no more trying to help any players....read on

cueball1950

cueball1950

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
For the last 3 years or so i have tried to help a few players out by putting up the entry fee for the Joss tournaments at the Turning Stone Casino, only to have them back out for what ever reason. This is no big deal and i am definately not going to mention any names on here. But i have decided to stop simply because it is not worth the aggrivation for mike zuglan and myself. So to all who would have liked me to do iy for them, i am terribly sorry. And also let me add that Mike Zuglan had absolutely nothing with my making this decision.............................mike
 
Mike

I understand your frustration. Over the years I have been stiffed by a few players that have done the same thing to me - had their entry paid into an event and they never called to say they couldn't make it, or that they had to back out at the last minute. $$$ down the drain.

In the past I have been personally blessed with your kindness and generosity in your efforts to be a positive force in our sport, and I would like to say that I have genuinely appreciated it. Do not allow a few bad apples to taint your attitude. Stick with the winners.

David
 
vagabond said:
one will have peace of mind if one gives Love and gifts unconditionally.
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Love and gifts is one thing, a business deal that is backed out of - that is something completely different. I have no problem helping out other players, but when someone is in need to have their entry paid in exchange for a % of winnings, they should have some gratitude and vice versa. Some of these fine folks "expect" to be helped out and the attitude I experienced after the backouts was something that still leaves a bad taste in my mouth. This is why some of these people cannot get sponsorship. It's all "Take take take". IMO, I should have helped out somebody else that would have appreciated it more and that would have more consideration. Simply, they mistook my kindness for weakness. Live and learn, I guess.
 
Hey Mike, you gonna be at turning stone this year? Me and a couple friends are hoping to head out there on saturday for like the day to see some pros.
 
Stiffed

vagabond said:
one will have peace of mind if one gives Love and gifts unconditionally.
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Yeah, someone also once said "The Lord helps those who help themselves".

Mike, I don't know you at all but you're obviously a caring individual who has gone ABOVE AND BEYOND to contribute to the sport. Appreciation is an extremely poor trait in todays youth. I can completely understand where your frustration is coming from and I hope you spend your days enjoying all the positive aspects that pool has to offer.
 
the world is a brutal place sometimes, and the pool world is one of the most brutal subcultures of a brutal world. I sorry to see that happen, its tough to pick your battles sometimes. Best of luck in the future.
 
JoeyInCali said:
One more reason why this sport is dying.
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Joey, Please don't be such a pessemist. Once someone comes along with the right formula, I think pool has a chance to take off just like "hold'em"
has done.We have just as much to offer (if not more) in the way of
colorful characters and good,high action. We will prevail!!
 
Blackjack said:
Love and gifts is one thing, a business deal that is backed out of - that is something completely different. I have no problem helping out other players, but when someone is in need to have their entry paid in exchange for a % of winnings, they should have some gratitude and vice versa. Some of these fine folks "expect" to be helped out and the attitude I experienced after the backouts was something that still leaves a bad taste in my mouth. This is why some of these people cannot get sponsorship. It's all "Take take take". IMO, I should have helped out somebody else that would have appreciated it more and that would have more consideration. Simply, they mistook my kindness for weakness. Live and learn, I guess.
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Blackjack and others... let me set 1 thing straight. I offered to pay the entry fee only with no expectations of getting anything in return. I never asked for nor did i want anything in return for my generosity.......mike
 
You really have to be sure of who you are dealing with when you agree to "front" the money for them. I know many pool players, but only a few that I would trust with my money. My advice is, stick to the ones you KNOW are reputable and will not let you down. John Schmidt is a perfect example....Purdman chose a class act to help out and it paid off for both of them. JMO.

Southpaw
 
Blackjack said:
Love and gifts is one thing, a business deal that is backed out of - that is something completely different. I have no problem helping out other players, but when someone is in need to have their entry paid in exchange for a % of winnings, they should have some gratitude and vice versa. Some of these fine folks "expect" to be helped out and the attitude I experienced after the backouts was something that still leaves a bad taste in my mouth. This is why some of these people cannot get sponsorship. It's all "Take take take". IMO, I should have helped out somebody else that would have appreciated it more and that would have more consideration. Simply, they mistook my kindness for weakness. Live and learn, I guess.
Click to expand...


No disagreement with you on that.Buisiness is buisiness and the charity is charity.I was refering to charity.Cheers:cool:
 
Southpaw said:
You really have to be sure of who you are dealing with when you agree to "front" the money for them. I know many pool players, but only a few that I would trust with my money. My advice is, stick to the ones you KNOW are reputable and will not let you down. John Schmidt is a perfect example....Purdman chose a class act to help out and it paid off for both of them. JMO.

Southpaw
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I don't think that Mike was "fronting" or expecting a payback from his generosity. He was showing compassion for people who wanted to play in the events but may not be able to afford the entry fee.

