Official 14.1 High Runs

[Bobby]

Oh, also, I think Ralph Greenleaf's 287 is the greatest accomplishment in pool ever. It was done on a 5x10, if I recall correctly.

The guy ran 20 damned racks on a 5x10. Probably drunk, lol.

- Steve

Steve, I've heard it was 276 that Greenleaf ran, but very impressive. I also think that Mosconi has the all-time high run on a 5 x 10 with 365.

I would think that Mizerak had to have a 350+ at least in practice at some point in his life.

BTW, when are you going to run 200 Steve?

Bobby

 

[Steve Lipsky]

Steve, I've heard it was 276 that Greenleaf ran, but very impressive. I also think that Mosconi has the all-time high run on a 5 x 10 with 365.

I would think that Mizerak had to have a 350+ at least in practice at some point in his life.

BTW, when are you going to run 200 Steve?

Bobby

WOW, I didn't know that about Mosconi's 365. Jesus, I'm speechless... what can one say about that?

Hopefully I will run 200 when I am practicing for the 14.1 event .

Bob, what do you think about Ervolino and the 300+? You were around the club in those days, right? You think he could've done it?

- Steve

 

[Cardinal2B]

The Long Run

I love this forum if for no other reason than the high # and % of 14.1 enthusiasts / players!

While there is a certain Runyonesque charm in not having some official list of the high runs, and even debate about the circumstances and veracity of Mosconi's 526 (table size? did he miss or stop?), it'd be far better if there were a list that was the "generally accepted truth" of the matter. If that has to be seaprated into 10', 9' and 8' columns, I could live with that; but then do we also need clay ball vs plastic, size of pockets, etc.?

I mean Ruth hit his home runs in completely different conditions than Aaron, but its still, you know, the one list. Some good lore still creeps in though - for you Runyonesque types - Josh Gibson was reputed to have hit a ball out of Yankee stadium in an exhibition game. Did he?

But somebody has to step up to the task of "historian" under the aegis of some long recognized ruling body for this - to sift through the stories as well as the stats and make a determination of some sort.

I would nominate Bob Jewett ('cause I think he's got more than a passing interest in these high runs) & BCA to get this nailed down (to the extent it can be) and publish / promote, you know, "the list" - whaddya think?

(if the list is really, really, very long indeed, I can substantiate my personal high run of 37 with witnesses!)

 

[Bobby]

WOW, I didn't know that about Mosconi's 365. Jesus, I'm speechless... what can one say about that?

Hopefully I will run 200 when I am practicing for the 14.1 event .

Bob, what do you think about Ervolino and the 300+? You were around the club in those days, right? You think he could've done it?

- Steve

In fact I believe he had a couple of other 300+ runs on a 5 x 10.

As for Ervolino's 334 in 2000...I think it's possible and I'll tell you why: about a year before that I was watching him play on the old table #4 at ABC West with the tight pockets. And he never counted his runs in practice he just ran racks, anyway I kept track one day and he ran 194, when I told him he didn't seem to care...now this was on a tight table.
A few days pass an I kept pestering him to try for a high run on a looser table so he gives it a go, well, he couldn't run past 3 racks and after 2 hours or so he quit. Then 2 days later he runs 176 like it was nothing his run ended only because he got stuck without a shot. A couple days after that he's gambling with Mika on table #4 Mika's actually spotting him 50 points on 200. They played 3 games and Mika never got past 80 points in any of the games. In one game Johnny ran something like 120 and out and just stopped like he didn't care about the run.
The next day Johnny again couldn't get past 40 or
50 balls...I think at his age consistency was a big
problem. He got VERY frustrated by this, I remember him telling me once when he was losing to Ginky, "I would give anything to play this kid back when I was his age!" I said "How would that game go"? He said "In all honesty Ginky would have no chance whatsoever"
So did he run the 334? I wasn't there so I can't say but I think it was possible.


