as many were - if you questioned why do we study history? The answer is because it is a way to ensure that history does not repeat itself.

50 years in pool for you and how has it progressed/digressed? That is a rhetorical question because we all know that it really hasn't gotten anywhere. You might call it knocking, I would call it a safe cautious approach to help pool build for the future instead of building for 5 minutes from now. Maybe some should take their tongue out of their cheek so their point comes across better, but it is what it is.

Wide eyes and shut minds made it easy for KT to preach into people's heads of the grandeur of the IPT. Then came the screeching halt. And there are plenty examples in the history of pool that KT was simply repeating. Others have repeated KT to a lesson scale since his fall. The guy and his $25K tournament in Arizona that Mark Griffin bailed out the players comes to mind.

This group in Galveston started out with a 400K promise that has now grown to 1 million in a few short months and low and behold, the IPT is also involved. Those are all red flags that should be questioned and looked at. If it is a great event, talk about it afterwards. But to call it great before it even happens will keep pool stuck in the same puddle of mud. Who in this group in Galveston has experience running a 1 milllion dollar event? The only one I see is the IPT and again that is alarming.

Since you like analogies, here is another one. I previously owned a GNC store for over 7 years. But I wouldn't wake up tomorrow thinking that I could open up a Walmart.
 
wincardona said:
Tom in Cincy:
...Opinions are like noses... everyone has one.. some are very good, and some just smell...
...It still amazes me that pool players think that because they can type and play pool that their opinion means more than anyone else
Lou Figueroa: replying to Tom,
...Your last points about the pool players who can type (and set up very handy straw men to knock down at their whim) is priceless.
　
Those comments were obviously directed at me. I don't like being attacked but defending myself is in my nature. So I will now make a final reply to your sneering remarks.
You two make it appear that my 50 years of experience in the pool world is actually a disadvantage when it comes to having an opinion on a major tournament project. Yes, poor me, someone who has for almost 50 years, suffered through, and took an active part in, tournament glories, expenses and disappointments. Why should I be validated? The question is, why should my opinion be invalidated by those naysayers who seek to throw cold water on any new potentially good project. Those who hide behind their cry, oh what’s best for the pool world, when they are in actuality looking to spread their inherent negativism. We used to call it "knocking."

I once read an old quote from a wise man who said, "Many vile and nefarious deeds are oft committed in the guise of patriotism." What that means is that people, and often governments, hide behind the phony shield of "patriotism" in order to chop off somebody’s head. The analogy here is when people say they are just asking questions to help them make an intelligent decision, when in reality the question itself unfairly paints a coat of "knock" on the subject. Something like saying to a normal girl, "Do you have AIDs or venereal disease? Are you sure?" And then try to cover up with, " sorry, just askin

Whenever I hear about a project that is potentially good, and serves a purpose, and for some reason I feel uneasy about participating in it, I quietly dismiss it from my thoughts. And if I had no intentions of attending or supporting it, I certainly wouldn’t put it up in front of the pool world for debate.

Have a nice day, fellas, Bill Incardona
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Billy,
I'm not familiar with the thread(s) you refered to, but I'd like to say something nevertheless.

There are many, many people on this forum who genuinely look forward to posts, contributions and comments from the established and elite pro players. You, Grady, Freddy, John Schmidt....you guys are highly respected by the vast majority of memberes here. You in particular have always been a special interest to me since you're from my area of the world and also, since I've spent thousands of hours of my life listening to your comments on Accu-Stats.

Here's my point....Despite all the love and admiration that most will have for you, there is the possibility that a small % won't like or agree with you, or any of the other pros for that matter. Please Bill, don't let a negative comment or comments cause you to stop posting here. There's already a list of pros who at one time did post here but elected to quit.

Not everybody here likes me. I got several who I know don't care for me, but I sort of expect a certain % of people to not like me. That's life. I am very thankful for the ones who are my friends, and you should just stop and think back on how you've been treated overall here at AZB or 1Pocket.com. I think you'll agree that the vast majority hold you in very high regard.

I've stated numerous times here that if I could have just ONE man manage me if I were on the pro tour, it would be Billy Incardona. I think you have a real love for our great sport, an exceptional talent in gauging a players speed as well as having one of the sharpest minds when it comes to matching up. Other men may have NFL, NASCAR or MLB players as heros, so to speak. Mine have always been the great pool champions and you have always been near the top of that list.