I personally think it is pretty sad that people would take the free entry and then not show up.
 
SJDinPHX said:
Joey, Please don't be such a pessemist. Once someone comes along with the right formula, I think pool has a chance to take off just like "hold'em"
has done.We have just as much to offer (if not more) in the way of
colorful characters and good,high action. We will prevail!!
Click to expand...

Sorry, but there's just no comparison between pool and popular poker. Granted, poker needed the "World Poker Tour" before it really went mainstream, but the popularity in poker is due to the BIG PAYOUTS.

ESPN sponsors contribute some of the money that results in the payouts, but most of it comes from contestants who are willing to pay thousands of dollars out of their own pockets to enter the tournaments. I think the World Series is still $10K, but some of the WSOP televised events have been as high as $25,000 entry fees (I think). That means most of the contestants paid that much for the priviledge of competeing. Who in pool(besides Fatboy:) ) is going to do that?

When a relative amatuer in pool can luck into beating a roomful of pros for a $5,000,000 payout, then pool will take off like hold 'em.

It's a whole different ball o' wax.

Tom
 
cueball1950 said:
For the last 3 years or so i have tried to help a few players out by putting up the entry fee for the Joss tournaments at the Turning Stone Casino, only to have them back out for what ever reason. This is no big deal and i am definately not going to mention any names on here. But i have decided to stop simply because it is not worth the aggrivation for mike zuglan and myself. So to all who would have liked me to do iy for them, i am terribly sorry. And also let me add that Mike Zuglan had absolutely nothing with my making this decision.............................mike
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Happened to a guy I know too in the same tournament last year. He put up the $$ for 2 players. One of them lost his first set, packed up and went home. Never bothered to tell anyone, so when it was time for his next match, he's a no show forfeit. When the backer called the player asking where he was, his answer was, "I'm sitting here on my couch." (or something to that effect) Needless to say, this guy doesn't get backed anymore. Sorry for your troubles.
 
cueball1950 said:
For the last 3 years or so i have tried to help a few players out by putting up the entry fee for the Joss tournaments at the Turning Stone Casino, only to have them back out for what ever reason. This is no big deal and i am definately not going to mention any names on here. But i have decided to stop simply because it is not worth the aggrivation for mike zuglan and myself. So to all who would have liked me to do iy for them, i am terribly sorry. And also let me add that Mike Zuglan had absolutely nothing with my making this decision.............................mike
Click to expand...

I feel bad and semi-responsible in reading this post.

Though, I really don't think I have much to do with Mike's decision, I am sure that our experience has contributed to it.

Mike was generous enough in the past to contribute to my own entry in the Turning Stone event a year or two ago; however due to some unforseeable circumstances, I was unable to attend.

I did give ample, at least 2-4 weeks or more, notice that I was not going to make it to the event. I was also sure to communicate with Mike Zuglan to ensure that Mike (cueball1950) would get his money back. Which he did.

Following that experience, Mike (cueball1950) did still offer to do the same if I was able to attend in the future. There were no bad feelings whatsoever.

Mike, I am sorry to hear that you feel your efforts have gone unappreciated by those players that were benefitting from it. I certainly did appreciate your geneousity and did not take it lightly though I was unable to utilize it.

I am sure you never heard it often enough--Thank you.

We all lose here.
 
I have also been a first hand recipient of Mikes generosity and am sorry to hear about this. Mike is definately one of the GOOD GUYS around pool. Best wishes Mike.

George
 
Tom M said:
Sorry, but there's just no comparison between pool and popular poker. Granted, poker needed the "World Poker Tour" before it really went mainstream, but the popularity in poker is due to the BIG PAYOUTS.

ESPN sponsors contribute some of the money that results in the payouts, but most of it comes from contestants who are willing to pay thousands of dollars out of their own pockets to enter the tournaments. I think the World Series is still $10K, but some of the WSOP televised events have been as high as $25,000 entry fees (I think). That means most of the contestants paid that much for the priviledge of competeing. Who in pool(besides Fatboy:) ) is going to do that?

When a relative amatuer in pool can luck into beating a roomful of pros for a $5,000,000 payout, then pool will take off like hold 'em.

It's a whole different ball o' wax.

Tom
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Tom, you completely missed my point. I play a lot of Hold'em myself and I know very well How the prize money is generated for the WSOP and other big events. I was refering to the recent explosion of a game thats been around for 70 + years. Poker is casino driven and promoted. As you say an amateur can overcome a top pro. It's a game of chance. Pool is an exhibition of skill (bowling,golf,tennis) and would be sponsor driven, like most other endeavors.
All it will take is the right formula and viable leadership.
 
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corey....let me reassure you that my decision in no way had anything to do with you or our arrangement..and i would not hesitate to go with you again..........mike
 
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