Bobby

 

[Blackjack]

how did the 400 end? you were 8 balls into the rack,,,,,,,

I'm pretty sure he missed. lol

Most of my triple digit runs have come on tougher equipment. I seem to concentrate better when the pockets are tighter. I feel that it slows me down a bit and forces me to step it up a notch. I believe that the key to any high run is table management. I see many players trying to splatter the balls every where on their break shots. I don't believe that is necessary. I always try to make proper contact with the rack, and if I need to set up a secondary breakshot I will try to identify what I need to do early in the rack and move towards acomplishing it. Cisero Murphy told me a long time ago that reading the rack is just as important as running the rack. I was taught to identify my break shot possibilities early on, and to re-read the rack after every shot. That works for me and it works very well.

In March of 2000 I was blessed with a run of 212 balls. When my run finally ended, it was because I forgot about the rules I just mentioned. I made poor contact with the rack on a break shot and I was unable to really do much and it was all down hill from there. I don't see high runs like that all the time. Most of my runs average in the 55-65 range. Every so often I'll hit a gear that gets me a bit more and more times than not it is because I got some pretty good rolls along the way - that always helps too!

 

[sjm]

On a side note, I hope someone can get an accurate high run for Jack Colavita. What a player he was.

In my presence, Jack Colavita ran about 245 against a rock solid shortstop named George Pharo at the Golden Q in Queens. I recall Jack indicating it was his all-time high. My best guess is that the run occurred in either 1985 or 1986. Perhaps he ran more than that at a later date, but, if so, I never heard about it.

I've heard a few suggest that Babe Cranfield may have had more 300 ball runs than any other player in history. He is reputed to have run over 700 in practice..........twice.

New York City's best straight pooler of the last thirty years may well have been Pete Margo of Staten Island, but I have no idea what his high run is.

 

[bruin70]

Hopefully I will run 200 when I am practicing for the 14.1 event .



- Steve

....but no one'll be there, s.........................

 

[bruin70]

I'm pretty sure he missed. lol

hmmmmmmmmm,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,YEP!,,, i think you're right.

 

[bud green]

Schmidt should definately find someone to put that 200+ run he has on tape onto a dvd. Even if the video quality is crappy, a lot of people would enjoy watching it.

What is the highest run ever taped ?

**Just remembered that Freddie the Beard posted that Sailor Barge ran 356 on a 5 x 10 which is pretty incredible. I think Dennis Hatch also ran 300+ when was only 20 or 21.

 

[dmgwalsh]

Oliver Ortmann has a high run of 326.

 

[Gerry]

I'll appologize if my Efren clain is wrong, but I sent an E-mail to my friend that reported the feat to me. Maybe I remember it wrong, it may have been at Tacony Billiards, and not Feasterville, or South Philly.....Gerry

 

[bruin70]

does anyone see a correlation twixt a14.1 high run and general pool playing ability in general? seems to me that level that one must attain to play with the big boys(9ball as well) is 300+. of course we have to take in account that a lot of 9ball players just don't bother with 14.1, so they have no "true" high run to speak of. but if they devoted enough time, i think their high runs would turn out to be a pretty good measure of their skills in general.

"C" players - 30's,,,"B" players - 40-50's,,,,,"A" players start at around 90-100. open level starts at about 170-180. 250-260 seems to identify those "pro" players. and it seems the REALLY top players have popped WELL ABOVE 300. and then you have those 14.1 ONLY players who's high runs don't mirror their 9ball speed. of course you have to add consistancyto the mix,,,,,,,, but i think high runs are a pretty good indicator.

 

[pete lafond]

I thought I'd heard on Dallas Wests' 100 ball run tape that he'd run 468, but I could be wrong.

Babe Cranfield probably should be on the list somewhere.

I can remember Babe running many 300 + when I used to play him 2 or three times a week. Someone here posted that he ran 800+ once. Ran a group one day and continued the next day without practice in between.

he was a machine....