I better stop, or my wife may get a little jealous of all this nicey-nice talk! But I know you understand what I'm saying.

Have a good day, Mr. Incardona! :smile:
 
wincardona said:
Tom in Cincy:
...Opinions are like noses... everyone has one.. some are very good, and some just smell...
...It still amazes me that pool players think that because they can type and play pool that their opinion means more than anyone else
Lou Figueroa: replying to Tom,
...Your last points about the pool players who can type (and set up very handy straw men to knock down at their whim) is priceless.
　
Those comments were obviously directed at me. I don't like being attacked but defending myself is in my nature. So I will now make a final reply to your sneering remarks.
You two make it appear that my 50 years of experience in the pool world is actually a disadvantage when it comes to having an opinion on a major tournament project. Yes, poor me, someone who has for almost 50 years, suffered through, and took an active part in, tournament glories, expenses and disappointments. Why should I be validated? The question is, why should my opinion be invalidated by those naysayers who seek to throw cold water on any new potentially good project. Those who hide behind their cry, oh what’s best for the pool world, when they are in actuality looking to spread their inherent negativism. We used to call it "knocking."

I once read an old quote from a wise man who said, "Many vile and nefarious deeds are oft committed in the guise of patriotism." What that means is that people, and often governments, hide behind the phony shield of "patriotism" in order to chop off somebody’s head. The analogy here is when people say they are just asking questions to help them make an intelligent decision, when in reality the question itself unfairly paints a coat of "knock" on the subject. Something like saying to a normal girl, "Do you have AIDs or venereal disease? Are you sure?" And then try to cover up with, " sorry, just askin

Whenever I hear about a project that is potentially good, and serves a purpose, and for some reason I feel uneasy about participating in it, I quietly dismiss it from my thoughts. And if I had no intentions of attending or supporting it, I certainly wouldn’t put it up in front of the pool world for debate.

Have a nice day, fellas, Bill Incardona
Click to expand...



Billy, don't let the railbirds of life annoy you. For some reason so many people love to see things fail and tell you they told you so after it happens. Just like railbirds at the pool hall, who whisper he is going to dog this shot and can't wait for their so called buddy to shoot the ball into the rail and lose his money to a guy the railbird doesn't even know.

Sometimes people take chances in life and the fail and if it weren't for those people we wouldn't have all the amazing things we have today. Galveston is a big risk big reward proposition everybody with a brain knows that. Now let the people running it have their chance, and we can Monday morning QB after the event.
 
wincardona said:
Tom in Cincy:
...Opinions are like noses... everyone has one.. some are very good, and some just smell...
...It still amazes me that pool players think that because they can type and play pool that their opinion means more than anyone else
Lou Figueroa: replying to Tom,
...Your last points about the pool players who can type (and set up very handy straw men to knock down at their whim) is priceless.
　
Those comments were obviously directed at me. I don't like being attacked but defending myself is in my nature. So I will now make a final reply to your sneering remarks.
You two make it appear that my 50 years of experience in the pool world is actually a disadvantage when it comes to having an opinion on a major tournament project. Yes, poor me, someone who has for almost 50 years, suffered through, and took an active part in, tournament glories, expenses and disappointments. Why should I be validated? The question is, why should my opinion be invalidated by those naysayers who seek to throw cold water on any new potentially good project. Those who hide behind their cry, oh what’s best for the pool world, when they are in actuality looking to spread their inherent negativism. We used to call it "knocking."

I once read an old quote from a wise man who said, "Many vile and nefarious deeds are oft committed in the guise of patriotism." What that means is that people, and often governments, hide behind the phony shield of "patriotism" in order to chop off somebody’s head. The analogy here is when people say they are just asking questions to help them make an intelligent decision, when in reality the question itself unfairly paints a coat of "knock" on the subject. Something like saying to a normal girl, "Do you have AIDs or venereal disease? Are you sure?" And then try to cover up with, " sorry, just askin

Whenever I hear about a project that is potentially good, and serves a purpose, and for some reason I feel uneasy about participating in it, I quietly dismiss it from my thoughts. And if I had no intentions of attending or supporting it, I certainly wouldn’t put it up in front of the pool world for debate.

Have a nice day, fellas, Bill Incardona
Click to expand...


