Perfect Stroke = No Stroke?

Patrick Johnson said:
What if we could just aim our cue like a rifle with the tip at the contact point and instead of stroking it simply pull a trigger to shoot it at any preset CB speed? Would taking the stroke out of the equation mean more accuracy/consistency or less refinement/creativity?

If your only motive is winning, fun or not, is the stroke an advantage or a drawback?

pj
chgo
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Here you go:

 
Any one ever watch Marco Fu? Virtually no movement until he pulls the cue back, for the one time swing / cue action.
 
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Patrick Johnson said:
What if we could just aim our cue like a rifle with the tip at the contact point and instead of stroking it simply pull a trigger to shoot it at any preset CB speed? Would taking the stroke out of the equation mean more accuracy/consistency or less refinement/creativity?

If your only motive is winning, fun or not, is the stroke an advantage or a drawback?

pj
chgo
Click to expand...
Fun question! I think "less creativity" but a perfect mechanical cue would be a superb teaching aid, for example, teaching a new player how to aim.
 
Wu Jiaqing (fka Wu Chia-Ching) stroke has changed a bit after he started playing Chinese 8 ball. It seems more compact and robotic unless he really needs to let his stroke out.

In 2015 at the CBSA Pool International 9-Ball Open:
In 2019 at the China Open:
In 2025 playing Duya Golden Nine:
 
kingwang said:
Wu Jiaqing (fka Wu Chia-Ching) stroke has changed a bit after he started playing Chinese 8 ball. It seems more compact and robotic unless he really needs to let his stroke out.

In 2015 at the CBSA Pool International 9-Ball Open:
In 2019 at the China Open:
In 2025 playing Duya Golden Nine:
Click to expand...
the stroke on the 9 ball from 2025 looked like a full stroke to me
 
bbb said:
I’m not sure I agree with that
You see many top players today taking full back swings close to the bridge hand and doing well with the tight pockets
Chris Meling and fedor Gorst come to mind
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Yeah imop a long back swing to deliver consistently and easily acceleration with a finish to the stroke (ie hand to chest) making a short penetration through cb is def more accurate an consistent and more compact

Than a long backswing with a long loose elbow dropping stroke where the tip penetrates the cb well past 8-10/12” etc.

Even if you change that last paragraph to a short backswing you now have to contend with building up much more acceleration when needed into a shorter distance…creating way more chance for error due to torque required. Then finishing long
Neither once of those two are really compact at all.

No matter how short a back swing or delivery is, if it’s got lateral sway in it “fishtailing”…is not compact imop. Well at least not the compactness that could be beneficial lol
 
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ShootingArts said:
You have a point but take a look at Stephen? Hendry, snooker playing legend. A long pause before the last forward stroke and it is tight and compact. Snooker players in general seem to have a medium stroke best of my recollection. Not real short or long.

I think one of the biggest flaws pool players of lower skill levels have is too long of a bridge and stroke. Most, including me, would be far better off with a shorter stroke. The man that sorta mentored me for a few years recommended a four to six inch closed bridge and a short stroke. He was a very solid shortstop. I think I would compromise at an eight or ten inch bridge for most shots. Old and lazy, I sometimes use a very long bridge just to avoid walking.

Hu
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I seem to remember reading that Mark Selby moved up from being a jobbing professional to one of the real monsters on the pro snooker circuit when he shortened his stroke (although it is still one of the longer ones). [Edit - I should say that I cannot now find any evidence to back this up]. And Steve Davis said recently that the biggest improvements that most amateurs can make is to shorten their bridge.

It could be that some players have an overly long final backswing because they need the time during this phase to mentally prepare to deliver the cue. If so, then they might want to follow Allison Fisher's lead: she said that the biggest improvement to her game came when she slowed her backswing down. (Logically, this would provide the necessary final preparation time in a shorter stroke.)
 
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Patrick Johnson said:
What if we could just aim our cue like a rifle with the tip at the contact point and instead of stroking it simply pull a trigger to shoot it at any preset CB speed? Would taking the stroke out of the equation mean more accuracy/consistency or less refinement/creativity?

If your only motive is winning, fun or not, is the stroke an advantage or a drawback?

pj
chgo
Click to expand...
Not sure that I am directly answering the question, but.... I sometimes practice playing without using any rehearsal strokes. So I place the cue, pull it back and fire. The reason I do this is that it encourages me to prepare (aim, align, visualize etc) properly, both when I am standing behind the line and as I get down.

But to the extent that I perform well when using this approach, does the benefit come from this early preparation, or from cutting out something unhelpful in the rehearsal strokes? I suspect the former but I can't prove it.

I also find that when I get down right, when I look up after placing my bridge hand, I 'see' the shot very quickly. When that happens, I just don't feel the need for practice strokes. Just a couple of very short rehearsals (about an inch), and I am good to go.
 
Siz said:
Not sure that I am directly answering the question, but.... I sometimes practice playing without using any rehearsal strokes. So I place the cue, pull it back and fire. The reason I do this is that it encourages me to prepare (aim, align, visualize etc) properly, both when I am standing behind the line and as I get down.

But to the extent that I perform well when using this approach, does the benefit come from this early preparation, or from cutting out something unhelpful in the rehearsal strokes? I suspect the former but I can't prove it.

I also find that when I get down right, when I look up after placing my bridge hand, I 'see' the shot very quickly. When that happens, I just don't feel the need for practice strokes. Just a couple of very short rehearsals (about an inch), and I am good to go.
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It may depend how old you are. As we age, our "postural sway" increases, and maintaining fixed position against gravity when down on a shot becomes more difficult. The quick release may get your shot off before you drift off course.
 
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Not Dead Ted said:
It may depend how old you are. As we age, our "postural sway" increases, and maintaining fixed position against gravity when down on a shot becomes more difficult. The quick release may get your shot off before you drift off course.
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Also fatigue affecting the bracing of the back and shoulder can be an issue if you down on the shot for a long time. But it is not only posture that can deteriorate with age; also concentration.

Not giving yourself time to mentally get in your own way can be helpful also, especially under pressure. I suspect that this behind Tony Drago's fast play. When he was an amateur snooker player in the 1980's, he didn't play any faster than anyone else. But when he turned pro, and it became all about pressure, he sped up.
 
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