 

[Donovan]

hey rude dog long time no see,anyway it took me just over three hours and as some of you know i play fairly quick at 14.1.as far as my next highest i ran 285 on a fairly loose diamond ,i also ran 282 three days after the400 and got that on home video.ive run over 200 around 23or24 times i forget, but my best runs were all done on new cloth clean ball and big pockets if any one is interested in those details.my highest 10 runs are this. 400,285,282,268,240,236,224,224,217,215. and then ive run between 200 and 214 about 15 more times. funny thing is i must dog it because ive run between 190and 199 around 10 times and missed lol must be thinking about the 200. anyway it was fun bragging a little with you guys hope that answers some of you questions about my 14.1 practice. one more thing that im proud of is almost everyone of those runs especially the 400 had lots of people see the entire run.anyway bye for now john schmidt

Umm, did you just say you had the 282 on video? Where can we get a prirated copy of this? REALLY though, can we buy a copy of this from you John? I don't really care what quality the video is in. I think it would be great to watch and even better if you could do commentery over it for us to learn by! Thanks in advance for any replies.

 

[Mike_Mason]

Zuglan (and others) had opportunities...

In reply to Mike Zuglan not continuing a run when the match was finished...

I'm a witness (and occasional victim) to quite a few of those Zuglan fantastic finishes. In my experience, it wasn't unusual for a player to stop play when the match was finished, no matter what kind of run he was on. In fact, that player would have been considered rude or a show off...not to mention taking up valuable table time that the TD could use to continue match play. And in fact the TD would hardly allow it.

Seems to me that most, if not all, high runs that are higher than the score needed to win a match must have been done during an exhibition or practice.

And when you need only 125 or 150 points to win a match, many runs of 100 or a little less might have turned into something glorious if the fans, other players, and TD would have preferred to see an exhibition in the middle of a tournament.

Cheers...

 

[cueball1950]

I have to agree. i have watched Mike play numerous times along with alot of other great players and i have to beleive Mike when he states that he ran just enough to win. Mike never practices or hits balls at all. Alot of people would be shocked to know what Mike really thinks of pool these days. Mike would rather promote this beautiful game if he could survive than hit another ball. But what the heck. You gotta do what ya gotta do......mike

 

[Bobby]

Schmidt should definately find someone to put that 200+ run he has on tape onto a dvd. Even if the video quality is crappy, a lot of people would enjoy watching it.

What is the highest run ever taped ?

**Just remembered that Freddie the Beard posted that Sailor Barge ran 356 on a 5 x 10 which is pretty incredible. I think Dennis Hatch also ran 300+ when was only 20 or 21.

Yeah I heard Hatch was 20 when he ran 360 balls. That guy had and still has IMO the ability to be a dominant player I guess his head gets in the way.

 

[jwpretd]

Regarding Cranfield, the Syracuse, NY Hall of Fame claims

High Runs: 492 - 488; Over 35 Runs of 400

http://www.syracusehalloffame.com/pages/inductees/1987/arthur_babe_cranfield.html

For people who want more details, it should be easy enough to ask Laurence Moy.

 

[Gerry]

Well, Here's the E-mail I recieved today from the guy I heard it from. Take it for what it is, and He's more than reliable, and not one to spin yarns...

Gerry,
Congrats on the new table. Never played on one of the them. I'm sure it will play real good. Don't forget to relevel the table about three weeks after you set it up. That will give all the parts of the table a chance to settle into place.
What I had heard was that Efren was up around 350 when his backer got bored and wanted to go eat. Lets not forget that all the crowns in tacony are triple shims!
Even if Efren would have kept going and beat Mosconi's record it would not have counted. Remember Willie's record was set while putting on a show. Who knows how many he ran while playing himself.
Hopefully we will be down this spring to beat, I mean play, you on your new table.



Gerry.

 

[bud green]

Didn't Willie claim to have run more than 526 a some point. Obviously, it wasn't official but I tried to find some info in his bio "Willie's Game" and failed.

I thought he'd claimed to run 609 or something similar. Cranfield supposedly ran 689 or something crazy. Does anyone have the official un-official numbers?