In my case, actually, I wasn't referring to you, though I can see how it might appear that way. In Tom's case, I actually thought he was poking fun at himself, so you might be wrong on that count too, but he'll have to address that, should he care to.

Personally, I think your opinion counts for a lot. But so does the opinion of others. In any case, since you've decided to get upset, rather than participate in a discussion (there seems to be a lot of that going around :-) there's not much more to say to you.

Lou Figueroa
 
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I was poking fun at myself and everyone else that 'smells' (thanks Lou)

There are a lot of other posters that have noses that are very well connected.

Apologies to Mr Incardone. I didn't realize that you might take this so personal. My intent was clouded by a response in a thread you started and wasn't meant to be directed towards you. Only to offer an opinion.

Once again, I apologize.
 
Hi Billy,I go to many tournaments and I expect to always see you there. Your a big reason I go because I know if your there it going to be a great tournament and plenty of action. When it comes to helping out you'll be the first one to do what you can.I wasn't going to go but now I'm really considering it. Just remember the knockers are always trying to put guys down but the winners like you overcome the bad and keep the good going.Have a great TOURNAMENT.Thanks again for your input in tournaments. FastEddieF. from Baltimore
 
For those not following the other threads, I'll summarize:
Billy I. & JoeyA think the Galveston event is going to be awesome and want people to get excited about it.
LouF thinks it's going to be another IPT like scam.

The surprising part about the discussion is the how well JoeyA has handled the BS from LouF. He's the definition of a forum douchebag and would fit in well on Jimbo's forum.

Eric
 
Wrong thread but thanks to Mr. Incardona for many hours of enjoyment via his commentary.

I'm floored that so many would be commentators don't have you as required viewing you wrote the book for pool commentary.
 
emf123...There's really no need to call names. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Lou is a professional player, who has every right to ask the questions he has...much the same as JoeyA has a perfect right to be one the leading 'cheerleaders' for the event (props to him for his efforts). ALL publicity is good...even negative publicity. I've asked my share of questions too...and shared some skepticism on the outcome. There have been many long unanswered questions about this upcoming event, for many months now. Recently, some questions were answered via the event website. Some remain unanswered, and won't likely be answered until the event unfolds in Sept. That's still okay. Those that want to go...will go. Those that don't...will stay home. It's a simple choice, and nobody is the "bad guy" for suggesting that this may not be all it's being promoted as. We just have to wait and see. Myself, I'm convinced it will be a new kind of event, and am trying to plan to attend, at least for a few days. Like Lou and Tom said, the event will happen, and then there will be more discussion and debate on how it can be better next time. That's called progress.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

emf123 said:
The surprising part about the discussion is the how well JoeyA has handled the BS from LouF. He's the definition of a forum douchebag and would fit in well on Jimbo's forum.

Eric
Click to expand...
 
Billy,

I've always been a fan of yours and to me your opinion counts a lot. I don't know how many hours i've listened and learned from you on Accu-stats videos and I hope that you don't give up on the forum.

I've learned in life that you can't please everybody and in an open forum like this if you say something or think something is going to work well you'll usually have some comments that you don't like or agree with and that's just the way it is.

James
 
emf123 said:
For those not following the other threads, I'll summarize:
Billy I. & JoeyA think the Galveston event is going to be awesome and want people to get excited about it.
LouF thinks it's going to be another IPT like scam.

The surprising part about the discussion is the how well JoeyA has handled the BS from LouF. He's the definition of a forum douchebag and would fit in well on Jimbo's forum.

Eric
Click to expand...


So, you want to play being my spokesmodel, lol.

Well, you got it wrong, so you're fired. I had a couple of questions about what "guaranteed" means and how many players are paid up so far. I have no preconceived notions or "conspiracy theories."

Lou Figueroa
and Joey is not
handling it well ;-)
 
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Scott Lee said:
emf123...There's really no need to call names. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Lou is a professional player, who has every right to ask the questions he has...much the same as JoeyA has a perfect right to be one the leading 'cheerleaders' for the event (props to him for his efforts). ALL publicity is good...even negative publicity. I've asked my share of questions too...and shared some skepticism on the outcome. There have been many long unanswered questions about this upcoming event, for many months now. Recently, some questions were answered via the event website. Some remain unanswered, and won't likely be answered until the event unfolds in Sept. That's still okay. Those that want to go...will go. Those that don't...will stay home. It's a simple choice, and nobody is the "bad guy" for suggesting that this may not be all it's being promoted as. We just have to wait and see. Myself, I'm convinced it will be a new kind of event, and am trying to plan to attend, at least for a few days. Like Lou and Tom said, the event will happen, and then there will be more discussion and debate on how it can be better next time. That's called progress.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
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Thanks, Scott. I would say you've given a reasonable recap, for those not following all the festivities.

