Terry Bell and Larry Hubbard started Texas Express 9-Ball - APA Pool League.
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Old School 2 Pushout 9 Ball
- Thread starter Charlie Hustle
- Start date
I believe they came after the McDermott Tour guys as I recall, but one certainly adopted from the other. I do remember Terry and Larry touting it to their members.
You may be right - APA started in 79. I’m not sure when the McDermott Tour started?
Interesting. I am told this was to make Pool more TV appealing.
Looking back at the old rules, some richness seems to have left with the changes.
middleofnowhere
Registered
In general push out you could push anytime from what I remember.
I think it had a lot to do with guys putting together strings. Opposition doesn't like being confined to the chair, only to rise to a dead lock.
I heard that. Here is my take.
If the 9-ball changes were done to cater to a TV audience, that assumption may have failed because Pool is rarely on TV anymore.
It is on YouTube and its available in quantity so few people who aren't players pay something to view it.
It's my opinion that give the relatively few views we get for Pool ( based on 1/2 cent per view YouTube pay), I would say that providing
entertainment to those that actually watch Pool should be more important than the reason that the game was changed to start with
because the reason it was changed has all but gone away. Only Pool people watch Pool for the most part, so we aren't going to magically
create new viewers with this new fangled/now old fangled way of playing 9-ball.
Why not create richer content for Pool viewers? Instead of watching them robotically run racks?
Good point.
Push out faded because better players dominated a game that required more strategy, knowledge & skill. The players that could move would win in a game that was better, more enjoyable, and I’d argue funner to watch - if two skilled players matched up. The game is now faster easier to run league play, and gives the “casual” player a luckier chance. In turn benefits bars operators, & industry - the ones with the power to decide. Like most rule changes top players are not the driving force. It about making the game more profitable for people in power. Just like jump cues, carbon fiber shafts, or polished balls, if it sell a product then it sticks even if it stinks.
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You have a point. At the amateur level in leagues going to push out, would lengthen games and make getting done that night a problem.
The first televised tournament to use Texas Express rules was the 1982 Caesars Tahoe Classic. When Richie Florence (the promoter) told me about the new rules he would be using I argued strenuously against them. I was his TD. How can you make a ball, scratch and not put the ball back up! All balls stay down, even on a foul! One foul, BIH! I thought he was crazy.
It was all about shortening the matches (Race to Nine) for TV. We only had a one hour window, which in the 1980's meant 48 minutes of air time. As it was all of the matches that were televised (three matches) still had to be edited to fit this time frame. Earl played Mizerak in the finals and I was the stage manager for ESPN. When Earl jumped a full ball with his playing cue and ran out, that changed pool forever! He won $33,000 plus a new car valued at $15,000. A huge payday back then.
From then on we had three or four big money (25K on top or more) tournaments every year. Nothing like we see today. Progress was slow to happen in professional pool and I often thought we would never get there. Matchroom and the WPA has changed all that. A pro player can actually make a good living for the first time since I've been around. And that's a long while.
Pretty close together. Definitely one influenced the other.
Thanks for the historical catchup on this.
Getting done in some semblance of predictable time is important as Pool Leagues need to finish and get people home
that go to work the next day. Pool Leagues have become the conduit to people looking to recreate that spend money in
places that have Pool Tables. Maybe one day there will be a stronger connection from league play to the pro sport, but now that
isn't their cup of tea, but pleasing customers is. The places that I see making it have a huge league base and matches 4 to 5 nights a week.
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Which is silly.
I like the idea of attempt to hit/ 2 consecutive misses is BIH and traditional push-out seems like a weak way to avoid responsibility for the shot you've been given.
Biloxi Boy
Man With A Golden Arm
But given, however, in full knowledge and with calculation it might come back on you. "Am I going to get this back?" was most times an ameliorating factor.
i don know who invented texas or first played it. but
the jansco brothers where the ones that "changed" old style 9 ball to texas express.
after johnston city it started to become the norm in tournaments and soon all over in the pool rooms. as they seem to follow what the tournaments do.
in any case it ruined gambling at 9 ball in pool rooms.
and raised the bar for top pros in tournaments as now they had to learn to hook players perfectly , jump balls, and play high level safes.
the jansco brothers where the ones that "changed" old style 9 ball to texas express.
after johnston city it started to become the norm in tournaments and soon all over in the pool rooms. as they seem to follow what the tournaments do.
in any case it ruined gambling at 9 ball in pool rooms.
and raised the bar for top pros in tournaments as now they had to learn to hook players perfectly , jump balls, and play high level safes.
middleofnowhere
Registered
The problem is though the guy who just nick the ball and put you behind another ball playing safe when he has actually has a shot that could be made.
I've been watching some of the current matches and these guys are unwilling to shoot at anything. All they do is play safe trying to get ball in hand. I guess that's smart but it's not very pleasant to watch.
I asked my father about this version of 9B and he mentioned it was really for the gambling crowd. Because straight pool was still the game, someone came up with those rules because the people playing it felt it eliminated some luck that is associated with 9B while keeping the 14.1 guys involved.
If you ask me, I'm enjoying the version of 9 ball being played in the 1989 tournament that AccuStats is uploading to their YouTube channel. And that's because that's how I played it growing up in Washington heights, NYC:
One ball on the spot. If there's a scratch on the break, any balls that went down get spotted with the incoming player having ball in hand behind the line. Maybe it's only me, but I really enjoy watching that version of 9 ball compared to what we see in tournament play today.
If you ask me, I'm enjoying the version of 9 ball being played in the 1989 tournament that AccuStats is uploading to their YouTube channel. And that's because that's how I played it growing up in Washington heights, NYC:
One ball on the spot. If there's a scratch on the break, any balls that went down get spotted with the incoming player having ball in hand behind the line. Maybe it's only me, but I really enjoy watching that version of 9 ball compared to what we see in tournament play today.
We played push out only on the shot after the break. Scratch and ball spots. Ball in hand in the kitchen.
I remember playing that version then when I went places some of them would be playing players choice to shoot if you had to kick at a ball and didn't make contact. That was the 9-ball game I grew up with.