As with many other forums, once a discussion really gets rolling, you often get a lot of folks coming late to the party and making too many assumptions about the positions people have taken. Somehow, what started out as reasonable but divergent takes on an issue, gets distorted into caricatures: black and white; good and evil; for or against... But, like I said, that's the way it goes on discussion forums, so no surprises there.

One correction though: you know, actually, I'm not a professional player. I do do stupid things, like get in tournaments filled with professional players, but I am not a pro. (IOW, I get the expected results :-)

Lou Figueroa
 
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emf123 said:
For those not following the other threads, I'll summarize:
Billy I. & JoeyA think the Galveston event is going to be awesome and want people to get excited about it.
LouF thinks it's going to be another IPT like scam.

The surprising part about the discussion is the how well JoeyA has handled the BS from LouF. He's the definition of a forum douchebag and would fit in well on Jimbo's forum.

Eric
Click to expand...
While you're post wasn't bad until the last bit of drivel and while having the utmost respect for Bill Incardona's knowledge of the pool world, I think only a total fool would not be suspicious of any promised event in the pool world. How many times do these events prove to be a ripoff or to be the insubstantial product of a foolish optimist? Often, very often.
I checked out the website for the event and it all sounds good, but the IPT sounded pretty good too. I hope it works and all the pro players get a big payday, but I personally remain pessimistic. Remember the old saying "If it seems too good to be true, it probably is too good to be true".
I'm not going to search around for that thread on this forum to check out Lou's posts, but I've read plenty of Lou's posts on other topics over the years and they've always been reasonable and thought out.
 
lfigueroa said:
Thanks, Scott. I would say you've given a reasonable recap, for those not following all the festivities.

As with many other forums, once a discussion really gets rolling, you often get a lot of folks coming late to the party and making too many assumptions about the positions people have taken. Somehow, what started out as reasonable but divergent takes on an issue, gets distorted into caricatures: black and white; good and evil; for or against... But, like I said, that's the way it goes on discussion forums, so no surprises there.

One correction though: you know, actually, I'm not a professional player. I do do stupid things, like get in tournaments filled with professional players, but I am not a pro. (IOW, I get the expected results :-)

Lou Figueroa
Click to expand...

You badgered him and called him names for 12 PAGES
I feel your out of line with your method of posting and I don't have a problem calling you out on it.

The tournament appears to have very good opportunities for high caliber amateur players, if I was one I'd definitely be investigating it more on my own, not shooting the messenger.

I'll leave it at that.

Eric
 
emf123 said:
You badgered him and called him names for 12 PAGES
I feel your out of line with your method of posting and I don't have a problem calling you out on it.

The tournament appears to have very good opportunities for high caliber amateur players, if I was one I'd definitely be investigating it more on my own, not shooting the messenger.

I'll leave it at that.

Eric
Click to expand...


ooooo, "calling me out on it" lol.

What was it that Tom said about opinions...

Look, Joey is a big boy and we go waaaaaay back together on the internet. Besides, no messengers were shot.

Lou Figueroa
might have tickled
the spokesmodel a bit :-)
 
catscradle said:
While you're post wasn't bad until the last bit of drivel and while having the utmost respect for Bill Incardona's knowledge of the pool world, I think only a total fool would not be suspicious of any promised event in the pool world. How many times do these events prove to be a ripoff or to be the insubstantial product of a foolish optimist? Often, very often.
I checked out the website for the event and it all sounds good, but the IPT sounded pretty good too. I hope it works and all the pro players get a big payday, but I personally remain pessimistic. Remember the old saying "If it seems too good to be true, it probably is too good to be true".
I'm not going to search around for that thread on this forum to check out Lou's posts, but I've read plenty of Lou's posts on other topics over the years and they've always been reasonable and thought out.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the vote of confidence, catscradle.

Lou Figueroa
 
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